Transmission Flush

[brokenot]

Don't know what to tell you. Owners manuals just tell you when to do something not how.

I've posted about eleventy-billion times now that if something is supposed to be flushed...they say so. They're not going to give you a step-by-step walk through in the owners manual, but if a procedure is recommended they will say so. Somebody, anybody....explain why "flushing" appears in the cooling system maintenance schedule, because oddly enough....they don't tell you HOW to do that either. And yet, they specify flushing as if there's a reason for it.

The days of the 350 and 400 turbo are long gone. They would probably last 30K on 20W50 if you tried it..These new precision trannies...Not so much.

These posts keep getting funnier. So....things have changed. These new precision trannies require servicing that previous ones did not. And yet, the text in the manuals has stayed the same, because they want people to be confused about what they should be doing. Got it.

This has gotten pretty ridiculous. It seems like it would be easy to prove your case by simply scanning and posting a page from a manual, or linking to a manufacturer's site that shows this practice is recommended. So far, the claims by owners saying their owners manuals have called out flushing specifically have been easily de-bunked by simply linking to the manufacturers' sites and doing about two minutes worth of reading.

So other than personal opinion, what else have you got? Giving examples of individual dealers or garages that do offer flushing services means little, well....'cept for this:

It means that manufacturers are very likely aware that the procedure exists, heck....some of their dealers already have the equipment. And yet, the practice still isn't being recommended, while the draining and flushing of another vehicle fluid IS recommended and specified as such.

Weird.

And FWIW, I'm not saying at all that flushing is automatically or necessarily "bad". What I am very much saying, is that at least 75% of what's posted on internet forums on the topic is incorrect. Time and time again, a curious vehicle owner bringing up the topic is bombarded with a lot of nonsense like actually being told their vehicle manufacturer or owners manual recommends the practice. People go away from these discussions being more confused than they were when they came in, because people tell them how to interpret what their manuals say in plain English. THEN, they start wondering what else the manufacturer "isn't telling them", or....how they should "interpret" other things that don't require interpretation.

Is that generally a good thing? I know I've seen lots more stuff mucked up by people following the tips and tricks of others, in comparison to reading and understanding the information supplied to them by the company that built it.

Either post up some manufacturer recommendations, OR...start subsequent posts with things like , "this is my personal opinion about trans flushing...".

That way, people wanting accurate information on the subject can easily separate what's *opinion* from what folks are *telling them* vehicle manufacturers recognize and recommend as appropriate.

:thumbsup:

 

[timswi]

Is that generally a good thing? I know I've seen lots more stuff mucked up by people following the tips and tricks of others, in comparison to reading and understanding the information supplied to them by the company that built it.

Either post up some manufacturer recommendations, OR...start subsequent posts with things like , "this is my personal opinion about trans flushing...".

That way, people wanting accurate information on the subject can easily separate what's *opinion* from what folks are *telling them* vehicle manufacturers recognize and recommend as appropriate.

You're taking this a bit personally...no? Honestly, I couldn't care less how anyone maintains their vehicle. It ain't my car, do what you want.

As I stated a billion times. I had the GMC/Hummer dealer, where both vehicles were purchased change the tranny fluid and they flushed both trucks. Not opinion, fact.

I'm pretty much done with this thread.

 

[Diamondpilot]

You're taking this a bit personally...no? Honestly, I couldn't care less how anyone maintains their vehicle. It ain't my car, do what you want.

As I stated a billion times. I had the GMC/Hummer dealer, where both vehicles were purchased change the tranny fluid and they flushed both trucks. Not opinion, fact.

I'm pretty much done with this thread.

I am with you. I personally flush. Its make no sense to me to only change 1/4 of the fluid.:confused2:

But like you said its to each his own.

Chris

 

[timswi]

I am with you. I personally flush. Its make no sense to me to only change 1/4 of the fluid.:confused2:

But like you said its to each his own.

Chris

Agree with you...Maybe that's why I haven't blown a tranny in 20 years.

 

[crazyal]

To me flushing a radiator is not the same as flushing the tranny. A radiator flush is when you drain all the fluid and then either with water or with the help of a flushing fluid you flush the cooling system to remove as much contaminates as possible.

A tranny flush the way most people talk about it is just the way to remove the trans fluid that's not currently in the pan. You drain the fluid, replace any filter. Fill the tranny back up. Disconnect the return line from the radiator and then start the motor to pump out the old oil.

A real tranny flush is when you use good fluid and circulate it through the tranny, either by draining all of the fluid and replacing it, running it, and then draining it a second time or with the help of a tool that will pump fresh fluid though the tranny and then through a filter before going back into the tranny. The only time I know of a real tranny flush being done is when the discs are falling apart and the transmission looks like sludge.

Think of a toilet. The purpose of flushing it is not to drain the water in it but to remove what's mixed in with the water. :laughing:

 

[timswi]

To me flushing a radiator is not the same as flushing the tranny. A radiator flush is when you drain all the fluid and then either with water or with the help of a flushing fluid you flush the cooling system to remove as much contaminates as possible.

