Paintball field project; need advice on poles, etc

[Investorguy]

First, thanks for not laughing at my hobby. Paintball is one of the few sports that can be enjoyed by anyone age 10 to 60, and on a relatively level playing field.

Speaking of playing field, here is a picture of the portion of my field that I have set aside for paintball use.

The area you see is about 230 ft by 120 ft. I’m desiring to create a field that is about 240 by 160. Last year I plowed (borrowed a farmers HUGE ag tractor; did it all in about 8 minutes) tilled (many times) and planted the seed you see there. Aside from it being very spongy due to our typical rainy Washington winter, it’s coming along exactly how I hoped it would.

Now I need to hang netting around the entire area to protect onlookers, parents, etc. I would like to use 20 ft netting, but I don’t think that’s an option due to the high levels of wind so I figure I’m stuck with 12 foot netting. I’ll get a few bounce-overs, but it should be okay. My question for y’all is: how can I find cheap poles? I’ve priced some butt-treated, class 5, 30 ft utility poles and they are $250 each. If I went w/ 30 ft spacing I’d need 26 or so. That is a heckuvalotta money and more than I want to spend on poles, for sure. However, I don’t want to do it wrong and have to do it twice. I wonder if galvanized metal poles may be the answer? I’m assuming I’ll be able to set the 30 footers w/ my Kubota 3400 (combination of loader bucket and agile friends).

The problem is that we are in a pretty windy area and the 50% shade netting basically acts like a sale when the wind rips through here. I need to make sure this works. There’s really no one who “knows” this thing who I could consult with because paintball is still kind of an underground sport.

Also, do you know where I can find such poles cheaper? Any help is appreciated.

 

[Wesdor]

Haven't ever done paintball myself but it looks fun. What part of Washington are you in? I have some friends out there that might be able to give you some advice and cheap poles if you are near.

 

[Investorguy]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Haven't ever done paintball myself but it looks fun. What part of Washington are you in? I have some friends out there that might be able to give you some advice and cheap poles if you are near. )</font>

I'm in Northwest WA, about a 1/2 hour from the Canadian border (near Bellingham).

But I'm willing to travel for cheap poles and, of course, any advice is appreciate. I have a lot of minutes on my cell phone.

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[beenthere]

If the fence is to protect onlookers as you say, then I'd build the a 'people' fence to just keep them back beyond the fallout area (20 yards??) rather than the expense for aa high fence in the paintballs (that must take some pretty fine mesh fence).
Probably keeping it 'underground' would alleviate the fence expense too. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif (Whoops, sorry - wasn't supposed to laugh. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Around here the paintball guys don't build elaborate fields of play, but head for the woods, or put up obstacles in fields that have grown up to brush and weeds.

 

[Investorguy]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( If the fence is to protect onlookers as you say, then I'd build the a 'people' fence to just keep them back beyond the fallout area (20 yards??) rather than the expense for aa high fence in the paintballs (that must take some pretty fine mesh fence).
Probably keeping it 'underground' would alleviate the fence expense too. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif (Whoops, sorry - wasn't supposed to laugh. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Around here the paintball guys don't build elaborate fields of play, but head for the woods, or put up obstacles in fields that have grown up to brush and weeds. )</font>

Actually, I'm planning on putting up NETTING, not fencing. ASTM standards require 50% shad netting. Plus I've got 3 young kids who are gonna want to watch and I will need to keep them safe. I have an LLC set up for the field, but I'm not taking any chances. It's underground as far as the county is concerned (no permits for me) but it's a business to the IRS (gotta love section 179 depreciation).

Here's an example of what I'm going for:

As you can see, the bunkers are inflatable. In my opinion, this is best form of paintball. It's like a 5 minute moving chess match. It's a great workout and you get to shoot at people... what could be more fun?

Here's how another field handled the netting:

I feel like my wind would bend those poles right over. And I wouldn't know where to get those types of poles. A fence store maybe?

 

[rox]

This sounds like a fun project! I have never played paintball, but I would given an opportunity. We have quite a bit of nets, which we use for harveting olives. One tip I can pass along, we use bungee cords to attach the nets when we are working on a slope.
Kind of hard to expaline, when you shake the olives off the tree, you want the nets to be on flat ground or else the olives jsut roll downhill and off the nets. So we use bungee cord and bungee them up to anything, trees bushes. etc.

