Welder question...

Richard · Jan 29, 2020

Don't have one but, once in blue moon, have need of one.

Has casually crossed my mind to perhaps get one. (my blue moon is currently out)

Homeowner, ZERO welding experience, has 110v and/or 220 available

I currently have need to weld the (slightly less than 1/4") skirt on my rear rotary cutter. Caught a tree and bent part of the skirt back. (unit is probably 25 years old so not as solid as a new one)

Anyway.... if I decided to weld that myself, what type/size welder would I need to consider. Given that I'm homeowner and never welded before, would there be any merit in looking at a nicer unit to grow into?

Currently enamored with thought of getting one. Spoke with local trade school one day. I don't recall exactly what I was told but my memory is I could take a class and learn there......but, I'd first have to sign a waiver form that I'm learning to learn and NOT for a job afterwards (they don't want to damage their placement percentages which I fully understand) AND, the class would cost right around $5,000.

That is when I backed away.... I can make a lot of mistakes on my boxblade or mower with cash to spare for that kind of change.

Or, at least that's my thoughts.

Your thoughts?

Billrog · Jan 29, 2020

Your right Richard, not going to give you any advice on what welder to buy but if you have a bunch of old steel around there a bit of practice and you'll be welding in no time.

LS Tractor Owner · Jan 29, 2020

I am not a welder by any means, but always had small projects / metal things that needed to be repaired. I bought a Harbor Freight wire feed 220v welder about 12 years ago. It has run at least 750 ft of wire and is still going strong. About the biggest stuff I have used it for was repairing the rails on a trailer. My son made pickup truck bed rails and a headache rack.

An inexpensive way to learn how to weld. It will not do any heavy work, but you can do the small stuff for sure. Watch some videos, give it a try....

mwayne · Jan 29, 2020

$5000? You can buy a lot of equipment for that! YouTube welding videos will help you quite a bit. Here is a starter:

Introduction to Welding - YouTube

dragoneggs · Jan 29, 2020

Cheapest way is to get a stick machine. More fun and easier is a MIG... my preference. Practice is all it takes and watch a few YouTube videos to give you some ideas on technique. As long as you are building something for your own consumption, no worries. You can always fix it again.

When I go to the dump/recycle station, I do a little dumpster diving in the metal bin and find various scrap metal that I maybe can use. Worst case, perfect free material to practice on. People throw out all kinds of old steel stuff that is junk to them but if cut up, can be used for shop projects, repairs, etc. if you cut it up. What I don't use I haul back to the recycle.

Roadworthy · Jan 29, 2020

I'd probably get an inexpensive wire feed but avoid Harbor Freight. Why? They work fine but you can't purchase repair parts. I have one and one of the range switches went out. I found a near substitute on eBay - probably a better switch than it came with. I'd get a welder which allows you to use either flux wire or cover gas. You don't need the gas or tank but it might be nice for later. The welds are nicer with cover gas. Depending on need you may even consider brazing with a MAPP gas torch. Brazing is much like soldering but stronger. In rural area sometimes high schools offer courses in farm welding. You could also ask a buddy to show you the basics.

WranglerX · Jan 29, 2020

A top end 120 volt MIG welder will usually handle up to 1/4 material quite well... A good 240v welder will probably stick anything together whether it be a MIG or Stick machine....

I personally have Hobart Handler 140 and it does about 98% if what I need to do, it I don't think the HH 140 will handle it I farm it out....

There is a welding forum on the site....

https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/welding/

IF you want to learn a bit more about welding you may look at what Jody has to say....

Welding Tips and Tricks - TIG, MIG, Stick and a pantload of other info

Also it said you can teach a monkey or a blond to MIG weld so the is hope...Probably no need for a $5000 welding class to get commercial certification level...Check to see if local adult or college nigh school has classes....

Personally I would stay with HOBART or MILLER or LINCOLN or ESAB as the are heavy into USA and repair parts are easily available...

