New to tractors ford 1700 question.

[BG4985]

JC- Sorry it took so long to get back to you, been busy with work projects
Cold reading is 12.45
Idle 1500rpm is 12.34
Mid 2000rpm is 12.36
2500rpm is 12.36
I also disconnected the battery with it running, which killed all the headlights/gauges instantly.

With it connected all the high/low & dash work fine. The largest yellow (one closest to the engine and the top) wire had a reading of 12.43 right at the Alt. The only other wire that i got any reading off of was the bottom of the pair that is on the lower outside of the Alt, it had a reading of 12.12

I printed up the other posts you linked earlier but wanted to check back with the above info. On the up side i did manage to get the bushhog primed up, now i just have to pick between the white or ford blue.

 

[JC-jetro]

JC- Sorry it took so long to get back to you, been busy with work projects
Cold reading is 12.45
Idle 1500rpm is 12.34
Mid 2000rpm is 12.36
2500rpm is 12.36
I also disconnected the battery with it running, which killed all the headlights/gauges instantly.

With it connected all the high/low & dash work fine. The largest yellow (one closest to the engine and the top) wire had a reading of 12.43 right at the Alt. The only other wire that i got any reading off of was the bottom of the pair that is on the lower outside of the Alt, it had a reading of 12.12

I printed up the other posts you linked earlier but wanted to check back with the above info. On the up side i did manage to get the bushhog primed up, now i just have to pick between the white or ford blue.

BG,

Below is to self note I had last year I measured voltages right after battery replacement. I had a dead cell in it.

After Battery change 11/1/09, put a trickle charger on, Regulator on the alternator works okay, charging @14.6 volts and 1500 rpm. Static voltage reading on the new battery 12.98 volts.

one of the guys had a question and couple of weeks ago I checked max charging voltage.Even @ 2500 rpm the voltage did not go beyond 14.6.

I think 12.4 is somewhat low of charging voltage. You might consider replacing your voltage regulator. I have not done it myself, but remember Soundguy saying you can pick one up from NAPA under $25.

JC,

Glad things are looking up

 

[BG4985]

Roger that on the voltage reg..... does the alt sound like its working to you then? I thought that someone had said that if the headlights/dashlights didnt work after disconnecting the battery on a running engine then the ALT was bad. Im guessing by your response though that this is not the case and its possibly just the voltage regulator which would not be allowing enough current back to the battery while its running?

One more question, is there any damage that is being done to the tractor or is it still safe to simple trickle charge the battery, start it and run it with the faulty regulator until i get it switched out? Thanks for your help

 

[old1500]

U can also get a good solid state voltage regulator off e-bay for a few bucks. Some of these things cross over to all manner of other vehicles and not just tractor specific.

Two cheap-n-dirty ways to check your alternator, other than with the meter as explained above.

With the tractor running, switch your key off and on and then off and on...etc. If the alternator is charging, you should hear a slight load coming onto the motor as you turn the switch from off to on. Or, again with the tractor running...you should be able to take a screwdriver or small wrench and hold it to the end of the alternator (be careful of the wires and the spinning belt) and feel the attraction (magnetism) of a working alternator.

This does not guarantee a bad alternator, because it needs to receive an exciter voltage from the regulator. But it will give you an indication that it is charging. If you change the regulator and then do this test indicating bad results...I would take the alternator in and have it tested anyway before I purchased a new one. I think you can almost buy a new one for the cost of having one rebuilt. That would be off e-bay again....I think a dealer wants $400-$500 for one of theirs.

To answer your other question....I don't think you will hurt a thing leaving the charger on it. I had a voltage regular go "over voltage" once charging at almost 17-volts. By the time I got it shut off, I had blown both headlights. They can go bad both ways!

 

[JC-jetro]

Roger that on the voltage reg..... does the alt sound like its working to you then? I thought that someone had said that if the headlights/dashlights didnt work after disconnecting the battery on a running engine then the ALT was bad. Im guessing by your response though that this is not the case and its possibly just the voltage regulator which would not be allowing enough current back to the battery while its running?

One more question, is there any damage that is being done to the tractor or is it still safe to simple trickle charge the battery, start it and run it with the faulty regulator until i get it switched out? Thanks for your help

Alternator should be checked for out put current and the type of current (AC or DC). Alternating current needs to be rectified (changed) to Direct current in order to change a DC battery. Changing AC to DC is done by a diode (sort of one way valve). some times the diode is external to the alternator and many are internal. Suggestion above does not verify if the diode is bad or good. There are tester that you can buy that detects bad diode on an alternator without dis assembly. I think you are okay for now. No problem to put a trickle charge with the battery leads still attached to. That's what I did all winter last year. Since diesel does not have ignition system, you will be be able to tun it without even battery but the problem is your gauges and safety will not work. I would not recommend it at all.

