The 1964 MF-135 diesel is overheating

[Keith_B]

I drove to Tennesee 3 summers back to look at a '74 150 diesel that had 335 hours on it. Owner wanted $8000. I was almost tempted to haul it home. Original owner bought it new to take care of a small acreage. Just after buying the tractor, he got hurt at work and sold his ground. He kept the tractor in case he ever moved back to the country. Never did. All the tractor ever did was drive out to the mailbox a couple days a week.

335 hours! That's about as close to new as you are gonna get for a 30+ year old tractor.

 

[Soundguy]

I've had it for ages. It's a Rigid brand. Handy as a shirt pocket and it even fits in one. Seems like I bought it at a plumbing supply house back when I was building my first house. ('69)

I got a 6" PW .. also at a plumbing supply house.. has a swept back handle.. really gets in good to bite for places that need grab.. but won't fit, or don't need lots of torque.. etc..

 

[flusher]

I've had it for ages. It's a Rigid brand. Handy as a shirt pocket and it even fits in one. Seems like I bought it at a plumbing supply house back when I was building my first house. ('69)

The smallest Rigid Stillson pipe wrench I could find is 6". Can't find a 4-incher anywhere.

Visited the Harbor Freight store Thursday in Chico, CA looking for one of their long wrench sets. The metric sizes were in stock, but, naturally, the SAE sizes were sold out. Had to order the wrenches on the HF website. Should be here late next week.

Probably way too late (by decades) to write a strongly worded complaint to MF about this poorly designed block drain situation.

 

[Soundguy]

That's what cheap wrenches and torches / grinders are for... I've got lots of bent and stubby wrenches.. that used to be regular long / straight cheap wrenches...

As a second thought.. I wonder if a crowsfoot would have fit it?

Soundguy

 

[Farmwithjunk]

The smallest Rigid Stillson pipe wrench I could find is 6". Can't find a 4-incher anywhere.

Visited the Harbor Freight store Thursday in Chico, CA looking for one of their long wrench sets. The metric sizes were in stock, but, naturally, the SAE sizes were sold out. Had to order the wrenches on the HF website. Should be here late next week.

Probably way too late (by decades) to write a strongly worded complaint to MF about this poorly designed block drain situation.

Just like me, most of my tools are antiques :O No telling how long since that wrench was made.

Forward that complaint to Perkins. The shape of the block in the area of that drain has to do with the way the crankshaft and block mate. Perkins designed the AD152-3 way before Massey Ferguson got involved with them. In later years, MF bought Perkins. Now Caterpillar owns Perkins.

I dragged a 152 Perkins home yesterday. Just the engine. It was in a 135 that lost it's tranny. I'm going to look for a 135/150/140/245/250 with a bad engine. This one had the "wings" broke off the drain petcock where a 9/16"ths socket would open the drain. I'd really like to find a 250. It's ALMOST a modernized 150 only with wet disc hydraulic brakes.

 

[flusher]

Just like me, most of my tools are antiques :O No telling how long since that wrench was made.

Forward that complaint to Perkins. The shape of the block in the area of that drain has to do with the way the crankshaft and block mate. Perkins designed the AD152-3 way before Massey Ferguson got involved with them. In later years, MF bought Perkins. Now Caterpillar owns Perkins.

I dragged a 152 Perkins home yesterday. Just the engine. It was in a 135 that lost it's tranny. I'm going to look for a 135/150/140/245/250 with a bad engine. This one had the "wings" broke off the drain petcock where a 9/16"ths socket would open the drain. I'd really like to find a 250. It's ALMOST a modernized 150 only with wet disc hydraulic brakes.

I thought about cutting the wings off the petcock on my 135 and using a deep 9/16" socket. I'll do that after I try the long open end wrench approach.

No hurry on the 135 overheat problem. I'm busy with my late summer project (a Japanese garden with koi pond). I'd like to finish the pond this month. And my younger son is getting married in early Sep in Sacramento so I'm helping out with the arrangements.

Good luck finding an MF with sick engine. I'm sure they're around in your neck of the woods, judging by what I see on eBay and TractorHouse.com.

 

[flusher]

I thought about cutting the wings off the petcock on my 135 and using a deep 9/16" socket. I'll do that after I try the long open end wrench approach.

No hurry on the 135 overheat problem. I'm busy with my late summer project (a Japanese garden with koi pond). I'd like to finish the pond this month. And my younger son is getting married in early Sep in Sacramento so I'm helping out with the arrangements.

Good luck finding an MF with sick engine. I'm sure they're around in your neck of the woods, judging by what I see on eBay and TractorHouse.com.

Got ambitious today. Removed the wings from the block petcock (channel locks plus metal fatigue) and used a deep 9/16" socket to unscrew the petcock from the block. No sweat, it came out with no trouble (PB Blaster may have helped).

Result: got strong flow of 50/50 coolant out of the block (about 2 quarts).

