Strange Water Problem

[Anonymous Poster]

I know this sounds silly, but if your suspicion is with the Moens, why not swap one with one of the Deltas (if they will change), or go to Lowes and get a cheap one and see if it goes away on that fixture? Maybe that will point out something.

No, it's not silly. Swapping is out, but a cheapo temporary replacement is something I had half heartedly considered. Hearing it from someone else helps push it to the forefront.
I'll pick one up the next time I get to town.

Thanks,
SnowRidge

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Does the crud occurr in only cold water, only hot water, mixed water, or all of the above?

All of the above, Franz, but there seems to be slightly more from the cold side.

SnowRidge

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Could it be part of the ruptured bladder?

I thought about that too, but the grit is real hard and I would think the bladder would be a softer material. Besides, I can't imagine why it would show up now, years after that tank was replaced.

SnowRidge

 

[Anonymous Poster]

You didn't mention it but,do you have any water treatment devices ie filters,softeners,etc.
Filters use activated carbon which appears as black grit and it can escape from it's containment.

There are no filters or treatment devices of any kind, unless someone plumbed one or more inside the walls when the house was built, and I just can't imagine anyone doing that.


If you have a submersible well pump the graphite impeller or bearings could be desintigrating.......Mike

The pump was just replaced, Mike. The motor was frozen (locked rotor). The pump part of the pump, for lack of a better term, was still OK.

Replacing the pump made no discernable difference. We did get a lot of turbidity from the pump replacement activities, but that cleared right up in a couple of days. The black grit was still there, undiminished.

SnowRidge

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Have you checked the screens in the Delta faucets, maybe they are doing a better job of removing the grit.

Yes I have. The Moen screens are more effective. When I first looked into this, there was much more grit backed up behind them than on the Deltas. Most of the grit flows straight through the screens though.

This also may be related to the pump failure. What was the root cause of its demise? Perhaps the pump filter allowed larger material and the pump turned it into grit and contaminated the lines. BSOM, but you did get the thread title right on.

I suspect the pressure tank is too small for the pump/depth combination, and the pump wasn't running long enough for the start winding to cool properly. I also doubt that the pressure tank was maintained properly due to its location--something I intend to change as soon as the weather warms up a bit.

Look at the bright side, no need to buy Lava Soap.

Good point.

SnowRidge

 

[woodmills1]

check to see if you also have the grit in your toilet tanks. if you do it is probably mica sand. you might be able to raise your pump farther from the bottem of the well to fix it.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

For what it's worth I have Moen faucets throughout my house and don't the problem you have. I do live on a well BUT I have a cheap (whole house) sediment filter installed in the basement. Maybe if you install a filter, instead of replacing any Moen faucets that might take care of your problem. Good luck in either case.

 

[Chuck52]

Snowridge,

Copper (II) oxide is black. You could be seeing some interesting electrochemistry. Since your line from the well to the house is pvc and then copper, is your copper line grounded? If not, it might be interesting to see if there is a potential difference between the copper pipe and your electrical ground. Even in the absence of an electrical difference there, remember that any two different metals in contact with water constitute a battery. Most such combinations aren't very effective batteries, but some can generate a potential.

If you happen to have some hydrochloric acid, also called muriatic acid, collect some of the black flakes and see if they are soluble in it. You might have to gently warm it, like by holding it in hot water. CuO dissolves and gives a bluish color. Neither sand nor carbon will dissolve. Manganese and it's oxides would probably also dissolve, but I don't recall what the color should be....you probably don't have enough to see the color very well anyway.

If it is CuO, the fix may be to ground your water line.

Chuck

 

[riptides]

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>

check to see if you also have the grit in your toilet tanks. if you do it is probably mica sand. you might be able to raise your pump farther from the bottem of the well to fix it.

James "woody" Mills


<hr></blockquote>



SnowRidge, what James said.

Around here in Northern/Central Virginia, we call it pepper sand.
I had this exact problem 12 years ago. We ended up raising the well pump up about 50 feet. This was about a three year old well. Had to much horse power for the distance. It was banging around down there, whirling this stuff up.

Forget the filters and such, too much money... IMHO.

-Mike Z.

 

[turnkey4099]

Here is some speculation.

It sounds like grit coming from the well (BTDT).
It is heavier than water thus will tend to sink/move to the lowest possible point.
I would look at the piping system and see if the take-offs for the 4 faucets come off the supply line such that the grit would tend to collect/move into those supply lines. It wouldn't take much to result in a natural sorting effect.

Harry K