For the time being trickle charge will charge it enough to start it , run it and have enough juice for the gauges.... I would make sure I would not use head lights, tail light and things that consume much energy.

JC,

 

[BG4985]

35bucks delivered for the new reg...so ill let you know how it goes in a few days!

 

[zizzy]

i just purchased a 1700 with few hours on it.
i need to find a replacement flasher switch (this item is like a hens tooth)
any help on where to look

 

[JC-jetro]

i just purchased a 1700 with few hours on it.
i need to find a replacement flasher switch (this item is like a hens tooth)
any help on where to look

Congrats, well what a coincidence . I just happened to do the same. It is just an on/off switch. the connector has 3 prongs but 2 is used. I basically abandoned the old switch in place to cover the hole in the dash. There is is previously a hole drilled next to temp gauge that had a cover , took the cover off and used a good quality automotive switch under $5 and put it together. Could not be simpler. Pics below are self explanatory.

JC,

 

[zizzy]

Jettro
thanks for the information on type of switch.
i can do the mod you outlined with pix as well very nice and appreciated !
thot mabbe the switch had the timer for flasher in it but if just on/off that is great. doing all the lub changes to fluids to day thank you so much
de Zizzy

 

[old1500]

JC....while I have your attention. I know there are some other threads concerning this, but I like to "cross-thread".

This 1500 I have has the foot-lever on the rh side to engage the diffy lock. It's just like the little Kubota I had....but, when I got this tractor, I noticed the lever was flat on the floor board and would not move by hand. I got around to prying it up with a screwdriver and can now "work it" and hear a definite clunking sound when I move it up and down. The best I can tell from the drawings, this lever moves a shift fork which is (I think) attached to a clutch-gear in the diffy guts. I have been riding around with this thing in the down (engaged) position since I had it and have noticed no torn turf or anything that would lead me to think it has locked.

I can't move it for a few days, as I am installing a new steering sector shaft (I am a slow-poke mechanic). What surprises do you think I am in for when I finally roll it and see what that diffy lock lever really does.....or is not doing. It'd been all the way down for a long....long time.

 

[JC-jetro]

JC....while I have your attention. I know there are some other threads concerning this, but I like to "cross-thread".

This 1500 I have has the foot-lever on the rh side to engage the diffy lock. It's just like the little Kubota I had....but, when I got this tractor, I noticed the lever was flat on the floor board and would not move by hand. I got around to prying it up with a screwdriver and can now "work it" and hear a definite clunking sound when I move it up and down. The best I can tell from the drawings, this lever moves a shift fork which is (I think) attached to a clutch-gear in the diffy guts. I have been riding around with this thing in the down (engaged) position since I had it and have noticed no torn turf or anything that would lead me to think it has locked.

I can't move it for a few days, as I am installing a new steering sector shaft (I am a slow-poke mechanic). What surprises do you think I am in for when I finally roll it and see what that diffy lock lever really does.....or is not doing. It'd been all the way down for a long....long time.

Old,

Your observation is correct. The diffy lock pedal should stay up during normal condition. Either one of the rear wheel will engage due to the traction needed when the lever is up. I can later take the look at the guts of diffy but my cursory look at it is the same of what you found. Up and down motion of foot lever moves the shifter fork left and right to engage or dis engage. For sure you had both wheel locked, I would think it stresses out the mechanism if during all the turns one wheel is forced to slip, probably on dirt might not be so bad buy on pavement would not be a good thing. I have not needed to use it often, that clanking noise when I engage is noticeable. I too had a bot difficulty to raise the lever up after engaging it. Instead of prying it to submission I changed the gear to reverse and moved a few inches backward and on every occasion it jumped to normal position. I have not read this in Owner's manual but I think it might be the way to do it. Give a try and let us know.

JC,

 

[JC-jetro]

Jettro
thanks for the information on type of switch.
i can do the mod you outlined with pix as well very nice and appreciated !
thot mabbe the switch had the timer for flasher in it but if just on/off that is great. doing all the lub changes to fluids to day thank you so much
de Zizzy

Zizy,

I too thought the switch was a bit more sophisticated specialty seeing the 3 prong connector, only by closer observation I saw only two wires going to flasher switch. I took the switch off and bench tested it with a test light/ continuity meter just to verify it. The extra punched out hole was about a 2 mm smaller in dia needed so I ended up using a uni-bit to just enlarge it a tad to get the new switch in. I cut off flush the old switch stem that was broken off and filed it smooth... now it just covers the hole.

JC,

 

[BG4985]

That same hole that you guys are using for your flashers is the same one that I used for my glow plug race switch. Arent we glad they put it there for us!

