welding rod question

[Ole Orange]

WOWI bought my first 5 lbs of 7014 and as in my first post I burned nothing but 6011 for years, I cant believe how easy it is its a dream to work with. THANK YOU everybody for all the help Where was Tractor by Net 30 years ago.

PS. used my 40 dollar Harbor freight auto dark helmet still working great.

 

[Shield Arc]

:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:See I had you fooled into thinking I could weld. Now you see how easy it is! :thumbsup:

 

[Ole Orange]

:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:See I had you fooled into thinking I could weld. Now you see how easy it is! :thumbsup:

Not so sure Im a welder but along with the new to me tractor has come a lot of fabricating for the 3 point hitch.
Did a bunch of welding today on my new to me 4 ton trailer and using 6011 for my first pass and then a couple more with 7014 and almost looks like I know what I'm doing.
Thank again.
PS i got a good chuckle out of your profile where it says unemployed no marketable skills from your list of equipment i would guess you have 1 **** of a hobby!!

 

[Shield Arc]

i would guess you have 1 **** of a hobby!!

That's me, hobbyist!

Get your self a good DC inverter welder, and you will see a huge improvement in your welding.:thumbsup:

 

[Ole Orange]

That's me, hobbyist!

Get your self a good DC inverter welder, and you will see a huge improvement in your welding.:thumbsup:

Perhaps I will ask SANTA for 1 this year. LOL
What will be the difference in using DC Will I need to learn all over again?

 

[Shield Arc]

Oh no you wouldn't need to learn anything. DC is just so much more smoother, the weld flows more.
First picture 7018 run on AC. Second picture 7018 run on DC.

 

[Texasmark]

Miller has a good calculator that will help you with that.
Biggest problem with Mig welding is people run way to cold. Cold lap is a huge problem with under powered Mig welders!
Miller - Welding Calculators

Thanks. I'll check it out. My stick is a Miller Thunderbolt I think they call it, locally purchased.

Mark

 

[Arc weld]

Again, for stick welding it's better to go by what the weld is telling you. It's very common for welders unfamiliar with a specific machine to test their heat on a piece of scrap. No 2 machines are the exactly the same. For real critical stuff machines are calibrated and they'll sometimes even hook up meters on the cables to check the settings. I'd say that wouldn't apply to 99.99% of the welding on here.

 

[Mark @ Everlast]

If you think about it, on an AC transformer welder, the arc literally goes out 60 times a second as it transitions between polarity. That:
1) Makes the arc more harsh and a noticeable amount more spattery.
2) Makes it use more amps to get the same amount of heat as it is not only micro cooling, but because the source of heat is changing back and forth. DC+ polarity gives the best most consistent arc performance, and you are only getting that half the time.

 

[Mark @ Everlast]

edit: Weird malfunction...double post. and it tells me this one is too short to edit.

 

[Reverser]

Thanks. I'll check it out. My stick is a Miller Thunderbolt I think they call it, locally purchased.

Mark

Good solid machine. More than adequate for most jobs. :thumbsup:

 

[Shield Arc]

edit: Weird malfunction...double post. and it tells me this one is too short to edit.

Lately I have the hardest time posting here, I'm about to give up on this site!

 

[Gary Fowler]

I recently bought a small box of 3/32" 6013 since guys here said they were so good for thin metal. I don't care for them at all. While they do easily weld thin metal without excessive burn thru, the slag just about has to be ground off and it is bad about trapping slag in the metal unless you run it really hot and then you are defeating the purpose of small rod to weld thin material. I haven't burned more than about 6 of the rods but I don't think the quality of weld will improve much with more experimentation with amperage and arc length. I will take a 6010 or 7018 rod anytime over the 6013. I never liked 7014 or 7024 for the same reason as the 6013, 7024 can trap a lot of slag unless you run it extremely hot and the 7014 has really low impact properties. You can put 3 passes of 1/8" rod all the way around a piece of 1/2" metal and still knock it off with a 4 lb. hammer with about 2-3 blows.

 

[Shield Arc]

7014 has really low impact properties. You can put 3 passes of 1/8" rod all the way around a piece of 1/2" metal and still knock it off with a 4 lb. hammer with about 2-3 blows.

Isn't that the strangest thing:confused3:. Now with 7018 you wouldn't live long enough to beat it off with a sledge hammer!:thumbsup:

 

[Reverser]

I never liked 7014 or 7024 for the same reason as the 6013, 7024 can trap a lot of slag unless you run it extremely hot and the 7014 has really low impact properties. You can put 3 passes of 1/8" rod all the way around a piece of 1/2" metal and still knock it off with a 4 lb. hammer with about 2-3 blows.

I'll agree with you on the 6013, but I've never heard of a problem with 7014. I've used it at times for many years and been around others using it. At times 7014 was used on equipment that was subject to impact. Never heard of any of the welds breaking.
:confused3:

 

[Shield Arc]

Few years ago I did some fillet weld break tests.
Here are the results.
6013 = 3-blows
6011 = 8-blows
7014 = 10-blows
6010 5P-Plus = 10-blows
7018 (cold) = 18-blows
7018 (hot) = 23- blows

 

[rankrank1]

6013 is indeed easy to worm hole or get slag inclusions which is one of the reasons I try not to use it anywhere strength is important. Some brands of rods are much worse than others too for doing it. So far I like Messer (Us Forge) the best of any 6013 that I have personally ran. (Note while I like Messer 6013, I absolutely hate Messer 6011 and will stay with Hobart 335A for my 6011).

That said, 6013 does have its uses especially for thin metal when no wire feeder is available. Now if you expect it to be a beautiful weld on really thin metal then you just might be expecting a tad too much out of it. But for a repair and appearance is not so important then 6013 can work good enough to do the job.

 

[Ole Orange]

Lately I have the hardest time posting here, I'm about to give up on this site!

Dont give up! your input helped me greatly, I spent all of today welding on rebuilding a utility trailer using strut for my cross beams and it was a rebuild from 15 years ago. The last time I built it used 6011 and burned through the strut every where, today I extended the bed 1 foot in each direction using 7014 and only 1 small burn through.:cool2:
On another note I saw posted here on how strong 7014 is, I tacked the corners on one of my uprights and tried to beat it off because it was crooked and no way, ended up putting the band saw to 2 corners to get it up straight.

Keep up all the good input for us non "HOBBYISTS":dance1:

 

[Shield Arc]

6013, and 7014 are strange rods to me:confused2:. The impact properties are low, but they still bend just fine.

 

[Reverser]

Few years ago I did some fillet weld break tests.
Here are the results.
6013 = 3-blows
6011 = 8-blows
7014 = 10-blows
6010 5P-Plus = 10-blows
7018 (cold) = 18-blows
7018 (hot) = 23- blows

Thanks for posting this, ShieldArc. I've often thought about these tests you made along with your notes, and always meant to go back and copy them for future reference. :thumbsup:

Among other things, your tests show how much better the 7018 rods are for strength over the other common rods. And the tests put all commonly used rods in perspective while answering several questions that had been brought up (particularly about 6013 and 7014).

If I remember correctly, the "cold" 7018 rods were actually used right out of an opened box that had been left open for a good while, and still took 18 blows to break it.
And seems like you said that the weld with "hot" 7018 rods were beat down flat with 23 blows, and still didn't break completely. And you had to beat it back the other way to get it to come apart.

That was a good read and an outstanding job you did, and much appreciated by everyone. :drink: