Royal Purple??

[sw03]

I for one am NOT out to prove anything because I am not a professional oil analyst or automotive technician.

I am only repeating and following Kubota dealer/technicians/owners manual/WSM recommendations. I believe any major manufacturer such as Kubota would have done R&D and should know what is best in their specific application.

To the OP;

Do what you want as it is your machine/money but I follow specific manufacturers recommendations and will be switching after proper break in.

Okay but most dealers have no idea. Heck, I had several tell me this and that on when to do certain filters etc. Most manufactures do not do any R&D; they outsource it since their cost is too high

The OP will NOT have anything posted in their book/manual. Kubota is behind the times in oil. Has been for years.

Again, you WILL have slightly higher wears. maybe higher fuel in oil if a group4/5 is used but in the long run, it will be better.

 

[sw03]

real easy, pull a UOA on an engine that was switched to syn early and you will see more fuel in the oil dilution from the rings not being seated vs one that was broken in CORRECTLY. another good way is to do a compression test and the one with the early switch to syn will have lower compression.

Bingo and nothing new. And the higher fuel %'s will still be low and nothing to worry about. Heck, using Power service will do more harm or using a crappy air filter.

 

[scrappy isb67]

Bingo and nothing new. And the higher fuel %'s will still be low and nothing to worry about. Heck, using Power service will do more harm or using a crappy air filter.

The higher fuel dilution #'s are because the break-in was not accomplished correctly, an engine that was broken in correctly and then switched to syn will have lower #'s than the prematurely switched engine. The Cummins with DPF has been notorious for having oil/fuel dilution due to the active regenerations. Because of the fuel dilution even if you have syn in it, you will still have to change the oil to keep from causing ACCELERATED wear due to the lower lubricity from the thinned oil. There have been reports of oil change notifications in as little as 1800 miles! The severe service interval is 7500 miles! In the case of the Cummins it was related to excessive idling(not driving it as INTENDED) and too many regens but it is a reminder that oil dilution is BAD!
Switching the engine over to syn early saves you NOTHING and can shorten the life of the engine and make it use more fuel AND oil than it would if broken in right!

 

[sw03]

The higher fuel dilution #'s are because the break-in was not accomplished correctly, an engine that was broken in correctly and then switched to syn will have lower #'s than the prematurely switched engine. The Cummins with DPF has been notorious for having oil/fuel dilution due to the active regenerations. Because of the fuel dilution even if you have syn in it, you will still have to change the oil to keep from causing ACCELERATED wear due to the lower lubricity from the thinned oil. There have been reports of oil change notifications in as little as 1800 miles! The severe service interval is 7500 miles! In the case of the Cummins it was related to excessive idling(not driving it as INTENDED) and too many regens but it is a reminder that oil dilution is BAD!
Switching the engine over to syn early saves you NOTHING and can shorten the life of the engine and make it use more fuel AND oil than it would if broken in right!

We are talking tractors here. Again look at old uoa's here...you will never seen any accelerated wear in your life that will hinder engine life! Why are you comparing a Kubota to a Cummins engine with DPF? No engine close...I have had more fuel issues with motorcycle carbs then this issue. If you idle a diesel you Will have high fuel issues no matter the OIL.

For ME, I switch asap since it saves me times and money....

Sent via kindle fire

 

[boomer1025]

For the OP go over to Bobistheoilguy.com and explore, there's more oil information on that site then you'll get here. Just about everyone has their own opinion as what to use, how to use it and so on when it comes to fluids. Use what what brand you like dino or syntheic as long as it rated for your engine and see if your engine likes it.
ON my Boomer I changed everything over to Asmoil at the 50 hr mark. In the engine I use 10w30 small engine oil. Never used a drop of oil & stays very clean between changes. I change it every fall and the oil had around 90 hrs on it.
At the 50 hr mark the engine would have travel roughly 2250 miles or more. I bet your manual says after the 50 hr service, to change the oil every 100 or 200 hrs. So if the engine wasn't broke in at 50 hrs, you would think they would state change the oil every 50 hrs till the engine has x amount of hrs on it, then change at the 100 or 200 hr mark.

 

[sw03]

For the OP go over to Bobistheoilguy.com and explore, there's more oil information on that site then you'll get here. Just about everyone has their own opinion as what to use, how to use it and so on when it comes to fluids. Use what what brand you like dino or syntheic as long as it rated for your engine and see if your engine likes it.
ON my Boomer I changed everything over to Asmoil at the 50 hr mark. In the engine I use 10w30 small engine oil. Never used a drop of oil & stays very clean between changes. I change it every fall and the oil had around 90 hrs on it.
At the 50 hr mark the engine would have travel roughly 2250 miles or more. I bet your manual says after the 50 hr service, to change the oil every 100 or 200 hrs. So if the engine wasn't broke in at 50 hrs, you would think they would state change the oil every 50 hrs till the engine has x amount of hrs on it, then change at the 100 or 200 hr mark.

Be VERY careful with BITOG site. The new owner is well, you figure it out. Lost a LOT of old sponsors and banning of many old-time members. The site lost a lot of credit for many.

 

[boomer1025]

Be VERY careful with BITOG site. The new owner is well, you figure it out. Lost a LOT of old sponsors and banning of many old-time members. The site lost a lot of credit for many.

Haven't been to Bob's site for awhile, unless the old posts were removed, there is still a lot of very good information there.
P.S. was just over to Bob's, doesn't look like a lot has change. Still lot of good information. Over 38,000 members & over 2+ million posts.
As far as Being Careful, I'd say the same holds true on this site or any other.

 

[sw03]

Haven't been to Bob's site for awhile, unless the old posts were removed, there is still a lot of very good information there.
P.S. was just over to Bob's, doesn't look like a lot has change. Still lot of good information. Over 38,000 members & over 2+ million posts.
As far as Being Careful, I'd say the same holds true on this site or any other.

Well, the new owner LOVED to removed threads. The member # is over blown. Why, I have many accounts over there.

And I a agree, this site has had a history too. Been there done that since 02.

 

[scrappy isb67]

We are talking tractors here. Again look at old uoa's here...you will never seen any accelerated wear in your life that will hinder engine life! Why are you comparing a Kubota to a Cummins engine with DPF? No engine close...I have had more fuel issues with motorcycle carbs then this issue. If you idle a diesel you Will have high fuel issues no matter the OIL.

For ME, I switch asap since it saves me times and money....

Sent via kindle fire

the engine I am referring to IS in tractors too and some DO have DPFs. I am comparing them to prove the point that oil/fuel dilution WILL affect oil life. also for fuel to get in the oil it has to go past the rings(which are NOT seated correctly because you didn' break it in correctly) and that fuel that is getting by the rings also has a bad habit of stripping the oil off the cylinder walls again causing MORE wear (if you're lucky) or scored cylinders if you are not.

And how are you saving money, you are putting MORE expensive oil in the engine and potentially have to change it SOONER than you would if the engine is broken in CORRECTLY(or still on dino oil). just 5% fuel dilution will increase wear greatly(to the point that you need to change the oil NOW)
the oil analysis places start to get nervous when the dilution levels are around 2-3%
I break my engines in correctly for the simple fact I don't want to spend $10-20K. rebuilding an engine that should not be needing rebuilt if the recommendations were followed. I also do run synthetics in my vehicles(2 came with it from the factory AND were already broken in) and my P/U has it too. as soon as my tractor has enough hours it will be on syn too.

 

[sw03]

the engine I am referring to IS in tractors too and some DO have DPFs. I am comparing them to prove the point that oil/fuel dilution WILL affect oil life. also for fuel to get in the oil it has to go past the rings(which are NOT seated correctly because you didn' break it in correctly) and that fuel that is getting by the rings also has a bad habit of stripping the oil off the cylinder walls again causing MORE wear (if you're lucky) or scored cylinders if you are not.

And how are you saving money, you are putting MORE expensive oil in the engine and potentially have to change it SOONER than you would if the engine is broken in CORRECTLY(or still on dino oil). just 5% fuel dilution will increase wear greatly(to the point that you need to change the oil NOW)
the oil analysis places start to get nervous when the dilution levels are around 2-3%
I break my engines in correctly for the simple fact I don't want to spend $10-20K. rebuilding an engine that should not be needing rebuilt if the recommendations were followed. I also do run synthetics in my vehicles(2 came with it from the factory AND were already broken in) and my P/U has it too. as soon as my tractor has enough hours it will be on syn too.

Funny, I have many years of UOA's on diesel and never above 1.5% fuel issues. Then again I do not have diesel with DPFs...Neither do Kubota's. IF you want to wait, great. I do not and my UOA are fine. Worry more about ideling the diesels then ring seating...I worry more about my gasers with corn fuel. YMMV

 

[Kc8ehd]

BX2360;

Please check with your kubota dealer before you do this!

There IS a reason that conventional oil is used for break in!

A diesel needs more time than a gasoline engine for break in.

Because one person has had "luck" switching to synthetic early does not make it right!

I asked my kubota dealer/mechanic and he said minimum 200 hr service or warranty would be void if any engine problems developed

Yes Royal Purple is good synthetic I have switched all oil in my '06 Sierra and am very pleased

Your warranty can't be voided if you use a API rated oil as spelled out in your owners Manual ? Show me one owners/service manual thats not to use synthetic oil ,many new vehicles come from the factory with synthetic.

