Dirt Moving Ploughing with a compact tractor

[VroomVroom]

Just wondering how large of an area can be ploughed with a hydrostatic 28 hp tractor. The ground was used for hay making 35 years ago. No rock, reddish topsoil. It hasn't been used in this time nor broken. It remains clear of brush for the most part. 35 acres.

 

[jeff9366]

You can pull a two bottom, 12" wide moldboard plow with a Mahindra 2816. So you can turn a total of 24" wide after your tractor at about 2-1/2 miles per hour.

Plowing is an advanced implement skill. It takes quite a bit of practice before the ground will invert properly.

After plowing the ground will be rough. The next steps are to smooth/till with a box frame Disc Harrow with 18" diameter pans, one or two passes, then drag, seed, and, ideally, firm with a Cultipacker.

Questions: Where are you? Your LOCATION should be part of your TBN PROFILE so we know something of your soil, soil depth and weather.

What do you intend to do with the land after plowing? Any places with standing water after rain? Were cattle or horses kept on the land as pasture?

Have a soil test and amend your soil per test recommendations after discing.

 

[VroomVroom]

Hi Jeff, Newfoundland Canada. I assumed it could only pull a single plow. That's great if it could pull a two bottom. The grass over the years I figured would make it difficult to pull a plough through. I have little experience. I did plough a small garden years ago with a tow behind triple behind the farm all. I was thinking of growing grapes to be honest. I should look for a picture of the field. I've heard on here in one of the postings about the hydro transmission having difficult. Or not lasting. I'd have figured it would do well. A lot of the logging equipment are all hydrostatic these days and their abused hard. I'd like to know how long foes it normally take to plough a tough field with no rocks.

 

[jeff9366]

A two bottom 12" plow will be fine. Cutting through grass/sod, then inverting the sod so the roots are up to dry and die are what a moldboard plow is supposed to do. You will plow in HST/MED at close to max throttle.

You need to cut grass as short as possible before plowing. Ideally, your plow with have coulters (pronounced colters) which are serrated wheels which slice the verdure before the moldboard plow begins to invert the dirt. (Google: plow coulters, then select IMAGES.)

I retired after 37 years in the wine business, my last 25 years doing sales, marketing and winery administration for California wineries. In California, where conditions are certainly different from Newfoundland, the ground is usually ripped deep with a crawler and claw as the first step in planting vines. The purpose is to fracture deep so the vines can go down 10' or more for increasingly scarce water. Even so, drip irrigation is required for a profitable crop in most years. In California wine grape yields are usually 6-7 tons per acre, if well farmed.

HST transmission is fine for plowing. HST is what I have. Max torque as the plow first enters the ground, just what you need.

Describe your top soil, soil thickness and sub-soil.

 

[jeff9366]

I'd like to know how long foes it normally take to plough a tough field with no rocks.

You can pull a two bottom, 12" wide moldboard plow with a Mahindra 2816. So you can turn a total of 24" wide after your tractor at about 2-1/2 miles per hour.

Do the math.

 

[VroomVroom]

I some people in the agriculture department here that would give assistance if needed. They would take a soil sample first and help with fertilizers. I've seen the videos of soil prep and wondered if I would have to do that if I decided to try this out. If you told someone you were growing grapes here they would laugh at you. But apparently the climate on this portion of Newfoundland can grow grapes and the government wants to try it out. It's a field on the fiver flat. I know little what's under the sod, but other fields here have little rock for the first three feet, but then you getting close to the river height and the rock starts in boulders.. How deep do you need? In your experience what depth do you need. Ho w deep do the vine roots grow and how hardy are they? Frosts stop in late May and begin mid sept. Water, moisture isn't a problem.

 

[jeff9366]

Vinifera vines (Europe + Western US + South America) for wine are hardy. Native vines and Native/Vinifera hybrids (New York) are extremely hardy. Consult with your ag department. Are you considering table grapes or wine grapes? Wine grapes are very small in diameter, smaller than a Garbanzo. Table grapes are very large.

Harvested wine grapes are highly perishable. Are there wineries near you?

Vinifera wine grapes can go down 40' for water, however this is rare. Vinifera vines do not tolerate wet feet. Do you have floods which inundate the land? During a flood, how long would the land be submerged?

If you plant on river flat land the vines will get to the water, never fear. You will not need to rip. Question is, will vines take in so much water that the sugar never goes high enough, through dilution, for making wine or become sweet enough to sell as table grapes?

I do not think I can extrapolate from my California/Vinifera experience in a way that will be useful to you in Newfoundland.

 

[Egon]

How much your tractor can pull depends on the weight/traction it has. To do a proper job ploughing sod the proper mouldboards should be used. After the sod's been turned when breaking it down be prepared for a rough ride.

Think at least three days for the ploughing.

