Welding 1/4" steel- Mig or stick?

[BTackett]

Thanks guys! I kinda put the plow welding on the side for now. I am concentrating on getting the tractor painted now then I will work on the plow.

Yea, I should have said " will this work with MY WELDER"? Oh well, it has been an interesting thread.

Bill

 

[john_bud]

You guys would be surprised of how thick of steel a low amp migs can weld on. My mig is a 100 amps and I've welded 3/8" with it and

[snip]

Knowing how to form a puddle, how much wire speed and amps plays a big roll in welding with low amps. There are so many different methods of forming a puddle that will give a good weld and that will hold and not break. Also, how you build your project plays a roll also.

No, not surprised at all. I've seen guys that know how to weld and they can make excellent beads with less than high dollar equipment. Clean starting material is a biggie as you pointed out. Knowing how to form a puddle and work it into the parent material is a learned skill and needed with marginal power.


Still, for a "hack" like me, the higher dollar equipment works out better. Is it needed? no. But it does make life easier and means that the operator needs to be less skillful to get satisfactory results. When I was running a 110v mig, it would still weld when hot, but penetration got less and less and less until it looked like bird poop on top of the metal. Only after laying BP, did it overheat and shut down. That's what flipped my switch and put me into a 255a mig. Never looked back.

jb

 

[bobodu]

Tried AC stick welders many times and only accomplished sticking the rods. Had I been given the chance to use a DC stick machine I MAY HAVE bought one of those in the beginning instead of my HH140 (110V machine) that I practiced on.

So....by your own admission....you can't weld with SMAW!!!
Any time you're in Whitley County,Indiana I'll let ya try my big Lincoln Onan powered DC welder and maybe...teach you AC.Out here,we use 110v MIGs for fixing dog chains and the rare horseshoe nail sculpture.

 

[Gary Fowler]

I have to agree with Toadhill. I owned a 120 mig machine and finally gave it away. If you tried to run the voltage high enough to get any kind of penetration, the thermal overload would kick in after about 30 seconds and last 15 or more minutes. I have since bought a Miller 350 amp CC/CV machine that will power any equipment that you want to hook onto it, but I still prefer the stick for heavy sections and TIG for light work.

 

[canoetrpr]

Interesting thread. I picked up a used AC/DC Hobart Stickmate Lx235 which I have been practising with. I think I'm starting to make some progress after some practise.

One thing that I'm not a fan of is all the mess with the slag . I can see my self replacing it, or complementing it with a mig someday if I really get into this welding thing.

What is an adequate sized mig for a guy doing stuff around a hobby farm, and around a CUT? Fixing the odd implement, welding a QA bracket on a bucket or a pallet fork - etc?

Looking at the new machines, I'm guessing a Hobart Handler 210 or a Millermatic 212 would fit the bill. Not that I can justify either of them at this time - LOL! My stick machine will keep me going for a while.

I see a used Millermatic 185 on craigslist around here with a gas tank. Seems to be about equivalent to the above two - 150A at 60% duty cycle.

 

[RobJ]

And I have a 210 amp Hobart that I can carry in oen hand that WILL do even better

Carrying it in one hand is one thing, finding a place to plug it in is another. Just got a HH140, 110. Sweet with gas to man. Perfect for 18ga, 16, 12ga, projects I use it for. Use an 220v buzzbox for the bigger stuff.

I can weld with mine in a hotel room!!

 

[workinallthetime]

just kind of looking over a few post in here and see such a wide variety of comments on the use of stick vs mig welders. I built wrought iron fences and gates for about 5 years when i was younger and was trained by a certified ( in more ways than one) welder. We built some huge gates that hung by 2 hinges, we used a big miller mig in the shop and some old offbrand stick welder in the field. We built pipe racks to hold tons of weight with the ole stick welder out of scrap that are still there today and being used. The techniques used to weld are where you get your strength from what i did and saw. I do a moderate amount of cleaning and bevel every joint before i weld.
I use a hh130 with flux core wire and its really on its last leg but just continues on. I patched an old bucket back together on a mf 175 that never tore again. In the past year I built a toothbar for the kubota and a thumb for the bh, both of those items are under alot of stress yet non of the welds have failed. I had a bracket actually tear from the metal due to a design flaw on my part but the welds held.

IMO its the guy holding the gun not the gun that is to blame

 

[chumly2071]

One way to help answer the weld penetration question is to make whatever bead you feel necessary on a sample joint. Cut it in half to look directly at the weld cross section, and then etch it with acid. This will show you how deep your weld penetrated into the parent material. On the lighter machines, it will not be very deep, and laying pass upon pass on top of each other does little to marry the parent materials together. Most little machines work sufficiently because there is so much extraneous weld that the mechanics of the joint overcome the lack of penetration/fusion from a small welder.

The 110V units have their place, and I own one. For heavier fab of 1/4" up to 1/2", I use my 220V 210A mig machine. For any bigger than that, I go to my welding buddy and have him help me out with his 350A mig or 300A mobile stick rig.

 

[RobJ]

it will not be very deep, and laying pass upon pass on top of each other does little to marry the parent materials together. /QUOTE]

I don't think the proper procedure is to keep laying it on top, of course that's not going to do any good. It's more of a side to side. And using the bevel to expose more of the parent material.

Rob

 

[workinallthetime]

Duno if it helped or not but we would weld then clean and even grind the weld down and lay another beed on top of that one and on big stuff there were sometimes a total of 4 beeds ran on the item
1st down the middle
gind and clean
2nd between surface and first weld on right side
clean and grind
3rd between surface and first weld on left side
clean and grind
4th back down the middle joining the left, right and center welds together.

I remember him telling me thats how they did pipe on oil field equipment