 

[90cummins]

Ohhh boy!!
Oil is a topic that has so many opinions!
RP is a very good oil but looks to be over $30 a gallon per Amazon which is a bit pricey.
Kubota and others would specify synthetic if they knew the specific application needed it such as sub-zero operation.
Diesels are built to operate thousands of hours on mineral oil providing the correct grade is used.
Fuel dilution is often the result of being operated at to light a load and not being run up to operating temperature long enough.
Synthetic oil can prolong the break-in process but if conditions dictate it then that's what you should use.
The best oil in the world cannot prevent fuel dilution or wet-stacking issues if the engine is not operated with a load that is sufficient to properly warm up and load the piston rings (combustion pressure). Break-in will not occur if heat, load & pressure are insufficient.
The difference in life expectancy between synthetics & mineral oils in most instances will be minimal if any providing the correct grade (weight) is used.
Any diesel will have a short life if not operated properly.
I use Shell Rotella T6 5w40 synthetic $23 gallon at Walmart.
Rotella T6 is an excellent oil for conditions from sub zero to desert temperatures.
Quality & price is my guide. I use synthetics because it gives me peace of mind when starting my engine at zero degrees.
Ultimately it is your decision, your money a poor choice would be hard to make.

90cummins

 

[Gary Fowler]

If you follow mfg. directions on break-in, you wont need 200+ hours for the rings to seat. Every engine I have seen says to vary the engine speed and load during the first 50 hours of operation with only limited time at WOT then fall back to around 75% power but always loading up the engine. A heavy load for 50 hours helps seat the rings more so than 200 hours at minimal load.
Too many hours with a non-detergent break-in oil will cause a lot of carbon buildup that will do more harm than good. As for whether you use a diesel rated dino oil or full synthetic after the 50 hours should be of no consequence as far as ring seating and break-in..
I changed the oil in my new LS at 50 hours and the oil was as clear as the day it was put in (suspect because it was a non-detergent break-in oil). After I put in some Shell Rotella T6, within an hour of running the oil was as black as graphite showing that it was cutting out the buildup of carbon from the engine. The engine uses no oil between changes now. I have done this on every new vehicle I have bought and never have I had any issues with oil consumption.
I have had new engines on boats, motorcycles, cars, trucks, lawn mowers and airplanes and never seen a OEM manual recommending 200 hours of break-in. 50 hours seems to be the standard or at first required oil change which on newer automobiles is at around 7500 miles if you follow the advise of the on board oil monitor.

OF course everyone is free to follow what ever free advice that they come across. It is usually worth what you pay for it. I tend to follow the owner's manual rather than some jake-legged dealer person who likely has never looked at the OEM manual for maintenance for anything they sell.

 

[Kc8ehd]

I got in touch with LS their answer was as long as it is api CJ-4 (actually at the time I was asking about Rotella T6 5W40)

 

[Langanobob]

What do you mean not a synthetic!

Royal Purple Performance Lubricants

Long story short, some years ago Castrol came out with a highly refined petroleum based oil and marketed it as synthetic. Mobil sued them and lost. The ruling was that the oil had enough of the characteristics of a synthetic oil that it could legally be marketed as synthetic. End result is that many of the oils labeled synthetic these days are technically not synthetic. They are very good oil. Oil and additive packages have improved so much that it really doesn't matter what you use as long as it meets the viscosity and API spec and you change it when needed. I'm not convinced about getting oil analysis done, the cost of regular analysis seems like it approaches or exceeds the cost of just changing your oil so I don't see the point, unless it's an over the road truck or other large machine/tractor with huge oil capacity.

 

[Kc8ehd]

Oil analysis is a health check for your engine
If you suspect problems or just want to know the general overall condition it's a good tool ....with that said most tractor owners will never have one run...personally I think one at 50 or 100 hours is not a bad ideal to set a baseline....than every 500 to 1000 hours or even longer if no other problems are suspected .....extended oil changes in most home tractors are just not cost effective....

 

[dodge man]

Just my opinion, but unless you have an engine that holds a lot of oil, or think you have a problem, oil analysis is a waste of money. Also less money lost if the engine blows up on a small tractor vs one that cost big money.

 

[Langanobob]

Oil analysis is a health check for your engine
If you suspect problems or just want to know the general overall condition it's a good tool ....with that said most tractor owners will never have one run...personally I think one at 50 or 100 hours is not a bad ideal to set a baseline....than every 500 to 1000 hours or even longer if no other problems are suspected .....extended oil changes in most home tractors are just not cost effective....

Good points about using oil analysis as a tool for checking engine condition.

 

[Trillium Farm]

Long story short, some years ago Castrol came out with a highly refined petroleum based oil and marketed it as synthetic. Mobil sued them and lost. The ruling was that the oil had enough of the characteristics of a synthetic oil that it could legally be marketed as synthetic. End result is that many of the oils labeled synthetic these days are technically not synthetic. They are very good oil. Oil and additive packages have improved so much that it really doesn't matter what you use as long as it meets the viscosity and API spec and you change it when needed. I'm not convinced about getting oil analysis done, the cost of regular analysis seems like it approaches or exceeds the cost of just changing your oil so I don't see the point, unless it's an over the road truck or other large machine/tractor with huge oil capacity.

I'm 100% with you! Oil analysis are not worth the cost for us, only for fleet owners where they average-out the mileage of all their trucks does it make sense. The judge that adjudicated the Castrol-Mobil trial did a great disservice to the consumer. Mobil too then went to a non synthetic oil and called it synthetic.

 

[Kc8ehd]

It's hydocracked oil which is synthetic not as good as an ester but considerable cheaper and a high grade oil. .....