 

[VroomVroom]

Any knowledge is helpful. No doubt different climates. I'm thinking the soil is only 5 feet approximately. So maybe it's not deep enough. I'll have to get a picture to post here. I'll be home in a week. After 5 to 6 feet I'm thinking you'll then fun into mostly bouldered soil.. The field starts right at the rivers edge, 5 to 6 foot bank. It extends back from the river about 1500 feet. The river is maybe 5 feet deep along the field, but is only 50 feet wide. It does wash over the field once in ten years? Soil for the first few feet is good for most vegetables. Once the vines take root, can you get rid of them if you wanted to use the field for something else? There's a large dairy farmer nearby, I have thought if I needed to I'd get them to subsoil the field down deeper then I could plough with the little tractors if it was required. Right now it's a thought. I would have to talk to the guys in the department if it was needed. The math tells me it would be a week to 10 days for the entire field. 1500 feet long, at 2.5 mph would take 7 minutes I believe, making a 2 foot pass, I would need 750 passes. 7 x 750 would be 8 to 10 long days
.

 

[VroomVroom]

I'm thinking it may be as high as 55 acres. The land is much more. But only 35-55 of it is farmable field. I'd have to survey it now to ensure the boundaries

 

[VroomVroom]

Far all is heavy, the mahindrag 2816 is pretty light. I'd have to add weight

 

[newbury]

One of the first things you need to do is determine what the topsoil is.

If you've got nice thick marine clay it won't plow as fast as or easy as friable sandy loam.

Then add in a fudge factor for "whoops" and unscheduled downtime.

IF you don't have a plow already it may be better to get someone else to plow it the first time.

And why not plow with the Farmall?

 

[jeff9366]

You can pull a two bottom, 12" wide moldboard plow with a Mahindra 2816.

Newbury is on it. Why not plow with the Farmall?

If you shop for a plow for the Mahindra you will have to be wary of old plows, most of which are sized for the Ford 9N/2N/8N tractors. Old plows usually have long beams which are likely to collide with some part of your Mahindra.

The Ford Series 101 plow pictured in Post #4, collided with the frame on my Kubota B3300SU ~~ so I bought a larger, heavier Kubota L3560.

You could plow under vine roots from zero to eight years old.

 

[rgr33]

I planted my vineyard in 1998. I live on a hillside, elevation at 700 ft, with about 3 feet of mostly clay topsoil on top of straight basalt rock. Plowing the existing turf is good, but first you should have someone with a large tractor run a ripper as deep as they can, you will not get a better time to do it, and it is vitally important to help the roots sink deep. That is where they will find their water and trace minerals in the future. I water new plants the first two years, after that they must get water from their own roots, so they sink roots deep to find water in the cracks and crevices of the basalt rock. If they hit a hard pan, they don't have the vitality to do well in a dry summer.

 

[VroomVroom]

Thanks for all the info. Certainly gives me a heads up. I'd have t hire someone with large equipment to rip for me first.. That alone would cost a bit being 35-55 acres

 

[jeff9366]

You do not need to rip if you are just above the river.

Hillsboro, Oregon is west of Portland. It is way, way, above the Willamette River, probably 600+ feet.

Your situation in Newfoundland, on the river, is entirely different.

Your question will be: Can grape vines survive with such a high water table and periodic inundation?

 

[KWRB]

I see you've gotten quite a few replies already, but here's my experience.

I have a John Deere 4610. I am in the midst of a project where I'm turning a disused pasture into a wildflower meadow. It had scrubby trees a few years ago. I brush hogged it for two seasons, and plowed it last fall. I used a new Everything Attachments 18" single bottom moldboard plow with a coulter wheel. I feel that coulter is an essential part. I elected to go with the widest moldboard and a single bottom. It worked like a charm eventually. I decided to go with a new plow, rather than deal with the idiosyncrasies of an old one pulled out of someone's hedgerow.

As for the tractor pulling it, I tried initially with no success to pull it with the turf tires that were on my tractor. It was worth a shot since the ags that did eventually go on it were a substantial investment.

For the record, I was plowing in clayish loam with still-living roots from 10 year old brush. Another benefit to the new plow is that you can count on the shear bolts doing their job, which mine did about 16 times in the part of the field that wasn't obviously rock-picked in the past. It was amazing when I got done to see the difference in rockiness from one part of the field to the other, where rocks had been clearly picked. Impressive what people did by hand in an earlier generation.

 

[jenkinsph]

If I were planting grapes I would be inclined to rip the middle of the row as deep as possible. Don't see much point in turning over the entire field with a turning plow. If you are driving between the rows just keep it mowed down as close as you can. Fertilize and drip irrigate the row centers as the grapes require.

The small tractor would be fine for tending the rows. Have a large tractor rip the row centers initially and take over from there.

Don't have any idea whether you can grow grapes in your locale.

 

[Egon]

Prior to deep tillage check with your local agricultural advisor. There are times it's not desirable due to soil type and layering. Mixing the soil layers may also not be beneficial.

[video]http://m.southwestfarmpress.com/management/deep-tillage-benefits-depend-soil-conditions[/video]