Removing Plug to Install a Block Heater - Need some ideas

[Jtullis13]

Ok - Going to give this another try.....assuming I do have some success.....What block heater did everyone use?

Yep Hoye has one for your model Scotty. Code: HBH-400 this is the one listed for your tractor. Good luck.

 

[Reg]

Having read only the first few replies I'll wade in on a different tack (sailing analogy, but sailors don't like having to "wade in").

I had cold starting issues a few years after I bought my tractor, it was GREAT at first but seemed to get a bit worse every two or three years.
I went the lower hose heater route, which helped - a bit.
I went the block heater route, which (with the lower hose heater and a splitter extension cord) helped a LOT - - but I was burning up something like 1500 watts for at least a couple of hours and all too often the need to use the tractor would pass before the block would be warm enough to start anyway.

EVENTUALLY a situation arose where I would have to haul the tractor to help with a project and leave it overnight with NO chance of an electrical outlet within 500 ft.
SO, it was time to figure out what was REALLY wrong with this tractor that cold started so WELL when new.

OK, I've already made this short story into a long one.
I removed all the glow plugs and metered them, 3 were open circuit, one read 38 ohms.
I paid $83.xx for all 4, with shipping - about 1/2 of dealer price.
Probably an hour to get them out and meter them, 3/4 hour to put everything back together.
In retrospect they probably went bad one by one, when the first one went it was so subtle that I probably attributed the difficult starting to the sudden cold spell.

NOTES:
Glow plugs are industry standard items and spec'd by thread, length, wattage, connector type, not_much_else.
So there are interchange tables much like there are for oil, fuel, air filters, spark plugs, etc.
You don't NEED dealer parts for these.
It isn't a HARD job, in fact it is easier than installing a block or lower radiator hose heater.


BTW, that square drive plug IS 1/2 inch, there is NO "Metric" version, it has been a world wide standard for MANY decades - if you are "rounding" it you either have a poor approach angle, a poor 1/2 inch drive, or a lot of crud in there that isn't letting it all the way in.

 

[Reg]

Talking about this just now and I was told that putting block or lower hose heaters in for cold starting problems is like putting band aides on foreheads for headaches.
It works, but it doesn't solve the underlying problem.

So, dumb jokes aside - have you pulled the glow plugs and metered them yet ?
Probably worth doing ANYWAY, even if you WANT a block heater.

 

[winston1]

Talking about this just now and I was told that putting block or lower hose heaters in for cold starting problems is like putting band aides on foreheads for headaches.
It works, but it doesn't solve the underlying problem.

So, dumb jokes aside - have you pulled the glow plugs and metered them yet ?
Probably worth doing ANYWAY, even if you WANT a block heater.

His Yanmar does not have glow plugs, it has a thermostart system. Inside a Yanmar thermostart (glow plug) unit.

 

[Reg]

His Yanmar does not have glow plugs, it has a thermostart system. Inside a Yanmar thermostart (glow plug) unit.

However implemented and whatever it is called - it is the "cold start assist system" this is just a different implementation of "glow plugs", in fact it seems to be a super low cost design that uses just ONE glow plug.

Regardless, if it has failed it needs to be repaired ANYWAY.
Getting around the failure by raising the temperature of the block and coolant isn't SOLVING the underlying problem.


So, about $30 for the glow plug (kinda high) or $95 for a whole thermostart kit ?
Yeah, I still think that is where I would be troubleshooting.

Even though trouble oft times shoots back (-:

 

[rScotty]

Hoyes....good luck...if you can get it installed..it痴 well worth it effort

That's exactly my opinion of block heaters. If the existing plug is stuck firm, it's not worth endangering the block because there are other options. But it is the best kind of heater. I'd advise that you go ahead and get one from Hoye or your favorite parts dealer and then try to remove the block plug. If it installs without too much force - and most do - then you have the best solution. If not, you're only out a few bucks. Block heaters heat well and last for decades with no maintenance. Give it a try.
rScotty

 

[Jtullis13]

Having read only the first few replies I'll wade in on a different tack (sailing analogy, but sailors don't like having to "wade in").

