Tuff Torq K46 - rebuild or just drain/refill oil?

[jpilk99]

The heavier 50 weight oil does not thin out as much when it gets warm or hot so less internal leakage and HST performs better. I would change oil and see how it performs before doing complete rebuild

on X500 engagement of mower deck. At lower RPM activate the choke partially and deck will engage without stalling the engine. This procedure works very well on my X540

Thanks oldnslo. I'll play with choke on Husqy when I engage PTO - just weird that the JD doesn't need such. Making me ...kinda feeling less-than-thrilled with my Husqy, which up until now I've LOVED!!!! I still think I'll get new plugs and maybe even new coils and see if that solves it. If not, will plan to ride the choke - or sell the Husqy and keep the JD!!!

So when I drain the tranny on the JD, I should fill it with 15W50 or 20W50? Does it need to be Tuff Torq oil or ...Castrol/Whatever oil? Synthetic or Conventional??

Thanks all!!!

 

[oldnslo]

My two cents on the oil. Any good name brand oil should work and I would probably go with 20W50 if tractor is not used in cold weather for plowing snow. I used Mobil 1 in an older Hydrogear several years ago on the recommendation from the factory. It allowed a few more years of run time and then the mower was scrapped since the deck was shot.

 

[jgayman]

Well, for the Husqy, the only time I go to engage the mower deck - to mow the grass - is when it's "warm"; 60 degrees or above.

Once everything on the machine "gets warmed up" - used 5 to 10 minutes or so - then everything seems to work normally, or as one would expect.

I will say though that, ANY time I engage the PTO on the JD, that mower deck spins up like a hot knife through buttah!

By cold I mainly meant that it has been sitting a while in the garage and the spindles are cold. It sounds like my X500 acts just like your Husqy.

 

[jpilk99]

Disclaimer: I don't watch regular TV anymore since everything is propaganda, lies, and wokeness. I choose to watch programming from folks like us who share their knowledge and in doing so make some extra money. I prefer watching on Rumble on ROKU, but since it is fairly new not as much content. Anyway, there are lots of great channels on YT that explain how to do stuff and one of many that I recommend is

If you can get past the corny intros and fake teeth old Tarly has a great video on the Tuff Torque 46 rebuild.
My buddy gave away a Cub 54 inch cut Garden tractor when the Trans Axel TT46 went out. I wish I had seen this video before he threw it away. Also highly recommend channel MUSTI1. He is a genius on small engines/CUT/marine/small motorcycles and some automotive content and has a video reviving a CUB TT46 hydro that he got for free. Seems like a pretty good dude. Another is Western Truck and Tractor. He is a one-man heavy equipment mechanic that works on the big stuff (tractors farm machinery forklifts etc) out in Oregon. He also works some Diesel trucks including HD pickups. A pretty awesome dude who shares his knowledge and sometimes frustrations about current supply challenges.

https://www.youtube.com/c/mustie1
western truck and tractor repair https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCNVKQS-Jl70TYCmsEPO73QA

Thanks. I watched this before I did my Husqy. Goofy distraction with acting, but, useful tech tips

 

[tomplum]

Nope. That's the MTD CVT that they've had for decades. Single speed FNR box w/ a variable speed pulley and an extra belt for fun and games.

Seven speed manual shift riding lawn mower:
View attachment 740614

Troy-Bilt Pony 42 in. 15.5 HP Briggs and Stratton Engine 7 Speed Manual Drive Gas Riding Lawn Tractor (CA Compliant) Pony 42 CA - The Home Depot

Get solid, strong performance and plenty of power with the Troy-Bilt Pony 42 riding lawn tractor. The Pony lawn tractor is powered by a 15.5 HP Power Built Series (single-cylinder) OHV Briggs and Stratton

www.homedepot.com

That was easy to find.

Richard

ope.

 

[tomplum]

Thanks so much, Tom. Exactly the kind of feedback I was looking for. One question, based on my order last night of the Tuff Torq 5W50… Do I need to use “Tuff Torq” 15W50 or 20W50? And what’s the thinking on going to those higher viscosities? How does that help the transmission operate better? (Thanks so much!!).

No. Buy any motor oil. I've used both. 20W50 if a summer use machine is fine and easier to probably get. I use 15W50 Briggs Vanguard syn for customer units.

 

[Gord Baker]

Thank you, jgayman. I appreciate your perspective(s) on hydro and geared transmissions and how well your 175 performed since '88. But, (without sounding like a jerk), no one is answering my question, and obviously no one has a crystal ball, but: Given the stated operation, of losing maybe 50% of its power after about 20 minutes - should I just drain the transmission of its fluid and just replace with new ...or bite the whole bullet, spend the $4xx buck and buy a rebuild kit to rebuild it, which will include new fluid???

