PTO water pump delima

sea2summit · Oct 22, 2020

So I haul water to most of my critters in an IBC tote that I fill from my pond with a 12V pump. The 12V pump takes forever and it just died.

So, now is my chance to change to something PTO driven. I've looked at a lot of them that chain on for sprayers etc but it looks like about 22gal/min is the max flow which is okay but it doesn't look like they can handle any foreign debris and I can't see anything say they have any capacity for suction or head. I think I need it to be capable of 5-10' of suction, not too worried about head because I'd just be pumping into an IBC tote on the FEL or maybe the 3PT if I get crazy and build a transporter for the IBC/mount for the pump. I plan to have a filter on the suction end but it's probably still gonna see pine needles/leaves/etc moving through from time to time.

Any recommendations? I'd love for it to be 1.5-2" trash/fire pump capabilities but I think that's probably to big for the application. And this would run off an MX5800/540 if that matters.

ns_in_tex · Oct 22, 2020

We pump out of a pond for a 2 acre water sprinkler system. To get clean water, we layed about a 6' piece of 4" pvc well screen, on the bottom, wrapped with polyester furnace filter material. Has been working good for several years. Have not cleaned it so far. we pump about 50 GPM through it 3 times per week, for about 4 hours.
It came in a 10' joint, but we only had 6' working space.
You might lay it on a small stand to hold it off the bottom, if you thought it might fill in over it.

If you have electricity, or generator available, we use a 1 HP swimming pool pump, to move from pond to holding tanks. It pumps about 50 GPM I think.

Peter 315 · Oct 22, 2020

If you make a float to hold the hose and let the suction head hang below the float about a foot you wont get as much crap...

ehcrain · Oct 23, 2020

Agreed with Peter315, keep the intake off the bottom and your job gets easier. Ive run pump irrigation for the garden from a dirty pond and always tied the end of the intake hose to a two empty gallon jugs for flotation.

Diggin It · Oct 23, 2020

If this is something you do often, consider laying a semi-permanent intake in the pond that you can connect the pump to when needed. As others have mentioned, you can rig the intake for filtering debris which will save the pump from that grief.

Pricing on the PTO pump? Have you compared that to other pumps, either gasoline or electric? Some people hate HF, but they have a 2" semi-trash gasoline pump on coupon for $190: Harbor Freight Tools Coupon Database - Free coupons, 25 percent off coupons, toolbox coupons - 2" SEMI-TRASH GASOLINE ENGINE WATER PUMP (212 CC)

Item details are here: 2 in. 212cc Gasoline Engine Semi-Trash Water Pump - 158 GPM

Leave that near the pond connected to the intake and just use a hose from it to fill the tote.

sea2summit · Oct 23, 2020

ns_in_tex said:
We pump out of a pond for a 2 acre water sprinkler system. To get clean water, we layed about a 6' piece of 4" pvc well screen, on the bottom, wrapped with polyester furnace filter material. Has been working good for several years. Have not cleaned it so far. we pump about 50 GPM through it 3 times per week, for about 4 hours.
It came in a 10' joint, but we only had 6' working space.
You might lay it on a small stand to hold it off the bottom, if you thought it might fill in over it.

If you have electricity, or generator available, we use a 1 HP swimming pool pump, to move from pond to holding tanks. It pumps about 50 GPM I think.

The pond is about 500’ from power so that’s why I’m leaning toward PTO.

sea2summit · Oct 23, 2020

Peter 315 said:
If you make a float to hold the hose and let the suction head hang below the float about a foot you wont get as much crap...

Absolutely. Several folks have mentioned semi permanent hookups and that’s actually sounding pretty smart.

sea2summit · Oct 23, 2020

Diggin It said:
If this is something you do often, consider laying a semi-permanent intake in the pond that you can connect the pump to when needed. As others have mentioned, you can rig the intake for filtering debris which will save the pump from that grief.

Pricing on the PTO pump? Have you compared that to other pumps, either gasoline or electric? Some people hate HF, but they have a 2" semi-trash gasoline pump on coupon for $190: Harbor Freight Tools Coupon Database - Free coupons, 25 percent off coupons, toolbox coupons - 2" SEMI-TRASH GASOLINE ENGINE WATER PUMP (212 CC)

Item details are here: 2 in. 212cc Gasoline Engine Semi-Trash Water Pump - 158 GPM

Leave that near the pond connected to the intake and just use a hose from it to fill the tote.

PTO pumps are looking similarly priced, and I’ve got a dozen or so small engines I maintain already so I’m trying to avoid that route for now.

TCowner · Oct 24, 2020

This is what I use. I've used it both for filling my 300 gallon tank from the creek and pumping water for my newly transplanted conifers. The water from the creek is pretty clean and I use a screen on the inlet side. So far I have not damaged the pump from contaminants. The volume this pump puts out is impressive so much so, that I have to run my 2025R at just above idle speed to avoid dispersing too much water. But I have some trees that I can't get my trailer and pump close to so the huge volume of water this pump moves allows me to get the water to the trees.

https://www.agrisupply.com/images/xxl/12242.jpg?v=20201024083443

ruffdog · Oct 24, 2020

A pto trash pump will work and the small one is rated at 180gpm.

PTO Trash Pumps - Water Pumps Direct

pmsmechanic · Oct 24, 2020

Are you handy with a welder? I would build a pump/IBC tote all in one that I hook onto the three point of the tractor, back up to the pond, lower the pump and fill the tote. The pump just needs to be a simple fin shaped apparatus directly driven through u-joints from the pto. Design a volute around the fins and direct the water with a hose into the tote. A simple screen over the center of the volute will screen the water good enough for what you plan on doing. A wooden bearing would be adequate on the pump end to avoid getting water in a regular bearing.

sea2summit · Oct 24, 2020

TCowner said:
This is what I use. I've used it both for filling my 300 gallon tank from the creek and pumping water for my newly transplanted conifers. The water from the creek is pretty clean and I use a screen on the inlet side. So far I have not damaged the pump from contaminants. The volume this pump puts out is impressive so much so, that I have to run my 2025R at just above idle speed to avoid dispersing too much water. But I have some trees that I can't get my trailer and pump close to so the huge volume of water this pump moves allows me to get the water to the trees.

https://www.agrisupply.com/images/xxl/12242.jpg?v=20201024083443

Found that one in my research after I started this thread, looks like what I need!

sea2summit · Oct 24, 2020

ruffdog said:
A pto trash pump will work and the small one is rated at 180gpm.

PTO Trash Pumps - Water Pumps Direct

That痴 like four Honda fire pumps:ashamed:

sea2summit · Oct 24, 2020

pmsmechanic said:
Are you handy with a welder? I would build a pump/IBC tote all in one that I hook onto the three point of the tractor, back up to the pond, lower the pump and fill the tote. The pump just needs to be a simple fin shaped apparatus directly driven through u-joints from the pto. Design a volute around the fins and direct the water with a hose into the tote. A simple screen over the center of the volute will screen the water good enough for what you plan on doing. A wooden bearing would be adequate on the pump end to avoid getting water in a regular bearing.

That’s kind of the direction I’m going. With a no pass valve so I can pull from the pond or from the tank so when I get to wherever I can just take the output hose and stick it where I need the water.

I weld but I’m still teaching myself off of YouTubes of dubious credibility so don’t know if that qualifies as “handy”

pmsmechanic · Oct 24, 2020

sea2summit said:
That’s kind of the direction I’m going. With a no pass valve so I can pull from the pond or from the tank so when I get to wherever I can just take the output hose and stick it where I need the water.

I weld but I’m still teaching myself off of YouTubes of dubious credibility so don’t know if that qualifies as “handy”

Another idea that just popped up in my mind would be to use a hydraulic motor instead of a pto shaft. Just get a taper lock hub and a sprocket to weld your fins onto and build the housing around that. It would be easier to build than with a pto shaft and I'm thinking the final cost wouldn't be a whole lot different either. You could tack weld what you build and then take it to a welder for the final welding if you have concerns about your own ability's.

I once built an impeller for a snow blower out of a 2' square of 3/8th's metal. I had a machine shop cut a hole in the exact center and then welded a hub in for a browning taper lock hub. I weighed every piece of metal that I welded on and used the same amount of welding rod for each piece. I then took it to the tire shop and had it balanced on a tire balancer. I welded on a one ounce piece of steel to get everything in balance. So you could do it also if you had too.

mikester · Oct 25, 2020

I fill my totes from a pond. I bought a chinesium gas powered 2" pump brand new on sale for $180 and it fills the IBC totes super fast at about 150 gallons a minute. Tote would be full in under 2 minutes using the tote couplers. Honda clone motor and plastic pump body. That's cheaper than any PTO or hydraulic powered pump I could find.

Here is a similar one for $260 regular price
2 in. Gas Water Pump | Princess Auto

I also use a couple of totes to capture rain water from the down spouts. Gets refilled for free.

52wej · Oct 28, 2020

Two 300 gal totes on a farm wagon, 1 HF !" pump. Takes about 15-20 minutes to fill and I have totes linked together so I can use pump to irrigate garden. Runs 4 sprinklers at idle without any problem. Only time consuming issue is going to creek with tractor and wagon which is more than a mile away. But I have been doing this for more than 20 years and in a drought the garden does well. Takes less than 1 quart gas to run complete cycle per trip. Two trips and I have irrigated our 5000 sq ft garden for the week.

When I bought the HF pump I could not find a Honda pump. But it has been satisfactory. I had a two stroke Robin motor and pump that worked well. It used more fuel mixture, but lasted for many years.

Regardless of the pump keep fuel treatment in them and they will always be ready to work for you. W. Jones