Stick welding question

[Shield Arc]

As well as stacked a few dimes of welds in it - LOL.

Thank you very much!

If I ever accidentally come across one of those 10lb rod ovens at a great price (under $40), I will probably buy one and buy some 7018 from someone that uses it regularly and stores it right so I don't have to wonder about the new-but-wet stuff. Practical? Nope. Do I need it for my piddling? Heck Nope. Will I do that just to say I have properly stored 7018? Probably. LOL

Ian

There has been an ad on my Craig's list for months, the guy is way south of me, he's been trying to sell a pallet load of 10# rod ovens for $200.00. So there is deals out there, just have to keep looking.

 

[k0ua]

Heck I spent the first 30 plus years of my life without a welder and tinkering on junk and making improvised repairs with clamps, wire, bolted scab plates, etc in lieu of welding. I was in heaven when I obtained the ability to weld even at my rudimentary skill level

The only difference in this story and my story is that it was 40 years for me instead of 30. I just got tired of scabbing things together with hardware and scrapped up enough money for a Lincoln AC225. The thing payed for itself pretty quickly keep a couple of old lawn mowers patched up. Then when I go my DC inverter welder I was really on cloud 9. Now I am learning how to TIG using the DC welder, and it is great..

James K0UA

 

[Shield Arc]

Well, You are correct in that welding is only a hobby for me. I too have hobbies that I am much less practical with in regards to splurging with costs (ATV'ing, camping, antique tractors, dining out, etc.).

I probably could put more money towards welding, but it would be at a cost somewhere else in my budget that I am not currently willing to sacrifice. In cracks me up when all the retired people mention living on a fixed income. I am in my 40's and working, but my income is fixed too and there is still only so much money to spread around.

Heck I spent the first 30 plus years of my life without a welder and tinkering on junk and making improvised repairs with clamps, wire, pop rivets, bolted scab plates, etc in lieu of welding. I was in heaven when I obtained the ability to weld even at my rudimentary skill level.

Until my equipment becomes the limiting factor in my welding processes then I do not see myself upgrading any. Until I can utilize the equipment that I have to its full potential then no need to upgrade as my skills are currently the limiting factor not the equipment.

That's about the way I am with a lathe, people walk into my shop and ask where is your lathe? I can only think of very few times in my life when I needed a lathe, I have a couple friends with complete machine shops, I'm not wasting valuable floor space on a lathe, if I find any free space I'll buy another welder!:licking::laughing:

 

[Haywire]

pallet load of 10# rod ovens for $200.00

Did a craigs search an hour or so ago and nothing came up for "Rod Oven" in a 400 mile radius.... well, I got hits on a bunch of kitchen ovens, but not exactly the same. When I said "accidentally", I meant come across one while perusing the junk shops. Even if I found one on craigs for a good price, I probably wouldn't go after it. It would have to appear on a shelf beside a bunch of old hammers and hoes with the checkout a few feet away.

Ian

 

[rankrank1]

The only difference in this story and my story is that it was 40 years for me instead of 30. I just got tired of scabbing things together with hardware and scrapped up enough money for a Lincoln AC225. The thing payed for itself pretty quickly keep a couple of old lawn mowers patched up. Then when I go my DC inverter welder I was really on cloud 9. Now I am learning how to TIG using the DC welder, and it is great. James K0UA

Yep some repairs are almost impossible without a welder (e.g. building up worn parts or oblonged shaped holes comes to mind).

I picked up an ebay tig torch with manual gas valve off ebay that I plan to try out on my Miller Thunderbolt AC225/DC150 buzzbox. It would be an old school set-up similar to what Shieldarc set-up for the kid he has been helping to use on his Hobart Stickmate.

I doubt that I will ever use tig much, but it was such a minmal investment to try it. I will have less than $60 invested so figured why not.

 

[Shield Arc]

I ran a Tig rig on this machine for years. Try getting an amp or 3 change with that slide handle.:laughing:

 

[rankrank1]

I ran a Tig rig on this machine for years. Try getting an amp or 3 change with that slide handle.:laughing:

That looks like an old Century. My uncle used to have one that he purchased brand new back in the early 1990's from the home improvement store Builders Square (Builders Square is long since out of business and were the precursor to stores like Lowes, Home Depot, and Menards).