Obviously, I can drain and refill ---- and then put it all back together and test it. If it does the same thing, then I know I need to rebuild.

I'm just hoping someone whose gone through similar can weigh in on the question I've asked so I can make a more educated decision.

Thank you,

Jay

 

[Gord Baker]

The hydrotrans on my X320 JD failed to climb grades when hot. I had it replaced by dealer with new Drive Belt. $1,800 Cdn. I don't know what comes with the rebuild kit. Pistons and sleeves?
Gotta adjust pedals to get a quicker Reverse.

 

[Tony H]

As many of us know, these Tuff Torq transmissions lose power over time. On my Husqvarna LGT 24K54, it lost virtually all power to climb the slightest of inclines after only 10-15 mins of use. I spent the $400+ and bought the rebuild kit from TT and ...rebuilt it, added new fluid and mmmmmmmmmmmmwah - she was like new again. (Never going to tow anything above 25lbs again!!!!). I now am having a somewhat similar issue with my JD LA175, though it only looses about half power after 20 minutes.

Big question is: Do I rebuild or just drain and refill with new TT fluid/oil? I removed that small cap in the rear of the tranny, higher up on the tranny, and when I stuck a 3" match stick down in there, it seemed quite low; barely hitting the 1/4" mark with about and inch and a half worth of the match stick stuck down in there. (Scientific, I know...). So I'm wondering whether to just take the tranny completely off the machine and just drain & refill --- or buy the rebuild kit and finish by refilling with new fluid/oil?

Any way to know if you just need fresh oil or a rebuild kit???

Thanks all.

Jay

Interesting question. The hydro might just need fresh fluid with their friction properties. OR was fluid low on the JD too so you have internal wear?
Hydros have come a long way. Tractor trailers, busses, everything has hydros in them these days

 

[pacosperson]

As many of us know, these Tuff Torq transmissions lose power over time. On my Husqvarna LGT 24K54, it lost virtually all power to climb the slightest of inclines after only 10-15 mins of use. I spent the $400+ and bought the rebuild kit from TT and ...rebuilt it, added new fluid and mmmmmmmmmmmmwah - she was like new again. (Never going to tow anything above 25lbs again!!!!). I now am having a somewhat similar issue with my JD LA175, though it only looses about half power after 20 minutes.

Big question is: Do I rebuild or just drain and refill with new TT fluid/oil? I removed that small cap in the rear of the tranny, higher up on the tranny, and when I stuck a 3" match stick down in there, it seemed quite low; barely hitting the 1/4" mark with about and inch and a half worth of the match stick stuck down in there. (Scientific, I know...). So I'm wondering whether to just take the tranny completely off the machine and just drain & refill --- or buy the rebuild kit and finish by refilling with new fluid/oil?

Any way to know if you just need fresh oil or a rebuild kit???

Thanks all.

Jay

In my 'stuff I need to know but will never remember' file I have the note that the K66 transmission is stronger but much heavier. When my YTH23V42LS Husqvarna fails, that's what I'm going to try.

 

[jpilk99]

In my 'stuff I need to know but will never remember' file I have the note that the K66 transmission is stronger but much heavier. When my YTH23V42LS Husqvarna fails, that's what I'm going to try.

I’m 99% sure you’re correct that the K66 Is stronger but if I recall correctly, it runs backwards to our machines. So to go forward, you would (under current operation of your machine) tell it to go backwards.

 

[rogerson]

As many of us know, these Tuff Torq transmissions lose power over time. On my Husqvarna LGT 24K54, it lost virtually all power to climb the slightest of inclines after only 10-15 mins of use. I spent the $400+ and bought the rebuild kit from TT and ...rebuilt it, added new fluid and mmmmmmmmmmmmwah - she was like new again. (Never going to tow anything above 25lbs again!!!!). I now am having a somewhat similar issue with my JD LA175, though it only looses about half power after 20 minutes.

Big question is: Do I rebuild or just drain and refill with new TT fluid/oil? I removed that small cap in the rear of the tranny, higher up on the tranny, and when I stuck a 3" match stick down in there, it seemed quite low; barely hitting the 1/4" mark with about and inch and a half worth of the match stick stuck down in there. (Scientific, I know...). So I'm wondering whether to just take the tranny completely off the machine and just drain & refill --- or buy the rebuild kit and finish by refilling with new fluid/oil?

Any way to know if you just need fresh oil or a rebuild kit???

Thanks all.

Jay

 

[rogerson]

As many of us know, these Tuff Torq transmissions lose power over time. On my Husqvarna LGT 24K54, it lost virtually all power to climb the slightest of inclines after only 10-15 mins of use. I spent the $400+ and bought the rebuild kit from TT and ...rebuilt it, added new fluid and mmmmmmmmmmmmwah - she was like new again. (Never going to tow anything above 25lbs again!!!!). I now am having a somewhat similar issue with my JD LA175, though it only looses about half power after 20 minutes.

Big question is: Do I rebuild or just drain and refill with new TT fluid/oil? I removed that small cap in the rear of the tranny, higher up on the tranny, and when I stuck a 3" match stick down in there, it seemed quite low; barely hitting the 1/4" mark with about and inch and a half worth of the match stick stuck down in there. (Scientific, I know...). So I'm wondering whether to just take the tranny completely off the machine and just drain & refill --- or buy the rebuild kit and finish by refilling with new fluid/oil?

Any way to know if you just need fresh oil or a rebuild kit???

Thanks all.

Jay

Normally the oil and filter is changed as the oil collects moisture and other contaminants over time that will promote wear to pumps and motors.

In the tractor I had with a hydrostatic transmission, I found the cause of lack of ground power over time was due to wear to the internal relief valves. Their role is to allow pressure by-pass if something were to say stall the transmission, to avoid mechanical failure, but they themselves are mechanical and the internal springs become weaker over time causing them to engage or by-pass at lower pressures, creating transmission stall under lower loads.

I let my dealer do this repair.

 

[jpilk99]

Normally the oil and filter is changed as the oil collects moisture and other contaminants over time that will promote wear to pumps and motors.

In the tractor I had with a hydrostatic transmission, I found the cause of lack of ground power over time was due to wear to the internal relief valves. Their role is to allow pressure by-pass if something were to say stall the transmission, to avoid mechanical failure, but they themselves are mechanical and the internal springs become weaker over time causing them to engage or by-pass at lower pressures, creating transmission stall under lower loads.

I let my dealer do this repair.

Thank you. I think this sheds lights on the $64k question: whether to rebuild or not to rebuild (just flush oil and refill). Trying the latter but prepared for the former. Given the filings, I’m fully expecting rebuild. But as commented previously, I’ll have a newly rebuilt Tranny after that.

 

[tomplum]

Yep. That's a bad one.

 

[jpilk99]

Hah. I figured. I drained and changed oil. May load it back up and try it ….or order full repair and wait and just rebuild. Thanks Tom

 

[tomplum]

When I find them just kinda coated, I'll evacuate what I can, which is typically around 3/4 of a quart or so and refill with the heavy oil to help someone out during regular PM to buy them more time. It isn't much, but it's quick and easy on some. For many areas, it isn't cost effective for a shop to rebuild one. Yours definitely has lots of ferrous evidence. These have their haters, but are still way better than the plastic ones.

 

[crazyal]

You can always try to flush it by changing the oil a couple of times to try and get out anything that the magnet isn't catching. I use the Deere oil in my x500.

 

[stevem5215]

I had the 20minute problem with my K46 in my Black Craftsman Professional 24hp. I did the dump and fill with Full Synthetic 20w-50 from Advance Auto. I did put a new drive belt on for preventative maint at the same time. That tractor has been fine for over 5 years now and it is nearly 14 years old I believe. K46 isn't a bad transmission. It's a bad fluid they used in it that causes all the problems along with poor maint as most never change the oil in it.

On a side note. I just gave away a perfectly working 1972 Cub Cadet 129 hydro machine. It had the hand operated hydro speed control. The mower deck was even original on it and just the last couple years rusted by the exit chute area. It still cuts like it did when new. And that machine worked fine with a hydro unit that is 50 years old now. Try that with any machine made now! And the engine is ORIGINAL.

 

[nbpt100]

I have not done this but I have read a lot lately and watched some video. I like the idea of opening up the Case and inspecting what you can before making a decision on how to proceed. If it does not look too bad then maybe an oil change maybe worth a shot. If you see a lot of metal filings on the magnets and filter then I would not bother. Rebuild it or replace it.

I have read a lot of people changing the oil and it does not work. If it is loosing pressure it wont help. A heavier oil may alleviate the problem some. It seems like a long shot. I know someone earlier said it worked but they also changed the belt at the same time confusing what may have been the real problem. I saw one You tube video where the guy put some Lucas product in the case and he claims it worked. It was an automatic transmissions product. I am not a fan of these mechanics in a bottle. However you may want to try to find the video and see exactly what he used.

If you do not use it in the winter temperatures I would use a 20w-50 full Synthetic.
The rebuild will work. How much time can you devote to this?