Anonymous Poster
Epic Contributor
- Joined
- Sep 27, 2005
- Messages
- 29,678
Not an expert here, but my personal experience is that the trailer is prone to sway with too much weight on the rear of the trailer.
Trailer Setup
- Thread starter PondKeeper
- Start date
- Views: 5722
Gary_in_Indiana
Elite Member
- Joined
- Apr 22, 2002
- Messages
- 3,373
- Location
- Fort Wayne, IN
- Tractor
- John Deere 4200 MFWD HST w/ JD 420 FEL w/ 61" loader bucket & toothbar & JD 37 BH w/ 12" bucket
Your experience and everyone else's. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Darren
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2002
- Messages
- 1,038
- Location
- WVa
- Tractor
- Kubota L3710, Ford 5600, Case MB4/94, Kubota B6200
Figuring tongue weight using a bathroom scale.
It's easier than you think. If you have the tongue resting at the midpoint of a beam and one end of the beam sitting on the scale with the other end of the beam resting on something to raise it an equivalent distance above the ground, the scale will read 1/2 the tongue weight.
By adjusting the location of the tongue on the beam you can throw even less weight onto the scale. The weights at the ends of the beam times the respective distances from the tongue are equivalent. You know both distances and the weight on the scale. Figure out the weight on the end of the beam opposite the scale and add it to the scale reading. By doing that you can indirectly figure a tongue weight of thousands of pounds if needed. If you think you're dealing with potentially over a thousand lbs of tongue weight use something like a 1 to 10 ratio to get something like a 100 or 200 lb reading on the scale.
I had a friend that moved an enclosed car trailer with household stuff including a large old fashioned safe. I don't know how much the safe weighed but the tongue weight with the safe all the way forward in the trailer was way over a thousand pounds.
They unloaded the trailer and reloaded so that the safe was located between the dual axles. Even though the tongue weight was OK, one of the axles bent enough that the wheels bent in at the top while they were going down the road. They had to park the trailer at a truck stop and go back latter with a U-haul for everything except the safe. I don't remember what the scale at the truckstop said but even for a dual axle car carrier, the trailer was overloaded. In the end the only thing in the trailer was the safe. When they got to the destination they had to use a tow truck to lift the safe out and move it into a garage. Even the tow truck was way down on the axle with that safe.
One of the other things that saved their bacon was that one of the guys had come up with a large piece of 1" plywood for the safe to rest on in the trailer. Without that I wouldn't have been surprised if the safe had broke the floor.
It's easier than you think. If you have the tongue resting at the midpoint of a beam and one end of the beam sitting on the scale with the other end of the beam resting on something to raise it an equivalent distance above the ground, the scale will read 1/2 the tongue weight.
By adjusting the location of the tongue on the beam you can throw even less weight onto the scale. The weights at the ends of the beam times the respective distances from the tongue are equivalent. You know both distances and the weight on the scale. Figure out the weight on the end of the beam opposite the scale and add it to the scale reading. By doing that you can indirectly figure a tongue weight of thousands of pounds if needed. If you think you're dealing with potentially over a thousand lbs of tongue weight use something like a 1 to 10 ratio to get something like a 100 or 200 lb reading on the scale.
I had a friend that moved an enclosed car trailer with household stuff including a large old fashioned safe. I don't know how much the safe weighed but the tongue weight with the safe all the way forward in the trailer was way over a thousand pounds.
They unloaded the trailer and reloaded so that the safe was located between the dual axles. Even though the tongue weight was OK, one of the axles bent enough that the wheels bent in at the top while they were going down the road. They had to park the trailer at a truck stop and go back latter with a U-haul for everything except the safe. I don't remember what the scale at the truckstop said but even for a dual axle car carrier, the trailer was overloaded. In the end the only thing in the trailer was the safe. When they got to the destination they had to use a tow truck to lift the safe out and move it into a garage. Even the tow truck was way down on the axle with that safe.
One of the other things that saved their bacon was that one of the guys had come up with a large piece of 1" plywood for the safe to rest on in the trailer. Without that I wouldn't have been surprised if the safe had broke the floor.
prosperity
Platinum Member
Just a few thoughts......
First, the tongue weight. The suggestions here are excellent ones to start with as far as positioning the machine on the trailer. But, there is some tweaking to be done. Once you find the place to put the machine as outlined here, go for a ride. You'll only have to go about a 1/2 mile to feel the tongue weight. I know its a pain, but then loosen the chains, and try 6-8" forward, and go for another ride. Then try 6-8" behind where you started. Doing this will get you right where you want to be. You'll be surprised at how much difference a few inches of machine placement will make.
Next, chains/binders. Make sure you get chain rating at the right working strength . The Federal Motor Carrier Laws say that the chain/binder working strength must equal at least 1/2 the weight of the tied down unit. Example: 10,000 machine needs 5000lbs of working weight tie downs. For a machine this size you need two sets (one front, one rear). So make sure your chains and binders are at least this strength. Also, get ratchet binders. Don't even bother with the lever type binders.
And, when you are all secured down, and on your trip, find a nice place to pull over in about 20-30 minutes to check your chains. Anything with rubber tires will loosen up a little. With the ratchet binders, all it takes is a stroke or two to re-tighten.
Most of all, enjoy your trip. It's refreshing to see someone do the research before embarking on a mission like this.
First, the tongue weight. The suggestions here are excellent ones to start with as far as positioning the machine on the trailer. But, there is some tweaking to be done. Once you find the place to put the machine as outlined here, go for a ride. You'll only have to go about a 1/2 mile to feel the tongue weight. I know its a pain, but then loosen the chains, and try 6-8" forward, and go for another ride. Then try 6-8" behind where you started. Doing this will get you right where you want to be. You'll be surprised at how much difference a few inches of machine placement will make.
