possible well pump problems?

[merrickvilleguy]

Now I can see a little light.

Rob it sounds like a decision will have to be made. Check the furnace for proper water usage, pull the pump for inspection or do both.

We're actually doing both, the plumber we called thinks its iron scale in the pipes or possibly on the pump itself.

 

[TheGoose]

One thing I forgot to mention....

your installer can tell a lot by checking the amps of the pump. Any discrepiences with the pump should show up in the amps.

Good luck to you and post up what you find...and put some pics up. I would like to see your set-up with the geo system and all.

 

[merrickvilleguy]

So I've learned a few things:

1. my heat pump requires 6gpm min
2. my well pump is a 1/2hp pump which supplies 7gpm
3. both are undersized for the application

So looks like I will be going to propane heating.

The plumber I talked to insists its just a constriction of the pipe from the pump to the house, apparently they can fix that without replacing all the pipe?

Will see what thursday brings.

 

[Brad_Blazer]

I had a similar but more severe problem after I let the stock tank overflow all day. Good pressure behavior at the tank but low/no flow in the house. The filter coming into my house was clogged due to the dirty water that came in when the well ran down. Make sure to check all filters/screens coming into the house including faucet screens.

 

[Brad_Blazer]

It's a centrifugal pump so you might get up to 10gpm as the pump head/pressure drops.

 

[Egon]

Sounds like your the fellows out checking things are doing good!:thumbsup:

 

[merrickvilleguy]

furnace guy was here today and confirmed that the valve he replaced was pretty badly plugged before and thats why we never noticed the flow problem before ... instead of using the 6gpm it is supposed to we were using around 2-3

 

[PILOON]

One thing I learned with submerged pumps and bladder tank installations.
Often minute leaks in fittings or eroded check or foot valves will allow pressure 'bleed down' that results in some of these sympoms.
That is asuming the tank is OK.

My solution is not to only depend on the foot valve only so I like to install an additional check valve close to where the water enters the tank and before the pressure switch.
That way you eliminate all bleed down problems and with submerged pumps that self prime it is mere seconds to pressure up the the bladder tank.

It takes but the smallest pin hole or rusty pipe joint to allow bleed down and cause pump cycling.

 

[kidstrustfund]

I think you found your problem. The following is my opinion. I m not in front of your system so use your own judgement on how to proceed. The pump delivers 7 gpm. Your heat pump uses 6 gpm. 1 gpm for your house won't cut it. The reason things worked before is the valve at the heat pump was restricting the gpm. You also complained that you didn't like the performance of the heat pump. That supports the starved heat pump theory. Your heat pump was starved of water. You should notice improved performance in your heat pump now that you changed the valve when not using water in the house. Do a test. Do not run any water in your house and run your heat pump. Choke your main valve so your heat pump gets 3 gpm. You can do that by choking the main valve and pulling water from a hose connection down stream. Use a bucket and throttle the main valve until you get 3 gpm. Note the heat pump's performance. Does your heat pump run any better when your main valve is opened and delivering 5 gpm as opposed to running at 3 gpm? Consider upgrading to a pump that can deliver 11 gpm minimum. I am not a well driller so I do not know if your well can deliver 11 gpm. Perhaps " The Goose" can advise us on that one. I am a master plumber. I do gas heating and plumbing for a living. Around my area you do not want a plumber trouble shooting well / pump systems. I am an exception because I maintain over 20 well / pump systems and did customer repairs for 30 years. I also am a cheap scape, so I do the maintenance myself. Replacing the pump is cheaper than replacing the heater. Your plumber believes you have a restriction in your well / pump system. This is something I was thinking could be a problem in the beginning. Their could be a few things going on. Pump isn't big enough to deliver 11 gpm, and you have restrictions in your system. Based on the info I have on my end of the computer I would replace the pump with a bigger pump after asking your local well driller if your well can deliver 11 gpm. You may want a separate pump system for your heat pump based on your well driller's recommendations. Air rate the well prior to installing the new larger pump. If things still do not deliver enough gpm's to satisfy your heat pump and house, replace or unclog your well line up to the heat pump and main house valve. Around my way propane goes up to 3.50 + per gallon in the winter. Your outlay would be more if you convert to propane( unless you go with a new well). Research if the heat pump will work in your area if it has enough water to satisfy it's needs. Research if a properly functioning heat pump is cheaper to run than a high efficient propane with fuel costing the highest rate of propane in your area. Also research if the temps of a properly running heat pump are comfortable. I am not a heat pump man so I don't know the answer to that. Its been a while since I replaced a pump but your well driller should be able to replace it for 1000 complete. Air rating the well should cost you 300. Unclogging your well line is something I can't comment on. I am retired from plumbing for 9 years now. My pricing could be low. I am stunned by what things cost now a days. I sound old with that last comment. Good luck. I'll be happy to follow this. Tom

 

[merrickvilleguy]

I actually learned some more info off the furnace guy, these things are designed to have a sink temperature of around 50, and their break even point is around 37. Our well water temperature is 38. So as we speak right now the heat pump has been on for the 3 hrs I have been up, and our temperature is at 60. We have the thermostat set to 68. The furnace guy says the heat pump is quite small for this size of house (who knows why the previous owners went with it ?), and that in general, when it gets cold up here, most people have to supplement with wood to keep the temperature in the house up. After receiving our electricity bill, it would seem we averaged around 70-75kwh in the last month heating the house, and that's on top of burning 3-4 face cord of wood in our air tight fireplace insert.

A quick test showed I can fill 4x 5 gallon pails in just under 4 minutes after we shut the heat pump off and let it turn completely off, and before letting the pressure tank charge. So I am assuming we have plenty of water in the well, its just the pump is unable to deliver it to the house (either clogged pump or line).

I have no illusions of saving money on going to propane, but, I do know that 60f is a bit cool to wake up to, and we are effectively wasting electricity trying to raise it. We are currently -4f outside (not too cold but just for data's sake)