Solar Interest and Selling Power Back

[ultrarunner]

Thats why distribution rates (especially in rural areas) are so much more per kwh than generation.

Look at the miles of power lines, millions of poles that need periodic maintenance, and all the employees, linemen, etc it takes to distribute. All the transformers, meters, etc etc. The distribution side is indeed a HUGE cost of our electrical grid

True enough but highest rates at my solar location is city with half million users and mostly 4,000-5,000 feet residential lots

The utility poles date from the 1920’s and some checked so much I can put half my hand into the pole

 

[cqaigy2]

Thats why distribution rates (especially in rural areas) are so much more per kwh than generation.

True enough but highest rates at my solar location is city with half million users and mostly 4,000-5,000 feet residential lots

The utility poles date from the 1920’s and some checked so much I can put half my hand into the pole

Stock holders need some love too. Those poles are still standing, some must be good enough....

 

[Roric]

In following with the title of this thread; (but not to do with the initial
question):
With the gathering momentum money and interest in electric cars, it is
probable that they will be common.
Much is said about the coming stress on the existing power grid and all
of the problem pressure points this will cause.

What if this could be headed off before it is out of hand?

California has a program is in place to buy power from Tesla Powerwall units
at times of great electrical demand. (did I hear at $4.00 per KWH?)
A Powerwall is about 10KWH. The amount of power that can be used from the
owners battery is adjustable and 'tunable': you can opt in/out for certain times.

Late model electric car batteries are around 60KWH.
These cars are charged by and connected to the grid.

A large scale adapted vehicle-to-grid scheme might accomplish a few things:
-Time shift power demand on utilities.
-reduce power disruptions from 'brownouts'
-reduce the need for 'peaking plants' built to ride out solar
and wind shortcomings.
-decentralize the existing large and aging electrical grid.
-combined with solar production to avail a different power source.

Supposing that the needs of the electric utilities, the requirements of the
car owners and the needed level of safety and reliability could be engineered
into this scheme it could become a viable thing.
In addition to or in place of huge 'battery farms' already coming to a
place near you. EV batteries will soon be a standing resource.

Maybe in addition to, or replacing part of the infrastructure bill spending
making power a two-way street could be something
Needed compromises on the utilities part would be titanic, power brokers across the
nationwide grid would need oceanic adaptations. The engineering exists now.
California may be laughed at and criticized, but many times it leads the way.

This is just an idea.

 

[Pearlsnaps]

My $.02 worth...
I have a small system about 6kw. Ground mount, and I've done everything bit by bit. I don't sell back yet, TVEC (co-op) does not like it's members to sell back. My inverter is a Sol-Ark unit. It has the option for Zero export mode. I think that's what it's called. There are these sensors that you place on the power lines that feed your house, and it will basically use enough solar that's available to offset what your house is using. I do have batteries that will get me through the night on all but the hottest days here in North Texas. My family of seven live in a small home as energy efficient as possible with mini split air conditioners and LED lights. We average in the highest months about 400 kW for the whole month. That's what we pay for. The co-op has all kinds of extra fees added on for the privilege of being of a member and using their electricity. I would need to add more panels to make enough to sell back at their very low purchase price of my electricity. It's not really worth it.
The best part about my system is when the grid goes down, I keep going. With all the storms and accidents that happen out here where I'm at, I've never run out of electricity. Doing it yourself nowadays, there are so many systems out there that do grid tie and don't even have to use batteries. Everything is set up where it's one unit and you just plug in your solar, then you plug in your house wires and it does all the work for you. I have 15 kilowatt hours of storage and I've done all of the work myself. My inverter cost about $5,500 and it will do everything from off-grid to grid tied and sell back if I turn that option on. I bought slightly used solar panels instead of brand new retail price solar panels. All in all I have about $11,000 in my build, that took me about 2yrs to put together.
Currently it should last me the next 10 years and by the end of September I will not use any electricity at all as my batteries will power me through the evening and well into the next day.
Just my $.02 worth.

 

[ponytug]

The California buy back program is only on specially declared high demand days, for the moment only for Tesla batteries, and only in Pacific Gas and Electric territories.

