Tweaked FEL Output

Mrwurm · May 12, 2003

I am posting this because my wife has been busy and I don't feel I've been yelled at enough lately. I am sure this post will generate some cautious responses. So, go ahead and let me have it.

My FEL (7308 on NH TC30) is spec'd to lift 870 lbs. I have found this amount to be somewhat inadequate once in a while. My FEL also, did not have enough power to lift the front of the tractor off the ground. I am aware that FEL capacities are set based on structural strength of loader and tractor, hydraulic capacity, front axle weight limit, tire loading limit, and front to rear ballasting concerns.

That all being said, here is what I did. I removed the cover from my selective control valve. Found that there is only one place to make adjustments. I placed a block of wood under the loader to allow for cylinder travel, then I tried to lift the tractor with the loader. Nope, won't do it. I then loosened a jam nut and turned the adjusting screw in until the loader produced enough power to lift the tractor.

This was a low-tech method to adjust my pressure relief at the valve but, as the system main relief is supposed to be set at 2150 psi, I think it is safe from a hydraulic system stand point. The only question that remains is will the mechanical systems survive the additional abuse. (I've only found one occasion in the past year when my loader did not have enough power to lift something I wanted to move, so this is a seldom-use situation)

Of course, my old settings made the loader incapable of lifting the rear of the tractor off the ground due to my loaded tires. I will have to experiment to see if the new adjusted power output wil require additional ballasting in the rear.

Ok, I said enough. What do you think?

rockyridgefarm · May 12, 2003

i started to say "you'll be sorry..." then I remembered this:

( Jerry TC30V )

My NH dealer acted as if the TC30 had an advantage over the Boomers in front axle strength.nnIF so, you should be OK/ Does the manual warn against dishing out the front wheels? That would be another clue...

icat · May 12, 2003

I think I'm glad I opted for the bigger loader!

My worry would be that the hoses and fittings would not be "rated" for the increase pressure.

kensfarm · May 12, 2003

I'm sure someone would lend you their wife to yell at you for a while.. until you've reached your quota! Were you using only the main arms of FEL to try and lift.. or the bucket pivot to lift the front of the tractor? I wouldn't mind having more lifting power.. but I can already lift my back wheels off the ground when trying to uproot a stump.. my tires are loaded w/ wheel weights.. maybe they had the setting too low from the start. Is it safe.. I believe that would depend.. but I'd go out and run some tests on your new found power to see what you can expect. Knowing your tractor's capabilities & limits will help keep you safe.

Mosey · May 12, 2003

I think it would be reasonable for you to be able to lift your rear tires off the ground with just the fluid and no other weight on the back. I also think it would be reasonable to be able to lift the font of the tractor off the ground by using the boom cylinders (not having to use the bucket curl cylinders).

Did you keep track of how many times you turned the adjusting screw in? How did you know that "in" would be the right way to go, or did you just guess?

I think New Holland is way conservative on the 7308 mounted on a Class II Boomer. I've heard of people adjusting the lift capacity and never heard of any problems. I commend you for having the courage to give it try! I'm sure you're going to get bashed, so be ready to duck!

I hope you get some feedback on other 7308 owners. For comparison, I have the Bush Hog M246 on my tractor right now. I'm not sure how much longer it's going to be there, but that's the subject of another thread When is rear ballast needed with a FEL?. Anyway, it will lift the front tires off the ground using the boom cylinders without even working. The tractor can be at an idle. I don't have loaded tires or wheel weights, but I can assure you that if it had both, it would lift the rears off the ground if I had enough weight in the bucket. What I'm not sure about is how much weight the front axle is going to handle.

I think a reasonable amount of weight to be able to lift with a Class II Boomer is somewhere in between the 875 lb rating of the 7308 and the 1535 lb rating of the M246. Something like 1100 lbs would be OK for the tractor frame and front axle, and safe as long as you have enough ballast.

Mosey · May 12, 2003

icat - "I think I'm glad I opted for the bigger loader!"

What "bigger loader" do you have and on what tractor?

Mosey · May 12, 2003

kensfarm - "I can already lift my back wheels off the ground when trying to uproot a stump.. my tires are loaded w/ wheel weights.. maybe they had the setting too low from the start."

According to kensfarm's bio, he has a bigger tractor with a bigger loader, but his performace is more what I would expect. I've heard of the 7308 coming from the factory with various settings. I talked to a guy with a TC25D with a 7308 who said he's never stalled his loader. Maybe Mrwurm's was ajusted too low to start with. I'm wondering if other brands factory loaders perform more like kensfarm's or more like Mrwurm's? Hopefully, we'll find out on this thread.

Hoeman00 · May 12, 2003

Get a gauge and put it in line and see what pressure u are running now.
The pump has a relief valve so whole system is still protected.
The hoses are the same as the rear remotes use and this is at pump pressure so they should be OK.
All the hoses have lots of safety built in because of the shock load that they could be subject too.
I'd go w/ the pressure was too low to begin w/ and u might be close to normal now.
What about getting dealer too double check on the next service or warranty repair?

Mrwurm · May 12, 2003

Cool /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Lot's of good replies.

Some replies...

Keith, the system pressure is supposed to be set at 2150psi and the hoses are rated for 3000psi so I don't think there is any risk of oveloading the hydraulic components except for shock load.

Kensfarm, yes, I was lifting with only the main arms. This is something that Kubota's and Deere's do with no trouble.

Mosey, yes, I know exactly how much I turned the screw. I tried turning it out and in until I figured which direction had the desired effect (in = power)

Tim, yes, I have also heard that most NH loaders are set up as much as 300 psi below spec from the factory. Here's an interesting point. The loader valve including all the fasteners had a thick coat of paint on them. I had to carve off the paint to release the nut and screw for adjustment. The valve is a 'Prince' and I'll bet that NH doe'snt make any adjustments to them at all. They probably get them from Prince and bolt them on.

Also, having this checked by the dealer would be great. But he is 30 miles away and I won't be seeing their service bay until I have a repair need.

MikeBurr · May 12, 2003

Could you post a picture of where the adjustment screw is or go into more detail of it's location. Might want to adjust mine. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

B7500 · May 12, 2003

I NEVER am able to lift my rear (loaded) tires on my Kubota B7500. Tell me what to do...

Mrwurm · May 12, 2003

MikeBurr, my TC30 has the control valve in a different location than yours. I would bet it does not use the same valve either. For mine, I removed the control cover and found a jam nut and a small set screw that I turned with an allen wrench. I loosened the nut and turned the screw further in.

BigDave · May 12, 2003

( I think it would be reasonable for you to be able to lift your rear tires off the ground with just the fluid and no other weight on the back. I also think it would be reasonable to be able to lift the font of the tractor off the ground by using the boom cylinders (not having to use the bucket curl cylinders). )

Why? I can only lift my front end by curling the bucket, but that lifts the front wheels off the ground by more than a foot. I not sure how to do it with just the arms, since my hydraulic cylinders have reached the end of their travel when the arms get to the ground. I also want my loaded rear tires firmly planted on the ground. So, why would I want a loader that can toss my tractor around with ease? I think I would only get into trouble.

thcri · May 12, 2003

Could you post a picture of the screw for us other guys that have the 7308?? I am not sure I want to do it on my TC29D? I can lift my wheels up with not much trouble on mine. If not I put it in gear and move forward some as I push th loader control. Works everytime.

murph

icat · May 12, 2003

( What "bigger loader" do you have and on what tractor?)

Just purchased the Kubota L3130 HST last Saturday and decided to go with the L723 loader. Delivery is in 10 days since they didn't have the bigger loader in stock. They did have the smaller LA513 loader, but I felt I might need the larger FEL down the road. From the replys in this post it looks like I was right! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Mrwurm · May 13, 2003

Keith, if I used my loader primarily for tasks that pushed it to the edge of it's capacity I would opt for a larger tractor and stronger loader. The reason that I wanted a little more power out of mine is that I have plans of installing some trees this year. The trees come 'ball'd and wrapped' from the nursery. I am told that they weigh 1,000lbs plus or minus due to natural variation. Once I move and plant these two or three trees I will probably never need the extra capacity again. In contrast, if I was running a tree farm and doing this all the time, I would trade up to a bigger machine.
My point is this, we should all be using our machines well within their designed limits. But, it's good to know I now have a little extra if needed /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

kensfarm · May 13, 2003

Does anyone know where to find the lift capacities for NH FEL's arms (at bucket pivot are published). The reason I'm asking.. the only task my FEL won't do is unload a 1 ton pallet of wood pellots off a flat bed.. the one time I tried.. I ended up having to pick up everything off the ground. On the other hand.. tried helping the septic tank guy.. get the concrete door unstuck.. the door didn't budge.. but the entire concrete platform w/ the first row of blocks attached pulled up.. I still have to fix that.

Anonymous Poster · May 13, 2003

( I ended up having to pick up everything off the ground....but the entire concrete platform w/ the first row of blocks attached pulled up )

This has nothing to do with the post, but when I read folks confessing like this, it makes some of the things I do seem less embarassing /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

GregM

kensfarm · May 13, 2003

I try my best to laugh at my mistakes.. I was just trying to give a example.. for one job.. not enough.. for the other.. more than I wanted. The question behind my blunder.. the bucket pivot specks are in 1700-2000lb range.. what are the loader arm lifting specs. Yes.. I now have full access to my septic tank.. it was blocked and backing up into the basement.. the septic guy was just breaking off pieces w/ his pry bar.. I had to get it open.

jwhite · May 15, 2003

I adjusted my 7308 on a TC33D last night using the method first posted here. It took a little less than a half a turn inward to be able to lift the front without using the curl. Your tractor may vary.

I took a couple pictures while do it. Took about 5 minutes total.

Wrench is 1/2". Allen is just one that fit on one of those multi-size folding sets. When I loosened the jam nut the black seal paint came off, showing it had never been adjusted either.

Jay

Jay