Cut my prop this morning after installing the new volt reg, and cleaning all the terminals with the wire brush.....but the light is still on, so im guessing the next step will be to take the alt in to be tested. (old- i didnt hear it making any more or less noise with the off/on trick. And like you im a slow fixer upper.)

Good news is the only thing that im running off the battery is the temp gauge and the sensors. So as long as i keep my trickle charger up i should be good until i get the charging issue taken care of.

 

[JC-jetro]

That same hole that you guys are using for your flashers is the same one that I used for my glow plug race switch. Arent we glad they put it there for us!

Cut my prop this morning after installing the new volt reg, and cleaning all the terminals with the wire brush.....but the light is still on, so im guessing the next step will be to take the alt in to be tested. (old- i didnt hear it making any more or less noise with the off/on trick. And like you im a slow fixer upper.)

Good news is the only thing that im running off the battery is the temp gauge and the sensors. So as long as i keep my trickle charger up i should be good until i get the charging issue taken care of.

BG,

I think you're just fine. I might have a portable battery that HF sells at the ready and use it normally just to see if the battery actually gets to the point that can't start the tractor. What was the charging voltage after the regulator change out? It takes 10 minutes to take the alt off the tractor and almost all part stores do an alt check for free.

JC,

 

[old1500]

I believe most of these things take a Hitachi alternator, which can be had for not much over $100. The terminal was burned off mine when I got the machine and I fully expected to have to get a new one, but I separated the cases and was able to install a new bolt from the back side and fix it.

Unlike some of you guys....I am making a stripped down hot-rod out of mine and could care less about flashers and lights. I took all that stuff off a long time ago. I do not expect to have it out on the highway or operate it much at night. (My wife has not taken my truck keys away....yet.) Mine may wind up looking like that old golf course Tractor Arnold Palmer use to talk about in the Pennzoil commercials. I want my stuff to run right and look good. Anything hanging off broken, or unnecessary comes off. I plan to add a manual oil pressure gauge just for kicks and my tachometer still works, which is cable driven anyway. All I need an alternator for is to charge my battery.

 

[BG4985]

Well after splitting the alt, i found that one of the small wires that went to the core was MIA, put a new wire on it and soldered it up and installed today. WHALA light went off and things were good until about 15 min later. Im guessing my half@ss solder didnt hold up (had to do it with plumbing solder), or the other side went out. Im going to resplit it and take some pics this time. They wanted almost 120 bucks for a replacement at the autopart store!

 

[old1500]

I am a little unclear when you say MIA. I know it means missing in action, but could you tell if it was burned away or just broken? If the same thing has happened and you find the wire burned or MIA again....it's possible that one of the windings is shorted, or the diode bank has issues.

Do this when you fix it again....make sure your battery is well charged. It will not place the full load on the alternator to recharge the battery.

I hope it's just your poor solder joint.....that was not a SA comment...it would just be good for you if that's all it was.

 

[JC-jetro]

Well after splitting the alt, i found that one of the small wires that went to the core was MIA, put a new wire on it and soldered it up and installed today. WHALA light went off and things were good until about 15 min later. Im guessing my half@ss solder didnt hold up (had to do it with plumbing solder), or the other side went out. Im going to resplit it and take some pics this time. They wanted almost 120 bucks for a replacement at the autopart store!

Cool BG,

I full heatedly suggest a full@rss solder jobby for the long term. Where you able to check the diode while you were at it.

JC,

 

[BG4985]

Well it wasnt my crappy job after all (this time , it was the other side wire, It looks like the wire just broke off at the tab, about 1/4'' is gone, just like the other side that i replaced the day before. On this one and the other side i couldnt see any signs of burning at all, just looked like a break, wire was bright and shiny at both breaks. Im guessing the diode was good because for the few minutes it was hooked up yesterday, the light went off right on cue and stayed off for at least 10-12 min...when i went back to shut off the tractor at 15 i noticed the light was now back on. I did notice that the material wrapping the wire on the center was starting to break apart on one side.

 

[old1500]

Over time, wire will become brittle under load and heat. The by-product of electrical current running through a wire is heat. Those things will get hot...feel of it the next time it runs for a while. The insulation will also break-down in the process. I have a 1980 model 1500 and once in it's lifetime, somebody had changed the alternator and I can't say how old it is...like 10-15 years-or-so I would guess. I had to go into mine and replace the output stud and all my wiring looked pretty good. Insulation properties and wire alloys have improved greatly over the last 30-years, but once you get a lot of age on simple rubber-like insulation...it will disintegrate and the small copper wire will also. Your alternator has just "been away from the factory too long", or has been working to capacity for a long time. The alternator combined with the regulator forms a "smart system" that only puts out what current is necessary to perform the job it was intended to do. That is why you can get alternators rated for different output currents.

Your repairs may hold-up a while longer, but I would say that it is time to start looking for a bargain on a replacement unit.