The rate is currently $2./kWh of excess power that you use from your batteries during the declared time period. So if the time is 5-9pm, and you normally use 4kWh between 5-9pm on a normal day, and you discharge 24kWh from your batteries, you would get 24-4=20x$2. forty dollars.

More here if you are curious.

Emergency Load Reduction Pilot | Tesla Support

Participate in the Emergency Load Reduction Program (ELRP) pilot offered by Pacific Gas and Electric Company (PG&E) and support the grid while also earning compensation and maintaining your energy security.

www.tesla.com

National grid runs one in Massachusetts and Connecticut that is similar.

All the best,

Peter

 

[ultrarunner]

kW usage seems to varies a lot depending on location, size and efficiency...

I have years of data in Oakland CA for 2400 square foot 1950's home of 2.5 bath and 4 bedrooms...

No double pane windows or energy savings that was not available in the 1950's except LED lights.

Year in and year out, summer or winter the usage is 12 kW per day or 360 kW per month.

40-60 year old electric appliances including 1980 Amana Refrigerator and 1965 Amana Freezer...

I think some nearly use in a day what we use in a month unless I'm missing something?

 

[LD1]

My $.02 worth...
I have a small system about 6kw. Ground mount, and I've done everything bit by bit. I don't sell back yet, TVEC (co-op) does not like it's members to sell back. My inverter is a Sol-Ark unit. It has the option for Zero export mode. I think that's what it's called. There are these sensors that you place on the power lines that feed your house, and it will basically use enough solar that's available to offset what your house is using. I do have batteries that will get me through the night on all but the hottest days here in North Texas. My family of seven live in a small home as energy efficient as possible with mini split air conditioners and LED lights. We average in the highest months about 400 kW for the whole month. That's what we pay for. The co-op has all kinds of extra fees added on for the privilege of being of a member and using their electricity. I would need to add more panels to make enough to sell back at their very low purchase price of my electricity. It's not really worth it.
The best part about my system is when the grid goes down, I keep going. With all the storms and accidents that happen out here where I'm at, I've never run out of electricity. Doing it yourself nowadays, there are so many systems out there that do grid tie and don't even have to use batteries. Everything is set up where it's one unit and you just plug in your solar, then you plug in your house wires and it does all the work for you. I have 15 kilowatt hours of storage and I've done all of the work myself. My inverter cost about $5,500 and it will do everything from off-grid to grid tied and sell back if I turn that option on. I bought slightly used solar panels instead of brand new retail price solar panels. All in all I have about $11,000 in my build, that took me about 2yrs to put together.
Currently it should last me the next 10 years and by the end of September I will not use any electricity at all as my batteries will power me through the evening and well into the next day.
Just my $.02 worth

Family of seven......only using 400kwh....

Must be all gas? Gas water heater, gas stove, gas dryer?

 

[workinonit]

Yea, I've read some ridiculously low usage numbers. Mine is 30 times that.

 

[LD1]

Im a family of 4, all electric, geothermal, central ohio climate.......and I am usually ~1300kwh in the spring and fall when very little HVAC is needed. ~1700-1800 in the heat of the summer and peak AC loading. And ~2300 in the coldest months of the winter.

I do run some rope LED lights, a waterfall pump, and leave the front LED porch light on that total ~250w.........or about 180kwh per month. Thats about the ONLY think I could eliminate to conserve energy if I truly wanted to.

My shop is on a separate meter. Im only at my shop on average 1-2 times a week. With ONLY a fridge, and a 175w dusk to dawn running when Im not down there......I still hit 5-6kwh per day. So dont understand how a WHOLE home with SEVEN people can live on ~13kwh/day unless everything is a gas appliance and the ONLY thing your electric does is lights and a fridge

 

[hube2]

I don't know if this has been mentioned, but the most important thing for me was the ROI, how likely it was that I would see the break even point where my solar had saved me as much as my out of pocket expense to put in. For my usages and the system I put in that was right around 10 years not taking into account any increases in the cost of electric in my area.

Another factor for me was how long I could expect it to keep working after the break even point, how many years I would continue to see savings after it paid for itself and how many of those years I was likely to see.

The goal for me was to save money and not be paying for 100% of my electric usage when I retire.