Anyway, I only had the privledge of using that Century buzzbox once and I was not all that impressed. Of course I did not have clue what I was doing either. I do remember that I did not like that slide adjustment handle. I do know after a couple years of use that my uncles Century spent more time with the shroud cover off as the cooling fan would not work properly and you had to reach in there and spin the fan to get it to work. I am sure a replacement fan would have fixed it, but it should not have needed one for no more use than it had and being nearly new.

Regardless this exposure to the Century was the welder that initially made me afraid to get a welder of my very own for many years. With AC/DC and high and low ports and that diffcult adjustment handle I firmly believed that there was no way that I would ever learn how to use one properly with all those complicated settings and ports. The internet changed all that fear.

If I recall correctly, I think the OCV voltage was only 72 on the Century buzzboxes. I will take the 79 OCV that Lincoln used or the 80 that Miller used anyday for slightly easier arc starts. Unfortunately UL (Underwriter Labratories) limited welders OCV to 80 volts max on homeowner grade buzzboxes sometime back in the 1950's or 1960's. Not sure if professional grade machines are limited in OCV or not.

 

[deereman75]

I ran a Tig rig on this machine for years. Try getting an amp or 3 change with that slide handle.:laughing:

You think that is hard, try to change the amps by 3 with this! :laughing:

Either too cold or too hot... Except for 3/32 6011, the 75 amp setting is spot on for that.

 

[Shield Arc]

Actually that is a Montgomery Wards machine. Seems as I remember reading in the brochure it was built by Lincoln. It has a pretty nice arc, but like you say what a pain to get a small change in amps, stick welding it's not too bad but Tig welding it would make a preacher curse!:laughing: It was bought in the mid 1970s, I couldn't bring myself to get rid of it, so it's parked so far back in the barn it would take a week for me to crawl back there!

 

[Shield Arc]

You think that is hard, try to change the amps by 3 with this! :laughing:
View attachment 244177
Either too cold or too hot... Except for 3/32 6011, the 75 amp setting is spot on for that.

I don't think I've ever run one of those, I'm gonna have to find someone who has one.

 

[deereman75]

I don't think I've ever run one of those, I'm gonna have to find someone who has one.

Or you could get one on craigslist for $100, try it, and resell it for $120.:laughing::thumbsup:

 

[Shield Arc]

You know sometimes I see them go pretty high on Craig's list! Seems as I've seen them in Costco for just a few hundred bucks.

 

[rankrank1]

You think that is hard, try to change the amps by 3 with this! :laughing:
View attachment 244177
Either too cold or too hot... Except for 3/32 6011, the 75 amp setting is spot on for that.

Well 1st off you will not be doing any tig since it is AC only machine - unless you add a DC convertor box. And I do agree that even if it were a an AC/DC machine then it would still not be the ideal choice for scratch start tig - but it is doable (see video below).

That said, In defense of the Lincoln tapped settings for newbies: The switch inherently picks the best comination of the primary and secondary windings within the transformer for optimum volt/amp curve automatically. No Hi/Lo type settings will ever be necessary and it is impossible to get this portion wrong. Supposedly each tapped setting was optimized for use for the common Lincoln rods so best results might be obtained by using Lincoln rods (although I always used any brand rod). Regardless with tapped settings you may have to adjust your travel speed to suit the amps being inputed instead of adjusting the amps to suit your travel speed. In short you personally adjust to the machine instead of adjusting the machine to you.

Another trick: Once you find a brand of rod that you like that works well for that setting you have on your welder then that is the brand that you go with for a given size and type. (Example: Lincoln 3/32 6011 will burn a little different than Hobart 6011 3/32 which may burn a little differnt yet as compared to say US Forge 3/32 6011). Sounds like you have already picked the brand that burns well at your available 75 amp setting for 3/32 6011. Now find the brand that works well with say 1/8" 6011 and a setting that you have on your welder and so forth.

Here is an old school AC225 with a home-made add on DC converter doing tig. (If you have an AC/DC to start with then you do not need the converter box).

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lV4tzg4zn0]Homemade Tig Welder - Tig Welding Old School with Scratch Start - YouTube[/ame]

 

[rankrank1]

Actually that is a Montgomery Wards machine. Seems as I remember reading in the brochure it was built by Lincoln....

FWIW: Century is the only manufacturer that I have ever seen use that unique amp adjuster slide lever . The Century welders were commonly rebadged as Montgomery Wards, Craftsmen, Dayton, other brands, etc.

Lincoln were also frequently rebadged as various house brands too, but usually kept the unique Lincoln adjuster dial as well as tomstone shape.

Lincoln did eventually buy Century and Century operated under the Lincoln umbrella for a few years before being pretty much phased out.

 

[Shield Arc]

FWIW: Century is the only manufacturer that I have ever seen use that unique amp adjuster slide lever . The Century welders were commonly rebadged as Montgomery Wards, Craftsmen, Dayton, other brands, etc.

You could very well be correct, it's been what oh around 37 years since I read that manual? And hey I'm one of those guys who only reads when all else fails! :laughing:

 

[deereman75]

Well 1st off you will not be doing any tig since it is AC only machine - unless you add a DC convertor box. And I do agree that even if it were a an AC/DC machine then it would still not be the ideal choice for scratch start tig - but it is doable (see video below).

That said, In defense of the Lincoln tapped settings for newbies: The switch inherently picks the best comination of the primary and secondary windings within the transformer for optimum volt/amp curve automatically. No Hi/Lo type settings will ever be necessary and it is impossible to get this portion wrong. Supposedly each tapped setting was optimized for use for the common Lincoln rods so best results might be obtained by using Lincoln rods (although I always used any brand rod). Regardless with tapped settings you may have to adjust your travel speed to suit the amps being inputed instead of adjusting the amps to suit your travel speed. In short you personally adjust to the machine instead of adjusting the machine to you.

Another trick: Once you find a brand of rod that you like that works well for that setting you have on your welder then that is the brand that you go with for a given size and type. (Example: Lincoln 3/32 6011 will burn a little different than Hobart 6011 3/32 which may burn a little differnt yet as compared to say US Forge 3/32 6011). Sounds like you have already picked the brand that burns well at your available 75 amp setting for 3/32 6011. Now find the brand that works well with say 1/8" 6011 and a setting that you have on your welder and so forth.

Here is an old school AC225 with a home-made add on DC converter doing tig. (If you have an AC/DC to start with then you do not need the converter box).

Homemade Tig Welder - Tig Welding Old School with Scratch Start - YouTube

I have seen that video a few times, neat to see, but not something I would do. The lincoln was great for me to learn on at first, because it was cheap, and you cant break it. I have to say the stepped settings, and ac output is getting to be a pain though. As I have said, I am planning on getting a heavy duty cc/cv inverter, and that will solve a lot of my problems.
#1 dc output
#2 infinatly adjustable output
#3 cc/cv output so I can hook up a wire feeder for a heavy duty mig
For those of you not familiar with the PowCon machines, here is a picture of one with a feeder.

 

[Shield Arc]

I never used one of those PowCons either. But years ago I was on a tunnel project, we ran engine drives that were placed on the street above us. But a good friend of mine was a heavy equipment mechanic that worked on the mole, and other machinery on the project. The company bought several PowCons for their shop. When the machines arrived my buddy laughed, said he'd burn it up by lunch. Mike told me for a solid week he tried his best to burn that machine up running dual shield! 2 years latter the machine was running just fine.:laughing:

 

[deereman75]

I never used one of those PowCons either. But years ago I was on a tunnel project, we ran engine drives that were placed on the street above us. But a good friend of mine was a heavy equipment mechanic that worked on the mole, and other machinery on the project. The company bought several PowCons for their shop. When the machines arrived my buddy laughed, said he'd burn it up by lunch. Mike told me for a solid week he tried his best to burn that machine up running dual shield! 2 years latter the machine was running just fine.:laughing:

Ya they are tough little machines. I have heard of a few that were used in mines, a welding supply got them as a trade in. When he opened them up, he found about 5 inches of mud in the bottom of each one. They all still worked like they were new. Try that with a new import!:laughing: A few people on weldingweb said the powcon machines have one of the nicest stick arcs there is.

 

[Shield Arc]

I know they were very popular in the 1980s. Are you going to buy one?

 

[Canada_CT230]

FWIW: Century is the only manufacturer that I have ever seen use that unique amp adjuster slide lever . The Century welders were commonly rebadged as Montgomery Wards, Craftsmen, Dayton, other brands, etc.

We figured my welder is a rebadged Century...under the Mastercraft name here in Canada sold by Canadian Tire (Auto Parts / Tool Store)