I had cold starting issues a few years after I bought my tractor, it was GREAT at first but seemed to get a bit worse every two or three years.
I went the lower hose heater route, which helped - a bit.
I went the block heater route, which (with the lower hose heater and a splitter extension cord) helped a LOT - - but I was burning up something like 1500 watts for at least a couple of hours and all too often the need to use the tractor would pass before the block would be warm enough to start anyway.

EVENTUALLY a situation arose where I would have to haul the tractor to help with a project and leave it overnight with NO chance of an electrical outlet within 500 ft.
SO, it was time to figure out what was REALLY wrong with this tractor that cold started so WELL when new.

OK, I've already made this short story into a long one.
I removed all the glow plugs and metered them, 3 were open circuit, one read 38 ohms.
I paid $83.xx for all 4, with shipping - about 1/2 of dealer price.
Probably an hour to get them out and meter them, 3/4 hour to put everything back together.
In retrospect they probably went bad one by one, when the first one went it was so subtle that I probably attributed the difficult starting to the sudden cold spell.

NOTES:
Glow plugs are industry standard items and spec'd by thread, length, wattage, connector type, not_much_else.
So there are interchange tables much like there are for oil, fuel, air filters, spark plugs, etc.
You don't NEED dealer parts for these.
It isn't a HARD job, in fact it is easier than installing a block or lower radiator hose heater.


BTW, that square drive plug IS 1/2 inch, there is NO "Metric" version, it has been a world wide standard for MANY decades - if you are "rounding" it you either have a poor approach angle, a poor 1/2 inch drive, or a lot of crud in there that isn't letting it all the way in.

Most of these Grey Market Yanmar Tractors do not have glow plugs, but a thermo-start plug. Yeah it can be considered a glow plug but it works differently. I believe on Scottys 2020 he only has 1 thermo-start plug, he wont have a plug for each cylinder like most modern diesels do. So his thermo-start could be bad, but having a warm block will always make starting his tractor easier even if his thermo-start did work, and this applies to gas engines too. Cold weather makes any engine more difficult to start.

I was working and typing at the same time, didn't realize all you other guys beat me to this. LOL

 

[Reg]

Yeah, all of that.
BUT !
There is always the "but".

I'll betcha it started easily/quickly in the coldest weather when it was NEW !
It didn't NEED a block or lower hose heater THEN and it doesn't need one NOW, it needs to be REPAIRED !

Bitter experience has taught me that it is ALWAYS better to troubleshoot BEFORE adding on.
Usually quicker and cheaper too, since EVENTUALLY I fix or repair the broken part AS WELL.

A block, dipstick or lower hose heater may MASK the problem, but it won't FIX it and if you ever have to leave the tractor over a cold night where there is no electrical outlet - too bad.

 

[winston1]

I was not inferring he needed the block heater, just pointing out most old Yanmars do not have glow plugs. The thermostart system lights a fire in the intake warming the intake air. My experiences with it have proven it to be well designed. However, coldest temperatures I probably cranked off were only in the mid twentys.

What is the lowest temperature some of you folks from up North crank off at?

 

[LouNY]

Yeah, all of that.
BUT !
There is always the "but".

I'll betcha it started easily/quickly in the coldest weather when it was NEW !
It didn't NEED a block or lower hose heater THEN and it doesn't need one NOW, it needs to be REPAIRED !

Bitter experience has taught me that it is ALWAYS better to troubleshoot BEFORE adding on.
Usually quicker and cheaper too, since EVENTUALLY I fix or repair the broken part AS WELL.

A block, dipstick or lower hose heater may MASK the problem, but it won't FIX it and if you ever have to leave the tractor over a cold night where there is no electrical outlet - too bad.

I am going to guess that you have never been out in zero F or sub zero temperatures at 5 in the morning or in a snow storm trying to get a cold diesel started so you can get on with your work.
I have not seen any factory stock diesel tractors from 10 years ago or older that would start in those temps without help.
Either from after market heaters or factory or after market block or engine heaters.
Anything and everything you can do to make starting an engine easier on it and you is a good thing.
Unfortunately money usually gets in the way, so economically becomes important.