Which Backhoe?

coopers · Oct 26, 2007

jfh0jfh said:
no Case SM.

Just out of curiosity, why not?

Blake
WA

wh22366 · Oct 26, 2007

I picked up a relatively straight '87 Cat 416 4wd last year for $14.5K and have been very happy with the machine. It has 6000+ hours but a new engine. Someone screwed up the engine wiring harness and it had to be jump started every time. Fixed that, rebuilt the stabilizer cylinders, replaced a couple of hoses and was off to the races. I've seen more and more of this vintage Cat available for reasonable prices and its a solid machine.

jfh0jfh · Oct 30, 2007

coopers said:
Just out of curiosity, why not?

Blake
WA

Too new, too complicated, too sophisticated, .... and Italian parts and design. I ran one the other day. Great machine. As was the new New Holland I ran last week.

But I do my own maintenance and favor simplicity. K/L Case, D/E Deere, D Ford are about as new as I want to get.

Builder · Oct 31, 2007

jfh0jfh said:
Too new, too complicated, too sophisticated, .... and Italian parts and design. I ran one the other day. Great machine. As was the new New Holland I ran last week.

But I do my own maintenance and favor simplicity. K/L Case, D/E Deere, D Ford are about as new as I want to get.

I don't see anymore "italian parts or design" on mine than any other brand.

The only difference between a SuperL from the late 90's and a SuperM is the updated cab design which almost eliminates the cab rust associated with the L. The inside of the cab is a lot nicer & more roomy. Rest of the machine below the cab is essentially the same. Lots of backhoes have Carraro axles underneath. The CAT's have ZF (german) axles. My early 90's Ford 555E was made in Belgium, had a foreign diesel in it, too.

My Case is an '05 and was made in USA with no more foreign parts than any other machine.

jfh0jfh · Oct 31, 2007

Builder said:
I don't see anymore "italian parts or design" on mine than any other brand. The only difference between a SuperL from the late 90's and a SuperM is the updated cab design which almost eliminates the cab rust associated with the L. The inside of the cab is a lot nicer & more roomy. Rest of the machine below the cab is essentially the same. Lots of backhoes have Carraro axles underneath. The CAT's have ZF (german) axles. My early 90's Ford 555E was made in Belgium, had a foreign diesel in it, too.

My Case is an '05 and was made in USA with no more foreign parts than any other machine.

Case-New Holland-Kobelco construction is one entity. NH units have "made in Italy" tags riveted on. Fiat has announced that it will "leverage existing and new design & technology and look for synergies in the manufacture of all related construction equipment". In the same way that Fiat & Lancia & Alfa used the same parts. Ditto all GM cars.

Case backhoes since the early 2000s have an Italian transaxle and some other Italian components.

This isn't about a US company sourcing overseas. It's about a European company replacing components with European-built parts built for other units. It's not about ZF axles in Cats; or Yanmar parts in JD; or Perkins engines in JCB; or Holden parts in the new Cadillac.

But let's be clear: I'm not here ragging on Italian machinery. And/ or arguing that something else is "better". I'm just saying that I would like to avoid Itialian parts if posible.

Builder · Oct 31, 2007

I realize that FIAT now owns CASE. I, too avoided New Holland b/c all the machines I looked at were Italian made. Many CAT backhoes are made in England. TEREX is also made in England. I narrowed it down to CASE or DEERE since they were basically the only hoes left built here in the US.

In hindsight, I think I should have bought a DEERE, but I couldn't find one with the features I wanted and an acceptable price. I really wanted a 310SG.

This happens a lot with equipment I buy. I know what I want, but sometimes you have limited time to get a unit on the jobsite and you have to settle for something less than your #1 choice.

Other than a substandard paint job, my CASE has been just fine.

jfh0jfh · Oct 31, 2007

Builder said:
I realize that FIAT now owns CASE. I, too avoided New Holland b/c all the machines I looked at were Italian made. Many CAT backhoes are made in England. TEREX is also made in England. I narrowed it down to CASE or DEERE since they were basically the only hoes left built here in the US.

In hindsight, I think I should have bought a DEERE, but I couldn't find one with the features I wanted and an acceptable price. I really wanted a 310SG.

This happens a lot with equipment I buy. I know what I want, but sometimes you have limited time to get a unit on the jobsite and you have to settle for something less than your #1 choice.

Other than a substandard paint job, my CASE has been just fine.

Same here - you look and look and finally have to settle for something you don't quite want. There's only so much time. I've been looking since May with no real luck. I'm not a contractor - this is farm use - so no real pressure; and I have a small one with which I get by.

Yes, Terex in the UK; JCB in GA now; NH in Italy; JD in the US or Japan (the 110),

I'm leanng towards a 310E I found but I prefer a 410 (D/ E) but that right machine at a good price just hasn't materialized. And there's a JCB I like but I need to run it again.

Builder · Oct 31, 2007

Be VERY careful when buying JCB.

If some Italian parts scare you in the newer machines, you should see how unpredictable English made stuff can be.

Used JCB's sell for real cheap for a reason. I could have easily gotten a 2-3yr old 1,000 hr JCB with all the features of my CASE for $10,000-$15,000 less. There's a reason for that.

rutwad · Nov 7, 2007

I just read through this thread. JD does not use Yanmar anymore for the 110.
Terex-I heard was owned, built, related to, or something with CAT. I'm not sure about that. But the terex does come with a 3 year warranty. I heard (yep, again) that several people that have demo'd Terex's were really impressed with them. I have personally never even seen one. If there is not a high market for the Terex, then you may be able to find a great deal on a used one.

Builder · Nov 7, 2007

rutwad said:
I just read through this thread. JD does not use Yanmar anymore for the 110.
Terex-I heard was owned, built, related to, or something with CAT. I'm not sure about that. But the terex does come with a 3 year warranty. I heard (yep, again) that several people that have demo'd Terex's were really impressed with them. I have personally never even seen one. If there is not a high market for the Terex, then you may be able to find a great deal on a used one.

I did and was pretty impressed, too. Yes-3 yr warranty and an awesome financing deal. I probably woulda bought a 760, but I didn't have 60K and the machine had an enormous dipperstick that was a mile high in the air. My CASE is so much more compact. The TEREX also depreciates much faster.