Need Subsoiler Info

[Newmicon]

Hey there,

I am going to start planting grapes, looking at 10ish acres.

One of the major attachments I am looking at for my tractor is a subsoiler. However I know little about the requirements on the tractor.

Typical information. How much HP does my tractor need for each length blade? How heavy/big does my tractr have to be? etc...

Are there any threads/guides out there explaining them? I did a quick search out there and couldn't find what I was looking for.

Thanks,

Mike

 

[gabby]

Subsoilers pull hard. I have bogged down my 85 hp 7610 pulling a single shank about 16 inches deep in dry soil.

Depends on depth, type of soil, and moisture content.

Ironically, subsoiling does the most good when it's dry because the hardpan shatters, but that requires max hp and dry soil wears out the subsoiler point much faster. You can feel it jerking the tractor as it breaks the hardpan into clods.

 

[Newmicon]

I was looking in only getting a tractor that was 44 hp.

I'm assuming I'll have to upgrade the power a little bit (quite a bit)?

 

[Doc_Bob]

I was looking in only getting a tractor that was 44 hp.

I'm assuming I'll have to upgrade the power a little bit (quite a bit)?

Rent the required horsepower if you will never need the HP in the future.

 

[Glowplug]

Rent the required horsepower if you will never need the HP in the future.

Yeah, what he said. It is really rare that you need to use a subsoiler. When you do you don't need it that often. Maybe only every few years. A subsoiler is not for plowing or cutting furrows, it's for breaking up hardpan. Think of a butter knife cutting through butter. Now, that's NOT what you want. Think of a butter knife pressed hard on a cookie shattering it into several pieces. Now THAT'S what you want. I would see about having someone come out and subsoil it once and only when needed. If you get that big of a tractor you MAY find that it's cumbersome for the other 99.9% of the tasks you need it for.

 

[backdoor]

Are you using the subsoiler to break the soil deeply in the rows where the vines will be planted, or between the rows, or both. Some of the growers around here use subsoilers to break the rows where the vines will go. Seems like grapes have a real deep root system. I don't know what they do in older vineyards. Anyway, subsoilers with a shank that curves forward sharply will pull easier than one with a straight shank. If you look at pictures of 5 to 7 shank V-plows you will see what I mean. I have a single footed subsoiler made from a V-plow point, and I pull it in very hard dry soil with a 33HP tractor, but it does pull very hard. Put your seat belt on while you use it. I will add that my tractor weighs about 5000 lbs., with a 158 CI motor, that weight and size helps a lot.

 

[Newmicon]

Both.

Of course for the ground prep but a lot of wineries seem to be going in between the rows every other year to promote downward growth of the roots.

How deep is your subsoiler for your 33HP tractor?
Do you have a model number?

I'd prefer not to rent since I plan on planting quite a bit, but if it is the only option. I was hoping I could do at least 'some' subsoiling with the Kubota L4400HST that I was planning on buying which is about the size that I will need for my everyday jobs.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Soil type/soil conditions will dictate how much power and how deep and how fast you can pull a subsoiler. I've got a Fred Cain heavy duty single shank subsoiler that I can pull at 4 to 4-1/2MPH behind a 47 hp/5100 lb 2wd tractor without too much strain on the tractor, at 20" to 24" deep. (any deeper and you're likely to get into solid limestone around here) I've had it behind a 60 HP/7500 lb 2wd tractor and moved along at speeds above 5mph.

As was mentioned, subsoilers do their job better when soils are a bit on the dry side. (late fall is best) In wet conditions, you simply rip a single narrow groove. That "heals" back and in no time, you've wasted the effort. Dry ground shatters. Too dry requires huge amounts of power and wears the subsoiler.

 

[Newmicon]

Thanks for all the info.
My soil is a Sandy Loam.

For now I'll stick with my initial tractor size. Been looking online and should be able to find a used subsoiler with a single shank for a few hundred bucks.

I'll play around with that and rent later if need be.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Thanks for all the info.
My soil is a Sandy Loam.

For now I'll stick with my initial tractor size. Been looking online and should be able to find a used subsoiler with a single shank for a few hundred bucks.

I'll play around with that and rent later if need be.

Where ya located? (probably not very close.... Not much sand/loam here in Central Kentucky ) I've got a good one I'm thinking about selling. At the very least, you could try it on for size. (Single shank Fred Cain brand, in like new condition)

 

[backdoor]

My subsoiler is shop made by a welder here. I had a point from a 5 point V-plow that we fixed up. It goes about 2 feet deep, I never really measured it. We have sandy loam soil here for about 10-12 inches, then clay loam for at least 6-8 feet. I build houses and the basements are almost always the same-slightly sandy brown for the first foot, then red dirt usually to the bottom of the basement hole. Not much limestone, just white flint rocks of any size, including some that you just have to work around. If the land is dry enough to shatter like it should when I subsoil it, I usually can only work at 2-2 and one half MPH. Tractor gets real jerky, and if I hang a rock of any size at all, I get a dead stop. 1st or 2nd gear is plenty fast enough for me. USDA calls this sandy loam, but if I plow in the spring, by fall the ground is very hard again. Like the other guys said, you do the best job when the dirt is so dry that the subsoiler just will go in the ground. Hope this helps.

 

[backdoor]

I guess after you get your vines in you wouldn't want to subsoil when the ground was very dry, breaking up the topsoil anywhere near the vines may not be a good idea if the clumps of dry dirt push over against the vines. But subsoiling out in the rows anytime will help loosen the dirt to catch rainwater. Lots of farmers around here subsoil around pasture hillsides to help hold water.

 

[Newmicon]

FarmwithJunk,

Just got around to updating my profile.

I'm up in Prince Edward Island, Canada.

Gas prices these days might be tough to get down to your place

Maybe someday for a vacation.