boutym
Silver Member
Well, you could say he went to bat for me, but what's pissing me off is that here we are 3 months later and I still don't have the documentation he promised, the lights fixed as he said he would and the spring he promised.
Service Bulletin: "FC6187-Hydrostat Pedal Returning to Neutral
- Thread starter rayban1
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Well, you could say he went to bat for me, but what's pissing me off is that here we are 3 months later and I still don't have the documentation he promised, the lights fixed as he said he would and the spring he promised.
AxleHub
Elite Member
Greetings Boutym,
I've never been in the tractor business . . but I've had decades of experience in a different dealership business. I have always been too customer service oriented and paid the price for it too often.
There are good dealers and bad dealers . . Good customers and bad customers . . and hard working people and lazy people on both sides.
But your recent post helps to define how you fit in the scenario.
You wrote "Well, you could say he went to bat for me, but what's pissing me off".
You just had to say "but" because you haven't admitted YET that the rep went way out of his way to help you above and beyond his job requirement. You don't "feel that effort" . . you just feel your needs.
But what did you do to contribute or benefit the situation? Did you write a letter right after he left thanking him for his efforts and then summarizing the meeting and what items he would be sending you? That was your job you know. Your side of customer relations. Being a good cusypmer doesn't end with payng the invoice.
You are one and he deals with many . . yet he should do everything and you have no responsibilities ???
He went out of his way for you . . . WAY OUT OF HIS WAY You'll claim its "his job" . . and I'd claim his "job" is dealer oriented not end customer . . but the point is . . being a good customer means doing things too. If you didn't and still don't recognize his past efforts, if you didn't write him a letter summarizing your meeting and needs discussed yet to do . . how is that being a good customer ?
Again you are expecting positive and beneficial effort from others . . how about you ??? Or is it time for anothet "but" ?
JMHO
Axlehub
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boutym
Silver Member
If you experienced the frustration I've been through with this tractor you might think a little differently, but the key point is that I do realize that the rep went out of his way. However, I've also gone out of my way to be patient and as cordial as possible. The one thing that always amazes me though is that people think because they're going out of their way or because they've given you something for nothing it gives them an excuse.
Let me ask this. You bring your car into my dealership and it's damaged while there. First, I don't acknowledge the damage until you make note of it. Once you make note of it I say nothing and send you on your way. I'm sure you would be standing there wondering if I was ever going to address the issue. So, after giving you the benefit of the doubt nothing happens. You bring it up again and then I say I'll take care of it. You hear nothing else from me until a couple months later you bring it up again. I tell you I've been busy and the following week I'll take care of it for you. Another month goes by and you don't hear from me. You tell me what you would be thinking at that point.
I'll agree that the rep went out of his way to help deal with the initial issue and threw in a few goodies, but good business practice dictates that you follow through to completion. Key to this is good communication. I have my own business and know how this works. I have over 500 active customers and I make it a point to talk to each and every one of them at least once a month. I have several that don't need my services as often, yet I still reach out to them at least 3 times a year. When ANY of them have a need or want one is not any more important than the other. The guy that buys $200 worth of stuff one a year is just as important to me as the guy that buys several thousands every month. You never know when that $200 guy might turn into the several thousand dollar guy and vice versa. Not to mention the word of mouth business I might attract by doing nothing more than communicating. If there's a problem and I can't deliver right away, I keep the customer abreast of what's happening. THAT goes a LONG way in keeping customers happy. I however have had to chase this guy every step of the way. That is not good business and if anyone thinks it is or makes excuses for it they are not handling their business properly. It takes far more effort to recruit new customers than it does to retain the ones you have.
Think what you want, but I'd be willing to put money on the fact that if you were in my shoes you would think the same way I am about now.
Let me ask this. You bring your car into my dealership and it's damaged while there. First, I don't acknowledge the damage until you make note of it. Once you make note of it I say nothing and send you on your way. I'm sure you would be standing there wondering if I was ever going to address the issue. So, after giving you the benefit of the doubt nothing happens. You bring it up again and then I say I'll take care of it. You hear nothing else from me until a couple months later you bring it up again. I tell you I've been busy and the following week I'll take care of it for you. Another month goes by and you don't hear from me. You tell me what you would be thinking at that point.
