rules prohibiting political discussions

[srjones]

I have to agree that's better to leave politics out of the discussion.

 

[California]

... I have followed several very civil, and interesting discussions that were cut off in the prime of their lives, due to this rule, sometimes by one, or two posters.

I am wondering if other members would join me in appealing to the TBN hierarchy for more latitude in this area.

Politics is a very hot topic right now, and certainly, people are interested, and concerned, right now. This is unquestionably an important subject.

May I suggest, perhaps the discussions would not be ended, provided ideas are being exchanged, and the discussions remain civil. Were mostly adults here, and can benefit in the exchange of these ideas, just as well as any others.

I will agree with the proprietors that politics should remain off limits. We have all seen how divisive political discussions can become.

But I am guessing that your post was caused by the abrupt end today of the thread titled 'Depression'. That had been, in my opinion, a collection of forecasts on where the economy is going, and had avoided labelling specific political parties as responsible for economic realities that are impossible to miss. OK so far.

I felt it was a mistake to abort that thread the moment someone interjected a political comment. Better, in my opinion, would be a moderator post requesting that politics not be brought into the discussion. (And if necessary, removing posts, with a brief explanation, if the political poster refuses to follow the guidance.)

Some of these threads are valuable in sharing information from all parts of the country. One of the strengths of this board is the diversity of viewpoints. So long as we can all get along with one another I think discussions that drift into larger issues such as the economy, and its impact on individual members, are valuable to all of us. That thread that died today had 192 posts. Just before the final posts, was one noting 20,000 layoffs at Caterpillar and a comment that this appears to be a part of a global slowdown. To me that's a sharing of knowledge, not a political position. I was sorry to see that entire thread ended for a single follow-on comment that was unsuitable.

 

[JB4310]

Yup, Thankfully no need for politics while discussing tractors and Implements, unfortunately once we start talking about many of the related topics, like guns, economy, environment, taxes, building regulations etc etc etc. things we all have interests and concerns about, politics will eventually crop it's ugly head up.

At which time, also thankfully, Bird will promptly LOP IT OFF!!!

JB.

 

[ray66v]

I will agree with the proprietors that politics should remain off limits. We have all seen how divisive political discussions can become.

But I am guessing that your post was caused by the abrupt end today of the thread titled 'Depression'. That had been, in my opinion, a collection of forecasts on where the economy is going, and had avoided labelling specific political parties as responsible for economic realities that are impossible to miss. OK so far.

I felt it was a mistake to abort that thread the moment someone interjected a political comment. Better, in my opinion, would be a moderator post requesting that politics not be brought into the discussion. (And if necessary, removing posts, with a brief explanation, if the political poster refuses to follow the guidance.)

Some of these threads are valuable in sharing information from all parts of the country. One of the strengths of this board is the diversity of viewpoints. So long as we can all get along with one another I think discussions that drift into larger issues such as the economy, and its impact on individual members, are valuable to all of us. That thread that died today had 192 posts. Just before the final posts, was one noting 20,000 layoffs at Caterpillar and a comment that this appears to be a part of a global slowdown. To me that's a sharing of knowledge, not a political position. I was sorry to see that entire thread ended for a single follow-on comment that was unsuitable.

Yes, this was one of the threads I'm referring to.

I don't necessarily advocate threads debating all out political discussion, (although I also don't rule this out). The thought I had in my OP was that terminating an exchange of ideas like this, is a shame just because the discussion reaches a certain point, even if all parties are being civil.

I suggest that perhaps this type of shift in the discussion, should not necessarily be terminal.

I agree that most people have their political minds made up. But, I believe we could benefit from a better understanding of the opposition and the reasons for their position.

An example of this was a recent discussion involving unions. I believe there were a lot of good points made on both sides.

Finding common ground, through civil discussion, can at the very least, increase understanding of what is happening to the US.

If you not interested in political discussion, you could simply change threads. It does not have to mean the rest of us can't discuss it. If the thread was marked as political somehow, then you could simply avoid it all together.

The moderators could still pull the plug, as they do, when it becomes necessary, just not right as the discussion starts.

 

[Alan L.]

There are a couple of boards I frequent where we talk politics. Some I've been on for 10 years, and I have never changed anyone's mind about anything and nobody has changed, mine. Seems like its really debate, one tries to copy and paste the best article that supports their side. It has gone from cordial to downright nasty, then after so many years, you miss any of ones you argue the most with, if they leave the board (or get kicked off).

Probably not a good thing for this community.

 

[kenmac]

After discussing tractors gets tiring, you start talking about implements, and then projects done with them, and then what you need to fix what you broke, and last, what you can buy next with the CHECKS from our new preziden.
David from jax

Yes, but, talking about shavers, what type of truck to buy, circuit city, going out of bus,plumbing ,HVAC, etc,etc, isn't exactly talking about tractors or implements

 

[EddieWalker]

One of the strengths of this site is the variety of topics that are discussed here. While most of us found it for a tractor related reason, I'd assume that most stay around because of all the other things that are discussed on here that might or might not have anything to do with tractors. I have several tractors and an interest in other tractors, but there is a limit to how long that stays interesting. If mine are working and I don't need to buy anything for them, then there's a very limited amount of knowledge that I can share or even care to learn about everyone elses tractor. Your tractor might be the greatest thing on the planet, but I honestly don't care about it other then what you might do with it.

This to me is where TBN shines. The open discussion of what we do with our land and how we go about doing it. Building a house/barn on a piece of proparty or growing a garden is always new and interesting. Just about everything that happens on your land is interesting because I have land too, and either have or might some day to the same thing.

Limiting the topics to just tractors wold limit TBN to a very small site with a limited amount of information. As we've seen, the owners and moderators have hit a combination that works. Killing a thread that starts to go political or offensive early in it's tracks might offend a few people, but for the overall health of the site, it's proven to be very effective. I've had more then one thread deleted or closed. It happens and I've always known when I crossed the line. I'm not bothered by it happening and just hope that I got my point across to the person I was trying to insult before it was removed. LOL

Without naming names or websites, there was a group of people here who wanted to talk politics and not have any moderators. They started their own forum and did just that. I checked it out a few times, but found it to be a very unpleasant place to be. While they tried to have a variety of discussions, it was mostly a two sided political site. Unfortunately for me, I read too many of those posts and learned about a side to some of the posters here who used to enjoy reading their posts. Their pure outright hatred and ager was more then I can comprehend. In the course of a discussion, they would post attack after attack. When somebody challenged their attack, they would never reply to that challenge with facts or a rebuttal, but attack that person. It was sad to see what that people are really like. Kind of like finding out a friend of yours is really an animal abuser. If you never seen him beating that animal, you'd never have any problems with him, but the first time you saw him attack his pet, you will never be able to deal with him again.

Thankfully, the people that I'm refering to are no longer on here.

Eddie

 

[Bird]

I don't necessarily advocate threads debating all out political discussion, (although I also don't rule this out).

Therein lies the problem, Ray. At what point it should be cut off is a matter of opinion rather than clear cut fact, and opinions vary; always have, always will. So, yes, the rules are simple, the enforcement sometimes is not, since the moderators have to go by their own opinions, knowing that not everyone is going to agree. Are we always right? Of course not! We just have to do the best we can, and if the owner of TBN, or the other moderators, wish to overrule me on something I've done, it won't bother me a bit; won't cost me a nickel.

And if the owner of TBN wishes to change the rules, that's entirely up to him. But if you look at how successful TBN has been and how it's grown, the feller that makes the rules must be doing something right.

But there's nothing wrong with you, or anyone else, suggesting any changes you think will make TBN a better website.

 

[Bird]

Eddie, looks like you and I were typing at the same time. And you mention being moderated yourself; you know I have been, too, and needed to be.

 

[ray66v]

Therein lies the problem, Ray. At what point it should be cut off is a matter of opinion rather than clear cut fact, and opinions vary; always have, always will. So, yes, the rules are simple, the enforcement sometimes is not, since the moderators have to go by their own opinions, knowing that not everyone is going to agree. Are we always right? Of course not! We just have to do the best we can, and if the owner of TBN, or the other moderators, wish to overrule me on something I've done, it won't bother me a bit; won't cost me a nickel.

And if the owner of TBN wishes to change the rules, that's entirely up to him. But if you look at how successful TBN has been and how it's grown, the feller that makes the rules must be doing something right.

But there's nothing wrong with you, or anyone else, suggesting any changes you think will make TBN a better website.

Thank you for weighing in Bird.

I realize the position being a moderator sometimes puts you in, and have always considered you to be fair in applying the rules as they are currently written.

With all that is happening, and so many discussions edging on being technically political, several threads have been closed because of politics, this would suggest that members do, from time to time, wish to at the least, discuss "fringe" topics.

This does not mean I am suggesting threads be started like Bush vs. Obama on TBN.

What I am suggesting here, is if a discussion about cars turns into a discussion about a free trade agreement, that perhaps it be allowed to continue. And then perhaps it can be flagged as having this limited political content, for those who do not wish engage in it.

With things that people have strong opinions on regularly discussed here, I'd like to see a thread that is popular, and civil, be allowed more latitude. And I hope this discussion can promote the consideration of such, by the owner.