Triaxle: Upgrade to E Rated Tires?

[RichT]

My 2007 triaxle boat trailer carries almost 10K lbs of Regal Cabin Cruiser. With the trailer weight the tires are carrying approx 12.5K lbs. The Carlisle D rated tires on my trailer are starting to show significant sidewall cracking. My calcs indicate the D tires are fine for this load, although most local tire dealers are recommending an upgrade to E rated tires for extra safety margin. I'm all for extra safety margins, however, the wheels (Carlisle 15x6 6 bolt spokes) are rated to 65psi (the D rating). So to take full advantage of the E rating (80psi) I'd need to upgrade the wheels as well. Options:
1>replace with D rated (NOT Carlisle's)
2>replace with E rated, keep existing wheels
3>replace with E's and new wheels rated to at least 80psi

Option 3 is roughly twice the cost of options 1/2. What think ye towing experts?

 

[Duffster]

Don't you have plenty of "safety margin" with just the D range tires?

 

[Groo]

sometimes sidewall cracking can go on forever. I'd get 2 spares and keep going till they start blowing.
then replace them with another brand, maybe truck tires.

I've had trailer blowouts before. even with a single axle, its no big deal. with a tri-axle. you may not notice apart from the added drag.

 

[Bill_C]

If you do upgrade to load range E, they need to be on rims rated for the pressure.

Do you physically have room to go to a slightly bigger tire? That would also increase the tire's load carrying capacity even for the same-letter load rating.

 

[Diamondpilot]

I deal with this all the time. Its not that they are D range or E range its that they are Carlisle tires. They are absolute Junk. Get a set of Green Ball Tow Master Radials or some other brand that has a good rep. I have the worst luck with Goodyear and Carlisle and have been having good luck with a lot of the Chinese tires and the Green Balls the last couple of years.

I ran into the same issues the same year I bought my WellCraft. It weighs 15,600# and I blew 3 of the 6 tires in one trip when it was only 2 years old. Switched over to the Green Balls and zero issues in 3 season and about 3,000 miles of towing each year.

 

[RichT]

Don't you have plenty of "safety margin" with just the D range tires?

If my math is right each D tire is carrying about 2.1K lbs and they are rated around 2.5K lbs, so yes there is a safety margin. The E tires would add another 300-400lbs at 80psi.

Do you physically have room to go to a slightly bigger tire? That would also increase the tire's load carrying capacity even for the same-letter load rating.

Not really enough room unless I do some weird stuff with the axles.

I deal with this all the time. Its not that they are D range or E range its that they are Carlisle tires. They are absolute Junk. Get a set of Green Ball Tow Master Radials or some other brand that has a good rep. I have the worst luck with Goodyear and Carlisle and have been having good luck with a lot of the Chinese tires and the Green Balls the last couple of years.

I ran into the same issues the same year I bought my WellCraft. It weighs 15,600# and I blew 3 of the 6 tires in one trip when it was only 2 years old. Switched over to the Green Balls and zero issues in 3 season and about 3,000 miles of towing each year.

The tire dealer I trust is recommending AGAINST the Carlisles and recommending for the Greenballs. They've stopped carrying the Carlisles because of high returns/failures. If I do rims and tires I think they'll give me a healthy discount.

The way I look at it...driving this rig I have enough to worry about without sweating the tires.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Nothing wrong with going the safe route but I run Load Range D on the boat pictured above. The trailer is a 18,000# Eagle with 3 6,000# Dexter axles and it does just fine. Like I said the boat weighs in at 15,600#. I have weighed it.

If you have to do stuff with the axles just be aware there is more to it than you think. Axles have a built in arch. They are also directional since the brakes have a left and right side. I am assuming you are talking about doing a axle flip. To do this right you need to have a axle flip kit installed. Watch your height. My boat sits 13'6" high as is so raising it would cause problems with bridges and such plus you raise your CG which may cause trailer handling problems. One other consideration is if you raise your trailer you will now have to back it in farther. This may put your truck in the water and with that type of load I do not like to get the rear wheels wet. Just some things to think about. I have been down this road before. If it were me I would get the Green Balls or some Denmens in the stock size and be done with it.

Chris

 

[Builder]

My 2007 triaxle boat trailer carries almost 10K lbs of Regal Cabin Cruiser. With the trailer weight the tires are carrying approx 12.5K lbs. The Carlisle D rated tires on my trailer are starting to show significant sidewall cracking. My calcs indicate the D tires are fine for this load, although most local tire dealers are recommending an upgrade to E rated tires for extra safety margin. I'm all for extra safety margins, however, the wheels (Carlisle 15x6 6 bolt spokes) are rated to 65psi (the D rating). So to take full advantage of the E rating (80psi) I'd need to upgrade the wheels as well. Options:
1>replace with D rated (NOT Carlisle's)
2>replace with E rated, keep existing wheels
3>replace with E's and new wheels rated to at least 80psi

Option 3 is roughly twice the cost of options 1/2. What think ye towing experts?

I'm not the towing expert that the guys above are. However, I'm a CDL driver towing a 19,000 lb backhoe on a 15 ton trailer and a 7,500 lb tractor on a 12K trailer, but I do have some advice for you:

Don't bother with the E's or the E rims. You have plenty of safety margin and you have 3 axles, not just 1 or 2, so a blowout shouldn't be too serious if your tires are healthy.

Just put D range tires on it. If the ones you have now have worn tread and/or bad sidewalls, replace them with quality tires. However,the little secret most guys don't know is you need to check the AGE of the tires you buy. Many tires we purchase are OLD and actually going to be considered too old for useage right after they're installed! Some guys get bargain prices on tires, guess why? Because the dealer knows they're OLD and wants to get rid of them!

My wife nearly lost her father to a blowout caused by tires that were too old. They look fine, but are in the process of breaking down.

I wouldn't worry so much about brands, although I avoid chinese tires like the plague, and worry about proper ratings and checking the date when the tires were made.

Here's a link to explain what I'm talking about much better:

Tire Age Code - Determining The Age Of Your Tires Could Save Your Life! Car Buying Tips To Save You Money

 

[RichT]

Thx everyone. This forum never ceases to amaze me...tractor folks are among the most helpful in the internet universe.

Not sure which way I'll go, except I WILL replace the Carlisles, which are about 3yrs old according to their code. Tire dealer is having a big rim/tire sale at end of week, so I'll compare the D replacement (7 incl spare) to a full E rim/tire replacement with their discount.

Chris, I appreciate you weighing in with boat trailer experience. The dealer is pushing Greenball as well. I assume you are using E's with that load - nice boat btw.

Next trailer project: converting surge disks to electric over hydraulic.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Thx everyone. This forum never ceases to amaze me...tractor folks are among the most helpful in the internet universe.

Not sure which way I'll go, except I WILL replace the Carlisles, which are about 3yrs old according to their code. Tire dealer is having a big rim/tire sale at end of week, so I'll compare the D replacement (7 incl spare) to a full E rim/tire replacement with their discount.

Chris, I appreciate you weighing in with boat trailer experience. The dealer is pushing Greenball as well. I assume you are using E's with that load - nice boat btw.

Next trailer project: converting surge disks to electric over hydraulic.

I would stay away from the elec/hydro like the plague. I have 2 customers with them and hate towing them. Very expensive, not very smooth, and 2 systems to maintain. I would put surge disc brakes on a trailer over them or even some of the new electric drums that are approved for fresh water. Not sure if the last option will work for you seeing your local.

Chris

 

[RichT]

I would stay away from the elec/hydro like the plague. I have 2 customers with them and hate towing them. Very expensive, not very smooth, and 2 systems to maintain. I would put surge disc brakes on a trailer over them or even some of the new electric drums that are approved for fresh water. Not sure if the last option will work for you seeing your local.

Interesting viewpoint. The offshore forum guys, many with triaxles that tow long distance, almost unanimously recommend EOH brakes. Surge brakes, if you ignore the clunking, is OK on level roads. Downhill is another matter and backing down the ramp with just the truck brakes stopping nearly 20K lbs is not much fun.

 

[Groo]

why not surge on 1 or 2 axles, and electric on the remaining 1 or 2, seeing as you are planning on messing with them anyway.

you might even consider going to tandem heavy duty axles instead of your current tridem if you realy want to dig into it.

I think mobile homes and lowboys use 14.5" rims, so size isn't a problem

 

[Diamondpilot]

Mixing break types is not desired. Surge brakes rely on the trailer trying to push the truck. If you put electric brakes on one axle and keep surge on the rest the electric axle will brake then not allow the surge axle to push as much. As a result it will overuse the electric axle and not use the surge axle enough and in the end probably take longer to stop.

Chris