I'll agree that the rep went out of his way to help deal with the initial issue and threw in a few goodies, but good business practice dictates that you follow through to completion. Key to this is good communication. I have my own business and know how this works. I have over 500 active customers and I make it a point to talk to each and every one of them at least once a month. I have several that don't need my services as often, yet I still reach out to them at least 3 times a year. When ANY of them have a need or want one is not any more important than the other. The guy that buys $200 worth of stuff one a year is just as important to me as the guy that buys several thousands every month. You never know when that $200 guy might turn into the several thousand dollar guy and vice versa. Not to mention the word of mouth business I might attract by doing nothing more than communicating. If there's a problem and I can't deliver right away, I keep the customer abreast of what's happening. THAT goes a LONG way in keeping customers happy. I however have had to chase this guy every step of the way. That is not good business and if anyone thinks it is or makes excuses for it they are not handling their business properly. It takes far more effort to recruit new customers than it does to retain the ones you have.
Think what you want, but I'd be willing to put money on the fact that if you were in my shoes you would think the same way I am about now.
boutym
Silver Member
I also haven't mentioned the over $1000 it cost me when the machine wasn't returned to me the week they had promised. That's another story, but it does factor into my thought process.
cdaigle430
Veteran Member
Quite simple really, your making this more complicated than needed. Can you drive your tractor to the dealership? I didnt think so. Agco should be for them to come out or delivery costs....its their mistake not mine or the dealers. 120 miles though is excessive but that should be up to Agco.
cdaigle430
Veteran Member
Havent received any yet mine is a 2010 2410. Looks like I am good to go and I dont have a problem with creeping.
AxleHub
Elite Member
Greetings boutym,
You stated:
"If you experienced the frustration I've been through with this tractor you might think a little differently, but the key point is that I do realize that the rep went out of his way. "
Well lets test that theory. The field sales rep for Massey didn't have anything to do with your issues with your dealer or the second dealer. Yet you are lumping your total issues in. You may or may not have justified issues with either or both dealers . . but all of that time frame has nothing to do with the field sales rep. except he cashed in a favor to get you to the second dealer. So in my opinion . . The frustration with the tractor is different entities related.
You stated: " However, I've also gone out of my way to be patient and as cordial as possible."
But you're not telling me what you've DONE as a customer in dealing with this field sales rep.. until I challeneged your post you wouldn't even admit he'd gone out of his way to do something that isn't his required job? Being cordial and patient is just the same thing he did with you before he actually started his effort . . the minimum standard for being human.
So lets review your efforts since he came to your location:
1. Did you send him a letter thanking him for substatial efforts above and beyond the call of duty? I would have because he definitely deserved it.
2. Did you summarize your meeting with him and the items to be done? I would have because its how things get completed and it assures quality communication on my end and no mis-undetstandings. Minimum customer standard. By the way . . it also creates not just a reminder for him . . but a checklist for you to follow back on.
3. Since he was there . . . how have you followed up.
Boutym . . you now mention you own a business and deal with customer service . . that tells me . . . You and I should know the same issues . . but I'm not seeing your pro active efforts as a customer in this situation. I'm not hearing effort.
Finally, you stated:
"I however have had to chase this guy every step of the way. That is not good business and if anyone thinks it is or makes excuses for it they are not handling their business properly."
You keep forgetting the point . .
a field sales rep's job is not you. His customer is the dealer . . not you.
Now I don't know the real story about you and the 2 dealers you've been involved with . . only what you've written. But you've been "chasing" a guy who isn't paid and isn't time-scheduled or evaluated on dealing with you . . . and you have yet to write how you have made his efforts acknowledged or easier to accomplish. When you deal with YOUR customer's . . that IS YOUR JOB. When that field sales rep deals with his dealers . . that is his job. The fact he has helped you is an extraordinary effort . . and I haven't seen in your writing . . where you've even been a good standard customer effort on your part yet.
I've stated exactly not what I "would do" . . I've stated what I always do as a customer. And I don't see those efforts as exceptional or at all unusual. And the field sales rep. certainly has beem exceptional.
P.S. and I've been in situations like your's many times . . and positive motivation is much more effective to deal with hurdles.
JMHO
Axlehub
You stated:
"If you experienced the frustration I've been through with this tractor you might think a little differently, but the key point is that I do realize that the rep went out of his way. "
Well lets test that theory. The field sales rep for Massey didn't have anything to do with your issues with your dealer or the second dealer. Yet you are lumping your total issues in. You may or may not have justified issues with either or both dealers . . but all of that time frame has nothing to do with the field sales rep. except he cashed in a favor to get you to the second dealer. So in my opinion . . The frustration with the tractor is different entities related.