What you might want to consider is not leaving your nets up all the time. Just roll them up when done. When you want to play again, unroll and use bungee cords to attach to your posts. In this way you would minimize the exposure of your nets to high winds. Anybody who wnats to play, they an have a little bit of fun by putting up the nets and taking them down.

What type of netting are you onsidering and at what cost? Is there a link to a website you can provide?

I made my own bungee cords by buying cheap chain links, like to hold a hanging lamp, opening them up and using elastic cord that I bought by the meter. When I was home over Christmas I got the buy of a lifetime, at this kind of junk stor called Hobo, 30 bungee cords for $4. We snapped up several containers.

The fencing we use in olive harvesting is fairly heavy, heavy enough so that if you roll it up it isn't going anywhere in a wind. For our smaller nets we jsut throw a rock on them to anchor them to the ground overnight, and we have winds here, winds like you can't believe. Our winds even have names to them. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Good luck to you with your project, it sounds like a lot of fun to me.

I jsut had a thought on posts. Could you use PV, and telesope them? get a 4" PVC pipe say 5ft tall. Inside put a 3" PVC pipe 6ft tall. When you wnat to use, just pull the inside pipe up and stick a big cotter pin in some hoels you drill. In this way you only have wind exposure for 5ft (well atually 6ft). If I was going to play paintball I think it would be kind of fun to set up the playing field, gets your team working together before the fun starts. Plus you would be able to string the nets onto the poles and then raise the poles, which raises the nets, if you used telescopic poles.
Just some ideas for oyu to think about....

 

[Investorguy]

There is no way PVC would hold up in the wind. Just to give you an idea. I'm using 1/4 in cable to hold up the nets--steel cable. The pressure from wind will break netting and snap 4x4s sunk 4 ft into the ground spaced 20 feet apart. A tremendous amount of strength is needed. I'm going to need to use some sort of tie-down or earth anchor (yet another thing I know nothing about) to keep the tension on the cable/netting. I'll probably have to fork over for

 

[rox]

Here is a net manufacturer that i have corresponded with and coincidently they are in Washington.
http://redden-net.com/about-us.cfm
I bet they could give you a lot of information on poles as well.
They make penty of different sports nets.

If you call them, or drop them an e-mail, I am sure they would help you in your planning stages. I corresponded with Mark, Mike and Greg at Redden.

 

[Dk45_Jeff]

I think you'll find it much cheaper to change from 30' to 10' spacing between support post. Making that change will allow you to use much cheaper supports, even if you need 3 times as many they will be one tenth the unit cost. Another problem would be tensioning 30' of cable to remove the sag isn't going to be an easy thing to do. I think the least expensive long term method would be to build it like a chain link fence. If you can't find a cheap source of pipe long enough for the 12' height, you could weld sections of standard length together.

Something else to consider is that on the fields I've played only allow spectators on one or two sides of the speedball fields. Doing that could allow you to put up just a standard rail fence on the other sides to mark the field boundaries. Will this be the only field you putting in, or are there others in the planning?

 

[midlf]

Check with savage sales of local electric utilities and REA Co-ops. Utilities are constantly taking out old poles that are no longer useful for their operations but would work well for your uses (i.e. short). You don't need tall or 40 year life. Also check with the line crew Foreman if you see them pulling poles.

 

[Wesdor]

You might be able to get some good poles / lumber from a friend of mine in Leavenworth. Are you willing to drive that far? If so I can PM you his information.

You are getting some really good information and advice here.

 

[EddieWalker]

I'm sure that I got this wrong, but to me it seems your aproaching this from the wrong angle.

Do it like you would a fence. Set your corners with bracing much stronger than you thing you need. Say 4 inch galvanized pipe. It's pricey, but allot less than what you mentioned for wood.

Than for line posts just put in 2 inch galvanized set in concrete about 20 feet apart. That's what it looks like in your example.

I'd run cable from each corner and tighten it up really, really tight. Then fasten the cable to the line poles to keep things ligned up.

Attach your screen.

No way will wind bend those pipes if they are three feet down and set in concrete!!!! Four feet would be even better.

The weak spot to this is the netting . The poles will outlive all of us.

Eddie

 

[SnoFalls]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">(
The weak spot to this is the netting .
)</font>
And if strung like a shower curtain, can simply be tied up when not in use .. (therby avoiding wind damage) ...

 

[turbo36]

I second this method!
By the way where are you? If your close to me I'll bring my Dye over and break some paint!

 

[Investorguy]

I'm in NW Washington state, near the Can-Am border.

I'm beginning to think about the metal pipe idea. Any idea what it costs? I'd need to weld hooks or eye-bolts on for the cabling, something I have no experience with.

Here's the thing, I'm going to initially be going w/ 12 foot netting, but I'd like the ability to be able to switch over to 20 foot netting w/o pulling up whatever poles/supports I have for the stuff.

I may go w/ SOME phone poles at the corners (b/c they're the strongest maybe?) and use metal poles along the way.

Of course, anyone here who's in the area is welcome to come play anytime.

I'm thinking that when I close down next september, I may want to run some drainage tile under the field so it dries out earlier in the season.

I just picked up a 2-bottom plow today so I can now do up some more of my field for this purpose. Should be fun.

 

[Investorguy]

</font><font color="blueclass=small">( Check with savage sales of local electric utilities and REA Co-ops. Utilities are constantly taking out old poles that are no longer useful for their operations but would work well for your uses (i.e. short). You don't need tall or 40 year life. Also check with the line crew Foreman if you see them pulling poles. )</font>

I've pulled my hair out trying this. No luck at all. I consistently get told that they don't sell the poles. We all know that they end up giving them to someone, but I guess I just don't know the right people.

This is the route everyone suggests I go, but I'm just not having any luck w/ it.

I really don't want to have to spend $5000 on poles, but I may have too.

 

[Investorguy]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I think you'll find it much cheaper to change from 30' to 10' spacing between support post. Making that change will allow you to use much cheaper supports, even if you need 3 times as many they will be one tenth the unit cost. Another problem would be tensioning 30' of cable to remove the sag isn't going to be an easy thing to do. I think the least expensive long term method would be to build it like a chain link fence. If you can't find a cheap source of pipe long enough for the 12' height, you could weld sections of standard length together.

Something else to consider is that on the fields I've played only allow spectators on one or two sides of the speedball fields. Doing that could allow you to put up just a standard rail fence on the other sides to mark the field boundaries. Will this be the only field you putting in, or are there others in the planning?

)</font>

I'd like be able to split my field in half some how, but not have any big posts in the middle. I also may want to add another field, but it would be smaller.

I want to minimize the number of posts, especially if they aren't set up for 12 or 20 foot netting. Then again, it's all about the money for the most part, as there's going to be a lot of work either way.

 

[DKinWA]

I'm sure if you talked to some of the local loggers they could fix you up with something. Pulp wood is running between $29-$39/ton around here and it's good enough for what you're planning to do. Just treat the section that will be buried so they last awhile. You might even be able to get cedar pretty cheap. You could get them even cheaper if you haul them and don't have to pay trucking.

If you were closer, I would've given you a dozen or so poles from a logging job we did today. They were too small for the sawmill and not enough for a pulp load.

 

[Defective]

Investorguy,

Take a look at this web site: Adrenaline Paintball

Then get in touch with Greg (the owner). We opened up the new field last spring & he's been through the WHOLE thing. Great guy to talk with and he'll have lots of helpful info for you on how to make things work.

 

[Investorguy]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I'm sure if you talked to some of the local loggers they could fix you up with something. Pulp wood is running between $29-$39/ton around here and it's good enough for what you're planning to do. Just treat the section that will be buried so they last awhile. You might even be able to get cedar pretty cheap. You could get them even cheaper if you haul them and don't have to pay trucking.

If you were closer, I would've given you a dozen or so poles from a logging job we did today. They were too small for the sawmill and not enough for a pulp load. )</font>

Well, the price I'm getting from McFarland-Cascade is $250 for a 30 ft class 6 w/ butt treatment. I wouldn't know the first thing about getting in touch w/ loggers. My dad was a logger (killed in an accident when I was 8, 22 years ago) but it's not something I've been around too much. I would need treated poles (butt treated at least). I don't need them until May at the earliest (probably more like June so the boom truck won't rip up the field so much). Any other advice you can give? I can certainly afford to pay for poles/trucking/etc. I'm just trying to save a little bit of cash; lots to buy for this field.