what do i need to know before buying a used mini

MattEffinCameron · Apr 27, 2020

TBN was very helpful when I bought my first tractor about 5 years ago...maybe the community expertise will help me decide whether or not to buy a mini-x now

I have some landscaping projects I need to get done (now and) this summer...I am also working on digging out a stone wall along the edge of my property and have some other things that would be nice to do in the coming year or two.
The FEL on my kubota B series has been helpful but isnt the right tool for most of these jobs.

I had this idea that I could buy a (used) mini-x for ~15-25k, save a bunch of money on the landscaping projects by doing some myself, do my other projects (dredging edge of pond, digging out stonewall etc) and then sell in a year or two and recoup maybe 75% of my investment. Some of the stones (the few biggest) I need to move for my landscaping project this summer are probably 1000-2000lbs, so I was hoping to get as close to 2000 lift capacity as possible, with a hydraulic thumb. If I can lift/move something 1000-2000lbs, I woudnt need to to it at any sort of reach or lift it very high at all, I could roll it across the yard if needed and then just need to be able to move it into place on a retaining wall.

It appears as though in my price range I would be looking at most likely a 6klb machine, maybe as high as 9klb.

My truck is an F150, and I dont have a trailer capable of moving either of those machines, and dont think the truck is able to haul anything that big on a trailer anyway....so moving it around isnt a consideration...I am assuming I would pay someone to haul it to my property when I buy it, and when I sell the buyer can haul away.

A friend who owns a bunch of different equipment for working on his land (on weekends, he is no expert) told me one of the key things to look at with the minis is the tracks, because they are a lot of money to replace.

What other sage wisdom do you have about venturing into the world of used minis?
What can you tell me about the 2000 hour mark?
I notice a lot of machines for sale have just over 2000 hours and often when people are looking they advertise looking for a machine with "under 2000 hours".

mike48130 · Apr 27, 2020

I would say the usual overall inspections but also to focus on the main bearing. It is a big task to tear these down to replace that main bearing, so would look close at that. Otherwise, make sure it is all tight.

JerryK · May 3, 2020

A lot of the smaller ' trailerable ' minis, those under say 6 tons or so, are real expensive. These are desirable by contractors that can pull them around on jobs with their pickup trucks or small dump trucks. And are usually priced like they are gold plated. You have to really hunt around to find a deal on one of these that is not all used up. You can find deals on very large excavator, those that are hard to move, more often. I bought an old 1991 Cat E70B 8 ton unit for $15K, and will probably have another $5K in it when I am done fixing it up to my liking. It fits in my barn going thru my 10X10' doors. Steel tracks last a long time, rubber ages sitting out in the sun. Steel has more front to back traction but tears up grass/pavement. Rubber can be a little better on sod, and definitely better on pavement. Good and bad things about each. Here is a picture of when I was putting the track back on. Someone was running it too loose, and still learning how to operate it....

Hours does not mean as much as how it was cared for, just like buying a tractor. A lot of companies lease a new excavator, and the 2000 hours might be the norm for when the lease is up. My unit had 5400 hours on it, and the Mitsubishi motor purrs like a kitten, and does not use a drop of oil. Pins and bushings were just replaced on everything, and everything is tight. Came with a 4' wide ditch bucket, and I have a new 20" bucket [ for digging stumps/trenching ] and manual thumb I will be putting on this Spring right after I get my trees downed/split/stacked for the winter of 2021. Nothing wrong with manual thumbs. Hydraulic thumbs are best if they pivot with the bucket, that way they line up with the bucket teeth in more than one spot. Mine has no problem throwing around the 4' bucket heaped with dirt at full reach, so I would think it would easily pick up 2000 pounds.

kthompson · May 3, 2020

Jerryk, like the size of yours. I have a 5 ton Volvo. Not a brand I would recommend totally due to the electrical control panel. It has been down for near a month (not been touch right not even though need it due to more pressing issues) due to it. The control panels are expensive and seem to be a weak link. At least mine has. A heavy equipment mechanic who has helped me some told me he really likes Cats due to how simple their electrical is and next would be John Deere.

A few thinks to look for on mini's is does it track straight, how is for pushing, try it. Most likely has a blade. Some have fixed straight blade that does raise and lower but others have them that angle for filling a trench. Consider a quick hitch for the bucket if you will need to change sizes. Does it have the pivoting boom, can be handy in digging near a building. Does it have aux hyd circuit for a thumb or mower head? If so does it have the gpm for a mower? If you will need a thumb get price on it before you buy.

Takman · May 4, 2020

My advice is to check the price of a new machine compared to the used unit. I was surprised how many beat up minis were listed only a few k less than the same machine new.

art · May 4, 2020

First thing to do is operate the brand. There are some makes that are smooth and a beginner could operate within inches and some you are lucky to get within a foot!!! It often does have to do with the brand as I have been in the field with multiple brands at the same time and witnessed experienced operators comment!

MattEffinCameron · May 5, 2020

And which brands are better for beginners art? I am assuming Kubota given all the rave reviews the brand seems to get.

Takman, I am looking for a ~7000lb+ machine for 15-25k (with thumb)...definitely not finding a new machine close to that price point.

Any thoughts on these tracks? It looks a bit like a hot mess but the tracks only ave ~200 hours on them and the tread looks good.

mikester · May 6, 2020

Your undercarriage will be very expensive to fix, it would be worth your time to find or hire someone experienced in repairs to give a second look.

MattEffinCameron · May 10, 2020

I passed on that last machine I posted photos of but am looking at another. The price is right but it may need some work.

If anyone has any thoughts to add to these estimates I would be grateful for your input. going to ask a local kubota dealer tomorrow as well..
Drive sprocket... ~150 for the sprocket, not too challenging to replace myself
Final drive... ~2000 each (not installed) Not sure how difficult that is to do yourself.
Track... ~1500 ea, easy to do your self?
Hydraulic cylinder rebuild...Any idea what this runs for a cylinder on a machine this size?

What if I found a unit that did not have a hydraulic thumb (but was obviously plumbed and had the factory mount for it)...any tips on where I should look for one other than a kubota dealer? Messicks gave me a price point of $2500-$3000. Does that sound about right? Or can I save a considerable amount without sacrificing much quality if I go with a third party?

JerryK · May 10, 2020

Tracks are not that hard to change. They are more intimidating than anything, like putting your backhoe on the first time... I've done it a few times. Use the bucket to lift up the frame on that side and block the frame up real good. If you can, put a sheet or two of plywood underneath where the track goes to help you slide the track inward without it dragging in loose dirt/clay/etc.... usually where ever you ' get ' to work on it when the track comes off. Most excavators use a piston filled with grease to push out the front idler wheel and tighten the track. You let the grease out of that, then push/make sure the idler retracts all the way back with the bucket. Working with an other piece of equipment with a set of forks help a lot if you are taking the old track off and installing a new one. You can put a nylon strap on the track by the collapsed idler and horse that end off, then do the sprocket end. Some tracks are directional, and you have to reinstall them in the correct direction if so. But you basically lift the old track off, then put the new one on the sprocket end first. Then use the bucket or forks or whatever to horse the other end over the idler. Pump the grease back in, and you are good to go. Lots of videos on it online, again, lots of ways to do it.... Andrew Camarata is a good source.... the tracks are REAL HEAVY. Drive sprockets usually last a very long time on rubber tracked machines. Even on normal metal tracks they wear very slowly under most conditions. Again, the best hyd thumbs pivot on the same pin that the bucket does. Thumbs work best if the fingers of the thumb at a boot the same length as the bucket teeth. If you have more than one bucket, that could be a problem with different ones. Aftermarket hyd thumbs pivot on the stick above the bucket pin, and really only line up with the bucket teeth in a certain area. Same with manual thumbs. This is not a real problem, but if you are looking for the best set up, you want the thumb pivoting with the bucket. With a manual thumb, you lower the thumb manually [ with some this is a quick/simple process ]. To pick something up, you roll the thing away from you or track away from it to get the thumb in a good position to grab it. Not that hard once you do it awhile. Andrew Camarata uses them all the time, and if they are good enough for him..... I'm sold.