You stated: " However, I've also gone out of my way to be patient and as cordial as possible."
But you're not telling me what you've DONE as a customer in dealing with this field sales rep.. until I challeneged your post you wouldn't even admit he'd gone out of his way to do something that isn't his required job? Being cordial and patient is just the same thing he did with you before he actually started his effort . . the minimum standard for being human.
So lets review your efforts since he came to your location:
1. Did you send him a letter thanking him for substatial efforts above and beyond the call of duty? I would have because he definitely deserved it.
2. Did you summarize your meeting with him and the items to be done? I would have because its how things get completed and it assures quality communication on my end and no mis-undetstandings. Minimum customer standard. By the way . . it also creates not just a reminder for him . . but a checklist for you to follow back on.
3. Since he was there . . . how have you followed up.
Boutym . . you now mention you own a business and deal with customer service . . that tells me . . . You and I should know the same issues . . but I'm not seeing your pro active efforts as a customer in this situation. I'm not hearing effort.
Finally, you stated:
"I however have had to chase this guy every step of the way. That is not good business and if anyone thinks it is or makes excuses for it they are not handling their business properly."
You keep forgetting the point . .
a field sales rep's job is not you. His customer is the dealer . . not you.
Now I don't know the real story about you and the 2 dealers you've been involved with . . only what you've written. But you've been "chasing" a guy who isn't paid and isn't time-scheduled or evaluated on dealing with you . . . and you have yet to write how you have made his efforts acknowledged or easier to accomplish. When you deal with YOUR customer's . . that IS YOUR JOB. When that field sales rep deals with his dealers . . that is his job. The fact he has helped you is an extraordinary effort . . and I haven't seen in your writing . . where you've even been a good standard customer effort on your part yet.
I've stated exactly not what I "would do" . . I've stated what I always do as a customer. And I don't see those efforts as exceptional or at all unusual. And the field sales rep. certainly has beem exceptional.
P.S. and I've been in situations like your's many times . . and positive motivation is much more effective to deal with hurdles.
JMHO
Axlehub
boutym
Silver Member
I really don't get where you're going with this. Yes I have a business, but I don't expect my customers to slather me with praise each time I do what I need to do as a business owner to keep them happy. Yea, some of them send me a nice letter, take me out for a beer or whatever, but I don't expect it and I don't treat them any differently if they don't. If I or my employees have an expectation of getting praised by a customer for doing their job or going above and beyond then we need to be making money another way.
I also realize the dealer is his customer, but AGCO deemed it fit to put him in charge of this and as such I become his customer by proxy. His ONLY job here is to understand the issues and coordinate the repair of those issues when the original dealer would not honor their commitment. Once again, he did get me some extras, but this doesn't make up for my **** coming back broken and then my having to wait for months to get it fixed.
How about you answer my question about how you would deal with my company breaking your ****, not following up properly and not showing you any signs of making it right. You act as though I'm calling this guy regularly and screaming at him like he's a child. That is not at all the case.
And by the way, this wasn't a recall issue. That recall applied to the older models where the tractor wouldn't stop moving even when the brake was applied.
I also realize the dealer is his customer, but AGCO deemed it fit to put him in charge of this and as such I become his customer by proxy. His ONLY job here is to understand the issues and coordinate the repair of those issues when the original dealer would not honor their commitment. Once again, he did get me some extras, but this doesn't make up for my **** coming back broken and then my having to wait for months to get it fixed.
How about you answer my question about how you would deal with my company breaking your ****, not following up properly and not showing you any signs of making it right. You act as though I'm calling this guy regularly and screaming at him like he's a child. That is not at all the case.
And by the way, this wasn't a recall issue. That recall applied to the older models where the tractor wouldn't stop moving even when the brake was applied.
AxleHub
Elite Member
Greetings Bountym
You wrote: " but I don't expect my customers to slather me with praise each time I do what I need to do as a business owner to keep them happy. "
You've never read anything I wrote that said slathering people with anything. And words like "screaming" weren't in my writing either. Stop being emotional and over stating everything and start seeing your own words "business owner" in your thinking". The field sales rep is not comparable to you in your own business.
What I keep seeing is your not wanting to tell me what you did since the field sales rep was at your location . . and I'm estimating you are avoiding it because you expect him to do everything and you nothing and you know too well if customers did that to your employees that you'd have problems. Can't your employees forget something on a busy day of a busy week? But yet the field sales guy can't?
