Operating loader without rear ballast

[JoeL4330]

I didn't see mention of another loader-related reason for weighting the rear: If you are wanting to dig in with the bucket, your front wheels are often off the ground as you try to dig with a combination of curl and forward motion. Front wheels up puts max load on the bucket lip, which is usually good for digging and, with the fronts in the air, your forward motion depends on the traction from the rears (no matter you have 4wd) so you don't want the rears to spin too easily ...but, you do want them to break traction just before something else breaks, of course.

I think the issue about loading rears (via ballast and/or 3ph implement) has less to do with front bearings and more to do with efficiency and safety. Efficiency as per above, and safety having to do with having a rear wheel come up in the air as you try to lift that recalcitrant load slightly off center in the bucket. This will change your lateral stability and your pucker factor will zoom, especially in you are on a side-hill. This unequal lift is why many dealer willing to install a center bucket hook will advise against putting on hooks at each end which, if used singly rather than as a balanced pair, can be startling (ask me how I know ...now, my joystick hand is always pre-programmed to drop the bucket if...)

 

[RaydaKub]

=========
adding fluid to rear tires, or adding rear wheel weights. i do not see how could add more weight to front tires.
if anything front tires, would see total tractor weight (minus) not counting fluid in rear tires and/or rear wheel weights.
other words, tractor would still trying to do a front wheelie. but rear tires being held down, by fluid in rear tires and/or rear wheel weights. ok bad statement, fluid in rear tires, and/or rear wheel weight. is adding weight to the "rear fulcrum" and in that not adding any weight that is trying to be balanced out. errr that is completely not correct either. yikes it has been way to long since being in school. i done forgot the "depends" or the "except" words being repeatedly being said...

If you fill the tires, but it isn't enough to hold the rear end down yet, then when you lift with the loader and the rears take off, you have put the entire weight on the front axle, just as mentioned before, but now it is even heavier than it was when not filled. If they lift, it's all on the front. The only way is to counter it behind the rear axle. Even then, if it lifts, it's just that much heavier. You have to have enough back there (or far enough back) that it can't lift off the ground. Once you achieve that, you add even more and it starts to transfer weight back to the rear axle.

 

[LD1]

If you fill the tires, but it isn't enough to hold the rear end down yet, then when you lift with the loader and the rears take off, you have put the entire weight on the front axle, just as mentioned before, but now it is even heavier than it was when not filled. If they lift, it's all on the front. The only way is to counter it behind the rear axle. Even then, if it lifts, it's just that much heavier. You have to have enough back there (or far enough back) that it can't lift off the ground. Once you achieve that, you add even more and it starts to transfer weight back to the rear axle.

Precisely what I was trying to convey, just in different words:thumbsup:

 

[edlegault]

ok, two fulcrum points, but... you are still stressing the chassis.

 

[LD1]

ok, two fulcrum points, but... you are still stressing the chassis.

You stress the chassis every time you do anything with the tractor. That is why they are built and designed heavy enough to handle the stresses they are able to put on themselves

 

[john_bud]

You stress the chassis every time you do anything with the tractor. That is why they are built and designed heavy enough to handle the stresses they are able to put on themselves

Exactly. That's why two tractors with the same power but different weights
will have one out working the other.

 

[Beltzington]

I played the I don't need no stinking ballast game for a couple years. You will not believe the differance in lifting and moving any load with a few hundred pounds on your back. Just the better ride and control is well worth the couple hundred spent, not including getting rid of the pucker factor.

 

[RaydaKub]

Precisely what I was trying to convey, just in different words:thumbsup:

No doubt in my mind about that LD, but when they don't understand, ya gotta try 'splainin' in different.

 

[MF1433V]

I agree with LD1 and Raydakub

And special thanks to the artistry of Boggen for this jem that helped us understand what a tractor looks like - lol. Can I have this for my avatar?



Seriously, Boggen I want it!

 

[BIG DOOLEY]

I agree with LD1 and Raydakub

And special thanks to the artistry of Boggen for this jem that helped us understand what a tractor looks like - lol. Can I have this for my avatar?

View attachment 292924


Seriously, Boggen I want it!

Thanks BOGGEN
"boggen" tractor coloring fun on T B N
save the image and paste in paint
here is mine

 

[LD1]

but when they don't understand, ya gotta try 'splainin' in different.

Yep.:thumbsup:

 

[boggen]

I agree with LD1 and Raydakub

And special thanks to the artistry of Boggen for this jem that helped us understand what a tractor looks like - lol. Can I have this for my avatar?

View attachment 292924

Seriously, Boggen I want it!

use the noted picture to your hearts content, you asked, good enuf for me, to return the respect.

Thanks BOGGEN
"boggen" tractor coloring fun on T B N
save the image and paste in paint
here is mine
View attachment 292927View attachment 292929

wow! little bit of color. really made that pic! nice job!

 

[MF1433V]

Thanks BOGGEN
"boggen" tractor coloring fun on T B N
save the image and paste in paint
here is mine
View attachment 292927View attachment 292929

Wow nice work Big Dooley. I did mine in Red. I may add the back hoe not sure yet. The best thing about these is you can add ANY attachment you want!

 

[BIG DOOLEY]

Wow nice work Big Dooley. I did mine in Red. I may add the back hoe not sure yet. The best thing about these is you can add ANY attachment you want!

View attachment 293044

Yea!
Looking sharp
Maybe we could get boggen to draw some attachments?

 

[LD1]

. The best thing about these is you can add ANY attachment you want!

View attachment 293044

And for cheap too

 

[tthopskin@yahoo.ca]

if the tractor is a 4x4 just keep it in 4 wheel drive when you lift anything ..it will save your *** trust me been there done that

 

[LD1]

if the tractor is a 4x4 just keep it in 4 wheel drive when you lift anything ..it will save your *** trust me been there done that

Yes, 4wd is good to use no matter WHAT you lift. But it still isnt a safe substitute for proper ballast

 

[ilander]

The two fulcrum point explanation fits my experience. My JD510 is a 20,000 lb machine, and would guess roughly 90% of that weight is on the rear.

I like to use it to compact soil during construction projects. I heap the front bucket with gravel and to put more of that weight on the rear for compaction purposes the backhoe boom is lowered slightly with the stick extended outward so as to move most of the backhoe weight farther aft. There are times when the backhoe bucket is full of gravel too. What this does is transfers much of the gravel weight in the front bucket to the rear tires for more compaction. This is a two wheel drive unit, so if the front becomes too light to steer, the brakes can be used to assist the steering.

The whole point in this discussion, is adding and transferring weight to the rear has the tendency to lift the front.

 

[creekbend]

I am posting late in this thread. My dealer won't sell a new tractor with a FEL unless the rear tires have ballast. Just a thought.

 

[Eyecatcher]

OK! Here's my question. Want to use my EX450 for truck garden farming. If the rear tires are loaded, will this tend to compact the soil and negate the tilling process? Would it be better to load the rears or to fabricate a load box that could be picked up on the 3 point when using the FEL and dropped when farming?