Next, chains/binders. Make sure you get chain rating at the right working strength . The Federal Motor Carrier Laws say that the chain/binder working strength must equal at least 1/2 the weight of the tied down unit. Example: 10,000 machine needs 5000lbs of working weight tie downs. For a machine this size you need two sets (one front, one rear). So make sure your chains and binders are at least this strength. Also, get ratchet binders. Don't even bother with the lever type binders.
And, when you are all secured down, and on your trip, find a nice place to pull over in about 20-30 minutes to check your chains. Anything with rubber tires will loosen up a little. With the ratchet binders, all it takes is a stroke or two to re-tighten.
Most of all, enjoy your trip. It's refreshing to see someone do the research before embarking on a mission like this.
Bird
Rest in Peace
Re: Figuring tongue weight using a bathroom scale.
Yep, Darren, that method would certainly work.
Yep, Darren, that method would certainly work.
OP
PondKeeper
Silver Member
- Joined
- Jun 4, 2002
- Messages
- 158
- Tractor
- Kubota B7500, New Holland LS45
Darren and Prosperity (nameless in your profile), thank you for your help. I feel confident that I will find the sweet spot now.
We are expecting rain this weekend so I think I will leave Lucy home this weekend and take the extra time and get the loading right the first time. I can easily go for the test rides locally and make adjustments all along the way.
I don't know about others but even when I use my utility trailer I can't relax while driving if all is not balanced right. I can only guess that with the new tractor and all the $'s there I could take the pucker factor up about four fold! I'd need about bottle of vod#$, I mean milk, to settle down after the ride.
The crazy thing about this tractor issue is that I bought it to use on the country property but I can't be without it at my main house now. Every day there is some new project I never would have tackled by hand. What medication is there for this?????? My answer is "attachments". So sad.
Thanks again to all you guys for your help. This site has been so educational.
Mike
We are expecting rain this weekend so I think I will leave Lucy home this weekend and take the extra time and get the loading right the first time. I can easily go for the test rides locally and make adjustments all along the way.
I don't know about others but even when I use my utility trailer I can't relax while driving if all is not balanced right. I can only guess that with the new tractor and all the $'s there I could take the pucker factor up about four fold! I'd need about bottle of vod#$, I mean milk, to settle down after the ride.
The crazy thing about this tractor issue is that I bought it to use on the country property but I can't be without it at my main house now. Every day there is some new project I never would have tackled by hand. What medication is there for this?????? My answer is "attachments". So sad.
Thanks again to all you guys for your help. This site has been so educational.
Mike
fishman
Veteran Member
Pondkeeper,
Nice trailer, I have one exactly like it /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif except two feet longer. Loadtrail makes a great product in my opinion and I looked at several brands.
When strapping my tractor down, I've used both the stake pockets or the frame rail, depending on what works the best. I've also built removable sides for the trailer with about $40 worth of treated wood. This allows you to haul wood, etc on the car hauler.
One thing I messed up on was having too little weight on the rear axle initially. This resulted in the right rear tire locking up easily and being damaged when braking (think flat spots /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif). Anyway, flipping my 2" drop hitch over fixed the problem, although the tongue jack now is a bit short to lift the trailer off the ball without a 2x4 underneath it. Being a novice to trailer brakes, it took a little while for me to figure them out.
Nice trailer, I have one exactly like it /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif except two feet longer. Loadtrail makes a great product in my opinion and I looked at several brands.
When strapping my tractor down, I've used both the stake pockets or the frame rail, depending on what works the best. I've also built removable sides for the trailer with about $40 worth of treated wood. This allows you to haul wood, etc on the car hauler.
One thing I messed up on was having too little weight on the rear axle initially. This resulted in the right rear tire locking up easily and being damaged when braking (think flat spots /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif). Anyway, flipping my 2" drop hitch over fixed the problem, although the tongue jack now is a bit short to lift the trailer off the ball without a 2x4 underneath it. Being a novice to trailer brakes, it took a little while for me to figure them out.
OP
PondKeeper
Silver Member
- Joined
- Jun 4, 2002
- Messages
- 158
- Tractor
- Kubota B7500, New Holland LS45
John.
I thought the same thing about the trailer quality for the price. It appeared to be just as well made as same units that cost $400 more.
I already flipped my hitch like you did and the support is on the short side, I use a block to make-up the shortfall.
Mike.
I thought the same thing about the trailer quality for the price. It appeared to be just as well made as same units that cost $400 more.
I already flipped my hitch like you did and the support is on the short side, I use a block to make-up the shortfall.
Mike.
Rowski
Veteran Member
- Joined
- May 18, 2000
- Messages
- 1,474
- Location
- North Central Vermont, Jay Peak Area
- Tractor
- 2004 New Holland TN70DA with 32LC loader, 2000 New Holland 2120 with Curtis cab, 7309 loader
Just remember if the truck has a rear leveling system Bird's method will not work to well. Unless you can over ride it. Once you know how much your bumper came down you can turn it back on.
OP
PondKeeper
Silver Member
- Joined
- Jun 4, 2002
- Messages
- 158
- Tractor
- Kubota B7500, New Holland LS45
Good point, I do have the auto leveling.
I would think I could do everything with the engine off. I'll have to see if the pump remains off if the truck is not running.
Mike
I would think I could do everything with the engine off. I'll have to see if the pump remains off if the truck is not running.
Mike