Dale

dragoneggs · Jan 29, 2020

If you know anyone who welds, my bet is they would be glad to spend a couple hours with you. Bring your rig to their shop, offer to replenish their favorite beverage and then go home happy and excited with a few tips in place. That is what I did when I got my MIG. Went over to a fellow TBNer, ShieldArc and he taught me a bunch in very short order... forever grateful. He watched me weld, told me to get some 'cheater lenses' so I could see the puddle. Told me what to listen for... techniques such as back stitching, pushing, pulling, etc. Then it is all just practice!

BlueKnife · Jan 29, 2020

I was just talking to a buddy of mine the other day about this. He's never welded before but wants to learn. I sent him this list.

homesteadonomics
- YouTube
ChuckE29
- YouTube
Make it Extreme
- YouTube
Made in Poland
- YouTube
Mike festiva
- YouTube

You can learn quite a bit from watching these channels. I'd watch a bunch before buying a welder. Help you decide which machine you should get to meet most of your needs.

RandyT · Jan 29, 2020

DL Meisen said:
A top end 120 volt MIG welder will usually handle up to 1/4 material quite well... A good 240v welder will probably stick anything together whether it be a MIG or Stick machine....

I personally have Hobart Handler 140 and it does about 98% if what I need to do, it I don't think the HH 140 will handle it I farm it out....

There is a welding forum on the site....

https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/welding/

IF you want to learn a bit more about welding you may look at what Jody has to say....

Welding Tips and Tricks - TIG, MIG, Stick and a pantload of other info

Also it said you can teach a monkey or a blond to MIG weld so the is hope...Probably no need for a $5000 welding class to get commercial certification level...Check to see if local adult or college nigh school has classes....

Personally I would stay with HOBART or MILLER or LINCOLN or ESAB as the are heavy into USA and repair parts are easily available...

Dale

I also do most of my welding with my Hobart Handler 140. Most of the time run flux core since most of the stuff I weld isn't real Mig friendly. Then for the stuff I can't get clean enough for good wire feed welds I grab the Hobart 160 stick welder. Have been even known to run some 1/16 inch 6011 on mower decks. I don't consider myself a very good welder but i can get two pieces of metal to stick together with enough structural integrity to do what i need.

Tractor Seabee · Jan 30, 2020

I have welded all my life (80+), O/A and SMAW (arc). Learned in high school and parlayed later into being an industrial pipefitter and welder. At the school we were started out on straight arc to learn the fundamentals and puddle control for position work then moved to O/A doing the same. First paid job where pipe welding was involved; foreman asked me if I could weld (I had little production welding till then). It was O/A all positions involved. I said yeah I can do it, he was skeptical but let me go. Came back and hour later, watched me and reviewed my previous work. I was there 6 months as a pipe welder both O/A and SMAW.

Have fitted for MIG and TIG welders but never learned to do it. I have never had a reason to use TIG for my own work. I am Leery of the small MIG machines, I have seen too many welds that are not will fused into the base metal, just laid on top. Most hobby guys do not use enough heat to get adequate penetration. If I do a butt weld the penetration has to be all the way through the joint with on crack on the other side. In my opinion a 120V MIG flux core is a sheet metal to 1/16th welder only. Trying to build up a butt weld on 1/4" and thicker has to be tedious. That is 1/8" rod and larger for me. I set the heat so the first 1" of flux gets black. I was a certified ASME power piping and pressure vessel welder both SMAW and O/A in my younger days.

Garage sale or CL AC buzz box is a great way to get started; usually between $50 and $150. You will need 30A 240V outlet. HF hood, gloves, grinder, chipper, wire brush and some 6011 and 6013 rod and you are running. Do not buy the small rod packages. Get at least 10# at a time cost wise. A 50# bulk can of each and you will be a pro buy the time you use it up. That is what we did at the school, each had a 50# can to burn up. Practice all positions. You can burn a lot of rod in 4 hours. Then if you want MIG get a quality machine with shielding gas ($1500 or so)

Practice! Practice! Makes Perfect. $5K will buy a lot of welding rod and scrap. LOL

Ron

Motorboatin · Jan 30, 2020

I hire kids from the local community college welding program and I know they aren't paying 5k for their classes. I think it's around $300 per class and you'll only need to take two or three classes to get you going

coxhaus · Jan 30, 2020

I think welding classes at the local community college is the way to go to learn welding. They will set you on the right path.

I am no pro welder but I have taken a couple of welding classes at my local community college and I can fix some things. I also think 110v welders are for sheet metal. 1/4 inch plate should be welded with a 220v welder or maybe gas but I am not very good at running a puddle with gas so I would use a 220v welder. Now days you can buy 220v welders for not a lot of money. I say stick to Miller, Lincoln or Hobart. I think HD has a Lincoln 180 for not too much. You can buy Hobart at Tractor Supply. There are also online places to buy welders. You can buy used. I bought a Hobart 250 amp MIG used out of a University for cheap $500. Stick welders are the cheapest for heavy plate. I have a 40 year old Wards stick 295 amp welder that was made by Union Carbide that has worked for me for many years. But the classic stick welder is the old Lincoln tombstone. They are every where on craigslist. For $100 you would have a good welder for 1/4 plate. The problem with stick welders is they do not weld sheet metal so that is where the 110v MIG welders come into play.

ovrszd · Jan 30, 2020

Dale and Randy have the ideal starter MIG Welder, the Hobart 140. It can be used with flux core wire so you don't need a bottle of gas.

Since you don't have the goal of being a heavy metal professional the 140 will do anything you attempt. The success or lack of it will always be on your personal ability and not the welder's shortcoming.

I use Miller products. A little more pricey. Great quality product and easy access to parts.

boomer1025 · Jan 30, 2020

Mark from Everlast welders is a site member and can set you up with a good welder at a good price.
Check out the Power Arc 140, 160 & 200 stick welders.
I have the PA 140 and it welds anything I need. If I was to get another one it would be the PA 200.

WranglerX · Jan 30, 2020

If you guys are having trouble with doing MIG this short video will help you identify problem and how to correct it...

How NOT TO Weld: Most Common MIG Welding Mistakes - YouTube

I gave up stick welding many (15) years ago (180 amp lincoln tombstone) thinking I was never going to do anymore welding, about 7 years ago I picked up HH 140 MIG, it's handled every project I have thrown at it and stuff BIGGER than sheet metal....

Stick welder cannot seem to understand MIG is simpler easier and just as good for anything less that building bridges or skyscrapers.... This is why almost all automated processes (robotic) use MIG concepts....

Only issue is for about 5% of my work I wished I had stepped up to a 240V MIG ( and silly me I have two 240V outlets in shop) .... But then preheats and multipass bead seem to get me by...

Dale

herm0016 · Jan 30, 2020

i also have the Hobart handler 140. Its a great small machine and its nice to throw it in a big rubbermaid with all the stuff i need and bring it to the work. handles everything i have done. trailer repairs, rebuilding an old 6 way blade, small stuff up to 3/8.

coxhaus · Jan 30, 2020

I guess you know the duty cycle on a Hobart 140 is 2 minutes out of 10 minutes at 90 amps. If you are trying to well heavy plate wide open it must take all day because the duty cycle is even shorter.

I have to say I do like Hobart machines. And I have 3 of them. I think they are the best buys out there.

/pine · Jan 30, 2020

coxhaus said:
I guess you know the duty cycle on a Hobart 140 is 2 minutes out of 10 minutes at 90 amps. If you are trying to well heavy plate wide open it must take all day because the duty cycle is even shorter.

I have to say I do like Hobart machines. And I have 3 of them. I think they are the best buys out there.

Who the **** attempts to do heavy production work with a 110V welder ??

BTW... In addition to a Handler...I have a 140A 115V MIG welder that runs at 100% duty cycle...

WranglerX · Jan 30, 2020

coxhaus said:
I guess you know the duty cycle on a Hobart 140 is 2 minutes out of 10 minutes at 90 amps. If you are trying to well heavy plate wide open it must take all day because the duty cycle is even shorter.

I have to say I do like Hobart machines. And I have 3 of them. I think they are the best buys out there.

In all my MIG welding with HH 140 (7 years now) I have never run up against duty cycle (overheat) shut down.... If you think about it 2 minutes (+/- ) is a long time... And you have to come up for air at some point....

Dale