The 135 cooling system capacity is 10.5 quarts. I can get 8 quarts into and out of the radiator and now another 2+ quarts from the block. Coolant all present or accounted for.

I'm certain that the coolant came from the block and not the radiator because I drained the radiator and filled it with straight water a few days ago for the water pump test (see previous post in this thread). I got 50/50 coolant out of the block, not straight water.

Unless I'm missing something, the flow I got out of the block pretty much guarantees that there's no major problem with coolant flow through the block. Didn't know what to expect from a 43-year-old tractor, but it looks like this Perkins has had fairly good maintenance so far.

Status check:

Block coolant system seems OK.
Water pump is strong.
Getting strong air flow through the radiator.
Both thermostats (old and new) open in the 180-190F range
Radiator takes most of the flow from a garden hose OK. Note: this radiator has a plate that separates the core from the top fill so some water from the hose is bound to spill out of the top fill when you try to force full flow from the hose through the radiator.

Haven't checked for collapsed hoses yet with the engine running. I'm a little leery of working around that 135 when it's running because of concerns about the 43-year old transmission jumping into gear.

I think I'll just reinstall the old thermostat and refill the cooling system. I could use the aspirin trick to hold the thermostat open while refilling. Or I could refill the radiator, run until the thermostat opens, stop the engine and quickly add more coolant.

Once I have 10 quarts or so in the radiator/block, I'll run the engine and carefully note what's happening with the temp gauge and the radiator overflow. Hopefully I'll learn something useful this time.

 

[Soundguy]

I'm not sure I've ever seen a ford or ferguson type tractor 'jump' into gear unless it was being helped by a pants leg or an arm reaching for a tool.

If it bothers ya.. jack the rear axles and put them on secure stands/cribbing... ( not on jacks alone.. )

Internal hose colapse on suction side is possible,, though lower on my list of things to normally check.. however in your case.. you are plowing thru the 'normal' overheat reasons.. so checking the hoses is in order.

post back what you find.


Soundguy

Got ambitious today. Removed the wings from the block petcock (channel locks plus metal fatigue) and used a deep 9/16" socket to unscrew the petcock from the block. No sweat, it came out with no trouble (PB Blaster may have helped).

Result: got strong flow of 50/50 coolant out of the block (about 2 quarts).

The 135 cooling system capacity is 10.5 quarts. I can get 8 quarts into and out of the radiator and now another 2+ quarts from the block. Coolant all present or accounted for.

I'm certain that the coolant came from the block and not the radiator because I drained the radiator and filled it with straight water a few days ago for the water pump test (see previous post in this thread). I got 50/50 coolant out of the block, not straight water.

Unless I'm missing something, the flow I got out of the block pretty much guarantees that there's no major problem with coolant flow through the block. Didn't know what to expect from a 43-year-old tractor, but it looks like this Perkins has had fairly good maintenance so far.

Status check:

Block coolant system seems OK.
Water pump is strong.
Getting strong air flow through the radiator.
Both thermostats (old and new) open in the 180-190F range
Radiator takes most of the flow from a garden hose OK. Note: this radiator has a plate that separates the core from the top fill so some water from the hose is bound to spill out of the top fill when you try to force full flow from the hose through the radiator.

Haven't checked for collapsed hoses yet with the engine running. I'm a little leery of working around that 135 when it's running because of concerns about the 43-year old transmission jumping into gear.

I think I'll just reinstall the old thermostat and refill the cooling system. I could use the aspirin trick to hold the thermostat open while refilling. Or I could refill the radiator, run until the thermostat opens, stop the engine and quickly add more coolant.

Once I have 10 quarts or so in the radiator/block, I'll run the engine and carefully note what's happening with the temp gauge and the radiator overflow. Hopefully I'll learn something useful this time.

 

[Soundguy]

Good luck.. I don't see very many ford/fergy/MF tractors with bad engines around these parts.. though do see an ocasional ford with sick SOS needing an '8spd' transplant.. etc..

Soundguy

I dragged a 152 Perkins home yesterday. Just the engine. It was in a 135 that lost it's tranny. I'm going to look for a 135/150/140/245/250 with a bad engine. This one had the "wings" broke off the drain petcock where a 9/16"ths socket would open the drain. I'd really like to find a 250. It's ALMOST a modernized 150 only with wet disc hydraulic brakes.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Good luck.. I don't see very many ford/fergy/MF tractors with bad engines around these parts.. though do see an ocasional ford with sick SOS needing an '8spd' transplant.. etc..

Soundguy

I've got a lead on a 135 Massey with a Perkins gas engine that has a spun main. The gas and diesel Perkins is IDENTICAL. Should be a fairly quick swap. The tractor looks to be in good condition otherwise. Tractor and engine alone (may need a few assorted parts/gaskets/band aides/ect) I'd be going in to this with about $1500 initial investment. A decent 135 diesel sells $4500 to $7000 here. I smell $$$$$.$$