Synthetic oil worth it? 18k hour yamaha generator says no.

Jet A · Mar 4, 2016

Copperhead said:
The additive package of an oil is what makes it good, better, or best. The base oil is not nearly as much of an issue as when synthetics first showed up in the marketplace. I like to split the difference and use syn blends. More cost effective and get the best of both worlds. I concentrate more on the additive package of an oil, which makes up 20-25% of any motor oil. Even the best synthetic base oil can ruin a motor if it is tied to a lousy additive package. And a conventional with a very stout additive package can deliver as good or better results than a synthetic base oil product.

Totally agree.

vsteel · Mar 8, 2016

LittleBill21 said:
i would prefer not to read a sales advertisement. the question was who requires it, appears no one so far

Not sure if it counts but Triumph requires at least a semi synthetic in their bikes. Look up the Speed Triple 1050 engine or the Tiger Explorer 1215 engine if you would like to see for yourself.

LittleBill21 · Mar 8, 2016

vsteel said:
Not sure if it counts but Triumph requires at least a semi synthetic in their bikes. Look up the Speed Triple 1050 engine or the Tiger Explorer 1215 engine if you would like to see for yourself.

nice vsteel, first engine i seen with that comment, link is below

http://ascycles.com/pdf/TriumphServiceSchedules/Triumph Data Sheet - Tiger Explorer.pdf

murphy1244 · Mar 8, 2016

LittleBill21 said:
nice vsteel, first engine i seen with that comment, link is below

http://ascycles.com/pdf/TriumphServiceSchedules/Triumph Data Sheet - Tiger Explorer.pdf

Ford does the same with 5w-20 . They call it a blend.

dodge man · Mar 8, 2016

The way I look at, if you change your oil, and I don't care what kind of engine, at the same interval as you would convential oil, you are wasting your money. In my opinion, the advantage of running synthetic is extended oil changes.

WilliamBos · Mar 8, 2016

dodge man said:
The way I look at, if you change your oil, and I don't care what kind of engine, at the same interval as you would convential oil, you are wasting your money. In my opinion, the advantage of running synthetic is extended oil changes.

Not always true. The cold starts are why I run synthetics. I have no interest in extending beyond what the recommended interval is. Synthetic does not cost much more than dino.

kenmac · Mar 8, 2016

Group IV or V Synthetics are far superior to conventional off the shelf oil.. Better base oil better additive package, etc
I racked up 1 million miles on a Cummins 6 cyl using AMSOIL & Dnaldson filters doing 40,000 mile oil changes B-4 I sold it..As far as I know, the guy I sold t too is still using it today

Copperhead · Mar 9, 2016

Well... just because a motor oil has a better base oil doesn't always equate to it having a better additive package. I have run many samples on stuff over the years and haven't found that to be generally true. I have taken a Cummins N-14 to 1.4 million miles on a Kendall conventional getting 30,000 mile oil changes, got sold and put right to use, and I have taken other engines to long intervals on synthetics. The Group II+ / Group IV synthetic blend I am running now has an additive package that Amsoil and Mobil barely come close to in their full synthetic lineup, as I have compared testing results from both of those brands. And those brands are good oils that I wouldn't try to stop anyone from using. Amsoil and Mobil 1, even in their top of the line stuff, does not have the add pack components that the Schaeffer I am currently using has. While it does not have the most expensive base oil, and there is no reason to spend more for a base oil than what I actually need, it has a stellar add pack.

Synthetics have their place, for sure. If I was still living near Fairbanks, AK, I would sure be using a full synthetic in all of my stuff. But I don't in most of my stuff anymore, and Iowa is not that terribly cold for climate and I don't need full synthetics nearly as much when a synthetic blend gives me the best of both worlds and I can concentrate on the additive package of the oil to get the best overall product.

And per API, Group V comprises anything that doesn't fit into Group I thru Group IV. A group V synthetic is not necessarily a great thing. Group IV PAO is generally a very good base oil, but it does have some weaknesses. And one of them is additive solubility. Actually Group III "faux synthetic" excels above Group IV PAO in this category. One of the reasons even my full synthetics that I use in some applications are a Group III / Group IV blend. No one group covers all the bases perfectly, no matter what the marketing hype says.

kenmac · Mar 9, 2016

Off the shelf conventional motor oils just can't compete with a group IV or V synthetic as far as base stocks or additive package..These 2 groups of synthetics are by far, superior to any off the shelf conventional oil...

Not only do Synthetics flow better in cold temps.. Heat is also a killer of oil, as an oil doesn't just lubricate the engine , it also plays a major role in cooling the engine ..This too is where a synthetic (IV or V) out performs off the shelf conventional oil. Unless you have your conventional oil formulated to meet your needs

If one were to have a conventional (dino oil) blended for their needs It probably would meet or exceed the Group IV or V synthetics. Cat is one changes their blends to meet their needs, even some of their oils are synthetic. I have run a cummins 6cyl 1 million miles with Amsoil and Donaldson filters with no signs of wear, nor any failed parts

Copperhead · Mar 10, 2016

Keep in mind, additive packages are not part of any base oil, they are blended in. Every major oil you see anywhere, and the boutique synthetic varieties, the base oil is usually made by someone else and the additive package components are also. It is just blended up to meet a spec and maybe a little more. I have seen testing done on a Pennzoil 10w30 conventional that would put to shame a lot of Group IV synthetics. In terms of both NOACK (burn off rate) and additive package components. I am not a Pennzoil user, but this one is a very good product. See for yourself. It has a NOACK rating (they tested it twice to make sure) that is on par with the BEST in the Amsoil lineup and beats most others on the shelf. And it really excels is Moly and Calcium. Calcium is part of the detergent and acid fighting capability and Moly is a great friction reducer. This is one stout oil additive package in this Pennzoil. Compare the NOACK rate of this to your favorite full synthetic. You can usually find the NOACK rating on their websites for each oil they make. And a low NOACK is one of the major characteristics that synthetics bring to the table. But as this shows, even some conventional oils are catching up to synthetics. That is why I don't fall for the synthetic is better than conventional arguments any more. The lines are crossing in many ways. And the additive package has nothing to do with if it is a synthetic or not. It is done purely to meet the API/ILSAC oil classification and the particular interests of the oil blender.

Pennzoil SAE 10W-30 API SN/ILSAC GF-5

And as I stated, I ran a 1996 Cummins N-14 in a FL FLD120 for 1.4 million miles without any major repairs and it went right to work for the next owner. All on a conventional Kendall 15w40 and doing 30,000 mile oil changes.... and no bypass filter. We all can present little anecdotal examples to make a point.