welding

[Birdhunter1]

I've known several people that didn't know you could weld with an oxy-acetylene torch. That's how my high school teacher taught us first... oxy-acetylene, then an arc welder then later the mig. He said he could teach anyone to mig weld, the other's are more difficult and take more practice.

 

[thingy]

Fattyfat,,yeah,,,them code books,,too many of them,to many pages,,but 80 percent of whats in them people like me and you don't even need,,we just need to be able to sort through all them pages and find that one paragraph that we do need,,,,but you won't see much downhill other than pipeline,,even on pipelines,you'll get some prefabricted spool pieces in that may have been rooted with tig and out with subarc,,,pipeline stick welding is a whole nother world,,since I've been inspecting,I've mainly just worked in powerplants and chemical plants,refinorarys,etc,,,only inspected on 3-4 pipeline jobs,,they didn't want to pay enough,or maybe I didn't know the right person,,,thingy

 

[Sully2]

.....

But,,this side of argument has nothing to do with the subject,,its not a mig verses stick or verses tig,,,the guy is a beginner,,he wants to know what kinda machine he should get,,I'm assuming he knows next to nothing about welding,,,many people told him to get a mig,many told him to get a stick,,some even suggested tig,,its now up to him,,you and others have said why you think he should get a mig,me and others have said why we think he should get a stick,,,ain't much else to add here I don't think.
I can weld pipe in postion with either one,[used to be pretty good if I do say so myself],I have a stick welder,I don't have a mig,don't need a mig,if I needed one,I would have one,,,you have a mig,cause you can't stick weld,,good for you,it works for you,you don't need a stick machine,,,what else is there to say here?
thingy

NOOOOO...Read back and you'll see where "I SAID" he should buy a stick welder..preferable an AC/DC model..if for not other reason than pure economics! ( Remember..hes got a tight budget). It will do most everything he might need and will last as long as he does...BUT...that I could see that "on down the road" be might ogo to a MIG..because of its ease and how nice they can weld!

Me personally..I can buy a Stickmate for about 1/2 what I paid for an HH140..and LOTS LESS than say an Ironman 210

 

[thingy]

OK Sully,didn't remember that,,,,but will say if he does as you recommend he probably won't need to get a mig,unless he's going to be welding sheet metal. All he needs to do is practice.
If he gets a dc stick machine,,he needs to get him some 6010 rods,welding supply place will have them,,would get a small pack,[think its 5 lbs?] of e-6010 in 3/32 and one 1/8 pack,,,if your machine has a selector choose dc,,make sure your stinger one[the one with rod holder] is hooked to dcep,,+ sign,,,,get you some steel,,1/4 inch or thicker,,grind a spot for ground,,turn your machine to about 90-100 amps,[the hotter its set at,the easier it is to start your rod,thats the hard part when stick welding],[well,,],,you can turn it down as you get the hang of it,,and scratch the steel with the rod [3/32 ]tip,,your get the arc started that way,,trick is to keep it going,,you'll see a melted puddle,thats the weld,,than you just got to move,,takes practice,,a stick class would really help out,,or somebody you can at least show you how to get it going,,,some people pick up on it fast,some don't,,I use a shade 9 lens and a 2.5 cheater lens cause my eyes are shot,,but you can wear reading glasses under hood,[this is if you wear glasses],I'd get a flip type hood if you wear glasses or use a cheater,,you can flip the dark shade up and grind or brush with out safety glasses this way,,,once you get going a 3/32 runs about 90 amps,,a 1/8 runs about 110 amps or so,,depends on your machine,,the dial setting might not match up exactlly to real amps,,,thats about all you need to know to get started,,,thingy

 

[sandman2234]

I like the part mentioned that if you can stick weld, you can run a mig. The other one about gas welding and tig is so true! O/A was my first night at class and then on to the Tig.
All in all, I would buy the AC/DC machine for a first one.
David from jax

 

[gemini5362]

I have said and I continue to agree with the side that reccomends he get a stick welder. I feel that he should do that strictly for economic reasons. I have used a mig to make farm type items. I built a pair of 5 foot ramps that are 12 inches wide and load my 6000 pound tractor on them all the time. I used a 175 amp mig for that and had no problem. I have never had one of my mig welds break. The down side is that a decent Mig that will weld 1/4 inch or thicker and be able to get actual penetration is going to eat up the greater part of 1000.00 you can get a pretty good stick machine for that. Also you can find great deals on used stick machines. I have not seen too many good buys on used migs.

One thing no one mentioned too much is welding helmets. You can get a pretty decent arc activated helmet at Harbor Freight for under 50.00 For a new welder and not one of you experienced guys. It is a lot easier to just look through a slightly shaded lens, put your rod where you want it being able to see the whole time and then when the arc starts the helmet turns dark. That is much better than putting on the hood, get your rod ready, flip your head(doesnt that hurt your neck after a while) and get the hood down then being blind until the arc starts.

 

[Tom_Veatch]

I certainly agree with the auto-darkening helmet. I have the 50$ HF example and am very pleased with it. I also have a Miller XLix auto-dark that was pushing 4x as much money. Can't see that the Miller is anywhere near worth the extra $'s.

As far as the welder type is concerned, unless there's going to be considerable light gauge stuff, say less than 1/8", stick is by far the most economical way to go - but IMHO, an AC/DC stick unit is much more desirable than a straight AC and worth the extra cost.

 

[montejw]

for the record, section ix, b31.3 pg. 21 table qw-253 welding variables procedure spec. states uphill or downhill is acceptable. i stand corrected! darn pipeliners doing things backwards anyways. sheesh!

I've been looking at welders for awhile now and see several that have a "downhill pipe" setting, usually engine drive units. You guys were starting to make me wonder what Lincoln and Miller were up to.

Monte
(galbraith, acfl, blanchard, etc.)

 

[BTDT]

Here are a couple of welders I have that I use. One is an old Sears crackerbox ac unit (free from step dad) Pics 19 & 20, and an old Lincoln 200 dc unit with Continental Red Seal engine. The crackerbox unit is in an old shed near my welding table, so if I can build it on my table I use it. The Lincoln is sitting on an old trailer (project for later) that I pull around on the property.

 

[thingy]

Monte,never seen a welder that had written on it,downhill,,,but that don't mean everything,,,can't see how having it wrote on anything would help,,different people run different amps,and it would change depending on what sized rod or wire you was using,,, Downhill is just a direction used on vertical position,,instead of starting at bottom and welding up,,in downhill you start at top and weld down. Yeah,generally a higher heat is used,,you generally carry less metal and travel faster as well,,real good for thin stuff,,,but if you have the technique down you can weld thicker stuff with it as well,and make just as good a weld. Two different worlds when it comes to pipe welding though,,,up,,powerplants,,down,pipelines.
Now its different than under water welding,,thats where somebody holds a cup of water over your head while you weld,,,,man I'm funny,,,thingy