Despite your writing : " but AGCO deemed it fit to put him in charge of this and as such I become his customer by proxy. His ONLY job here is to understand the issues and coordinate the repair of those issues when the original dealer would not honor their commitment. "
I just believe you have an expectation of the field sales rep that is huge . . and no expectation for yourself. Did Agco empower the rep or is he just trying to make it better on his own personal time and effort ?
That field rep has a ton of jobs that don't include you. But that isn't what you wrote. Would you put that same burden on your employees and them require nothing from the customer and everything of that employee?
As far as your supposed example you want me to respond to . . Once again . . you want to lump the field sales rep in with the dealer and the other dealer. How can anyone expect compound responsibility with compartmentalized activity?
Isn't the goal to get results? So send the field sales rep a letter just reminding him of your conversation when he was there (if you want to also email a copy thats fine but NOT just email alone). Apologize that you were so late in following up (because you are late) and recognize he is also late or forgot to do it. There is zero manipulation here . . . you haven't participated and now you are.
I truly don't understand why you want to blame him for the actions of others . . but take no responsibility for a lack of your own actions.
If you aren't capable of recognizing my point of view . . its not for my lack of communication skills. I am neither unclear or emotional.
You can choose to agree or disagree . . but being able to recognize there is the "possibility" you are wrong and there is a legitimate better point of view . . thats a different story.
JMHO
Axlehub
You wrote: " but I don't expect my customers to slather me with praise each time I do what I need to do as a business owner to keep them happy. "
You've never read anything I wrote that said slathering people with anything. And words like "screaming" weren't in my writing either. Stop being emotional and over stating everything and start seeing your own words "business owner" in your thinking". The field sales rep is not comparable to you in your own business.
What I keep seeing is your not wanting to tell me what you did since the field sales rep was at your location . . and I'm estimating you are avoiding it because you expect him to do everything and you nothing and you know too well if customers did that to your employees that you'd have problems. Can't your employees forget something on a busy day of a busy week? But yet the field sales guy can't?
Despite your writing : " but AGCO deemed it fit to put him in charge of this and as such I become his customer by proxy. His ONLY job here is to understand the issues and coordinate the repair of those issues when the original dealer would not honor their commitment. "
I just believe you have an expectation of the field sales rep that is huge . . and no expectation for yourself. Did Agco empower the rep or is he just trying to make it better on his own personal time and effort ?
That field rep has a ton of jobs that don't include you. But that isn't what you wrote. Would you put that same burden on your employees and them require nothing from the customer and everything of that employee?
As far as your supposed example you want me to respond to . . Once again . . you want to lump the field sales rep in with the dealer and the other dealer. How can anyone expect compound responsibility with compartmentalized activity?
Isn't the goal to get results? So send the field sales rep a letter just reminding him of your conversation when he was there (if you want to also email a copy thats fine but NOT just email alone). Apologize that you were so late in following up (because you are late) and recognize he is also late or forgot to do it. There is zero manipulation here . . . you haven't participated and now you are.
I truly don't understand why you want to blame him for the actions of others . . but take no responsibility for a lack of your own actions.
If you aren't capable of recognizing my point of view . . its not for my lack of communication skills. I am neither unclear or emotional.
You can choose to agree or disagree . . but being able to recognize there is the "possibility" you are wrong and there is a legitimate better point of view . . thats a different story.
JMHO
Axlehub
boutym
Silver Member
I was not an *** to anyone. I've been waiting 3 months for something that could and should have been handled in a week or two. I still haven't been an *** to anyone. You keep making a senseless argument. HE was the one promising things. HE was the one that I had to deal with. At no time would the dealer deal directly with me on any of this. I was always referred back to HIM. AGCO keeps referring me back to HIM. HE IS THE GUY AND HE IS THE ONE MAKING THE PROMISES TO DELIVER. Just exactly who the **** else do I put the responsibility on ???????????????????
Do you think I dug up a phone number and called this freaking guy out of the blue and he all of a sudden helped me out? He was assigned by AGCO to deal with the issues. Should he not be held responsible to do what AGCO assigned him to do??? Tell me who to hold responsible if not the one who was given the job.
Do you think I dug up a phone number and called this freaking guy out of the blue and he all of a sudden helped me out? He was assigned by AGCO to deal with the issues. Should he not be held responsible to do what AGCO assigned him to do??? Tell me who to hold responsible if not the one who was given the job.