A tranny flush the way most people talk about it is just the way to remove the trans fluid that's not currently in the pan. You drain the fluid, replace any filter. Fill the tranny back up. Disconnect the return line from the radiator and then start the motor to pump out the old oil.

A real tranny flush is when you use good fluid and circulate it through the tranny, either by draining all of the fluid and replacing it, running it, and then draining it a second time or with the help of a tool that will pump fresh fluid though the tranny and then through a filter before going back into the tranny. The only time I know of a real tranny flush being done is when the discs are falling apart and the transmission looks like sludge.

Think of a toilet. The purpose of flushing it is not to drain the water in it but to remove what's mixed in with the water. :laughing:

That's true...It isn't recommended to push solvents through, just fresh fluid. That's what I've been trying to say. There's no real magic here, just getting as close to 100% new fluid as possible while washing out any misc stuff. I really don't know why this is something to argue about. If guys want to dump what's in the pan and that works for them..Fantastic, no harm here.

I hope to never find what's in the loo in my tranny though.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Agree with you...Maybe that's why I haven't blown a tranny in 20 years.

I can not say I have not. Had a transfer case go out on my 89 S-10 Blazzer when it had about 30,000 miles. I also went though 2 trannys on my Dodge 2500. One at about 30,000 miles and another at 68,000 miles but it was a Dodge.:laughing:

Thing is with all these I never changed the fluid. It happened to all 3 gear boxes before the change intervals were hit.

Chris

 

[timswi]

I can not say I have not. Had a transfer case go out on my 89 S-10 Blazzer when it had about 30,000 miles. I also went though 2 trannys on my Dodge 2500. One at about 30,000 miles and another at 68,000 miles but it was a Dodge.:laughing:

Thing is with all these I never changed the fluid. It happened to all 3 gear boxes before the change intervals were hit.

Chris

Well...Can't say I've had that happen...just the 1st yr 700R4 in an '82 or '83 Blazer (don't remember) it was a design flaw. It did let go around 125K though.

Anyway...We're off to Disney for a few days...Have a good rest of the week.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

That's true...It isn't recommended to push solvents through, just fresh fluid. That's what I've been trying to say. There's no real magic here, just getting as close to 100% new fluid as possible while washing out any misc stuff. I really don't know why this is something to argue about. If guys want to dump what's in the pan and that works for them..Fantastic, no harm here.

I hope to never find what's in the loo in my tranny though.

Both of you make a good point here. What I call the bucket flush is not flush at all in that an external machine is used. It really is just draining the oil out of another port vs. the dropping the pan or using the pan drain plug if equipped. I like the idea of filling the TC with fresh ATF.

It may have been on rv.net a few years ago a guy that had worked in a Ford transmission testing lab said Ford learned when using the transmission pump to remove the ATF where the return line connects to the cooler that the torque converter after the fact contained 97% new ATF.

For my emotional side 97% new ATF sounds better than 33% new ATF. When I take a bath I would prefer 97% new water instead of only 33% new water in the tub. :thumbsup:

 

[brokenot]

To me flushing a radiator is not the same as flushing the tranny.

That's where a lot of misconception/misinterpretation comes from, and that's my whole point. The last couple of posts, (for example), have included information on the differences between flushing methods....as if a curious and unfamiliar vehicle owner didn't already have enough mumbo-jumbo to process from this, (and other), transmission flushing threads on the 'net. Here's the thing: It isn't recommended, no matter how you want to parse the "flushing" term to suit the argument you support.

Maybe that's why I haven't blown a tranny in 20 years.

Me neither.

It may have been on rv.net a few years ago a guy that had worked in a Ford transmission testing lab said Ford learned when using the transmission pump to remove the ATF where the return line connects to the cooler that the torque converter after the fact contained 97% new ATF.

Here we go again. So a manufacturer realizes it's "better" or "the way to go about it", and yet they still don't recommend it. Why? Not only that, but you can visit any forum you like and find posts from "a guy that worked in a lab". Read enough of 'em and you'll soon discover how much hooey they contain. Real, tested, proven documentation from testing labs isn't hard to find. Relying on what "some guy" said that was subsequently posted on a forum is an amazingly unreliable way to gather information.

For my emotional side 97% new ATF sounds better than 33% new ATF

This keeps getting repeated, and once again the manufacturers are not unaware of it.

You're taking this a bit personally...no? Honestly, I couldn't care less how anyone maintains their vehicle

I don't care how other people maintain their vehicles either. But when folks post up about how somebody else should maintain their vehicle, the information ought to be accurate. And saying vehicle manufacturers recommend the procedure is inaccurate. Implying manufacturers are unaware of the volume of fluid changed with *this* procedure versus *that* procedure is inaccurate. Implying that the manufacturer means "flush" when they say "change" is inaccurate.

See where I'm coming from?

We're some 5 pages deep into this now, and nobody has provided a scan or a link or anything supporting their point. (And don't try and say there hasn't been some searching going on.)

I'd say that's a pretty good indicator of how widely-recognized and manufacturer-supported this *obviously-better* procedure is. So there you go.....all you curious and inquisitive vehicle owners, another multi-page internet forum thread chock-full of "useful" information for you to try to digest.

Good luck with that.

:thumbsup: