world trade center

Harv · Sep 13, 2001

anyone know why the black box in each plane has not been searched for.

Oh, they've been searching for them all right, but talk about needles in a haystack! Apparently, the boxes are not transmitting the beacon signal which would help locate them, so it is assumed they are in pretty bad shape.

There is also concern that the terrorists may have turned off the circuit breakers or used non-verbal communications, so there may or may not be any voice recordings.

WOW!!! Talk about timing -- Dan Rather just reported that the black box signal has just been detected from the Pentagon crash site. It may still take some time to find it, but now they have something to go on.

YIKES!!! When it rains it pours -- Ed Bradley now reports that the flight data recorder from the Pennsylvania site has been recovered. They also point out there is a difference between the flight data recorder and the voice recorder.

Edited by Harv on 09/13/01 04:09 PM (server time).

frank_f15 · Sep 13, 2001

sorry pitbull, but don't beleive there are to many innocents in those countrys.i don't see to many 9 year old american kids, brandishing auto weapons, chanting death to the great satan iraq or iran. these people have a different mind set, you will never reason with them, u will never convince them, u will never make them your friend.i personally don't want to fear everytime i or one of my children or grandchildren leave the safty of our homes. do what ever we have to do to lessen that fear.sorry if i offend anyones sensabilites, but this is how i feel!!!

Phred · Sep 13, 2001

Knight9,

While I respect your opinion, you are wrong.

You put people in jail for armed robber, rape and murder.
You do not arrest and prosecute people for killing 5000+!

I agree that obviously we are not talking about war on an arbitrary basis.

We will track down the people responsible for this. The people who supported them; give them money, intel, etc...

The next step will be a brutal no holds bare military assault.
This may just be localized attacks on groups of people or, if warranted by intelligence info, the country(s) that support them.

If Afghanistan is the guilty party, I think a parking lot is perfectly appropriate. The Taliban should think this over and do the right thing; turn over the guilty parties.

If Iraq is behind it then I suspect that the violence will be staggering.

Iraq was the 4th largest military in the world. It took a few divisions less than 50 hours to eradicate them. The taliban is nowhere near the 4th largest army. Can we eradicate them all? Of course not, but we can make it real unpleasant to continue the current war on our country.

I have heard that many people are worried about the loss of life in our military. While this is true and we should not take it lightly, sometimes and some events require action no matter the cost. Also I suspect that you could raise several hundred thousand volunteers in 24 hrs.

Have you also thought about the fact that the next attack could be unconventional? Maybe in Edmonton? How many must die before you and like-minded folks are ready to take action?
Am I saddened by the possibility of loss of innocent life that may result? Absolutely. Does this mitigate our responsibility to act in the most aggressive and decisive way possible? Absolutely not. How many innocents will die if the next attach is nuclear weapon on the east coast, or in Europe?

We have been trying to get these folks with lawyers and diplomats for 8 yrs.

Do not get me wrong I am not a violent man. However, enough is enough, its time to be effective.

Fred

toddler · Sep 13, 2001

Yeah, I changed my mind, you guys have convinced me.

Let's go bomb anyplace there could be terrorists. Hell, let's bomb anyplace they've raised terrorists. Goodbye Chicago, see ya Harvard, so long Michigan. That'll teach you not to raise a Ted Kaczynski. Can't risk you're raising a really good terrorist next time.

Ok, leave Chicago, they have good pizza and Ted WAS a lame terrorist, let's go bomb Afganistan instead. It would be bad to just go get the perpetrators in a country where the women can't leave home without the permission of a man. Where women have no rights. Let's kill'em. Women with no rights aren't worth sparing unless they make good pizza. They can be used to bear children who might hurt us. Yeah, kill em all, it's war.

Ya know what, let's escalate this to a nuclear level. There's no way a billionair like ben Ladin could have organized this without those women over there, right, they gave birth to him. Oops, forgot, he was born in Saudi Arabia. Damn, now we've got to nuke them too. Oh well, gonna cost a little more to fuel the tractor now. But it'll be worth fueling up once I get the lead canopy and air filtration system installed.

Yeah hah, can't wait to get my mac 10 so the next time I'm on a plane and a terrorist pulls a knife, I can shoot'em. I'm decompression proof you know. This is gonna be great!

I'm big and brave now. I'm advocating mass killing. I'm not passive.

I feel better. Now I'm safe.

Uh Oh. Gotta go guys, due for my next Anthrax vaccine and want to change the home air filtration system cartridge in case they spray any more mutated smallpox around again.

Later,

Todd

ps) Steve, thanks for that post, he's very elloquent.

cp1969 · Sep 13, 2001

Oh, no, Todd--you've convinced me!

I see the light now. We should just roll over and take it because will might kill or injure an innocent bystander. Better to let a million terrorists run amok than kill one innocent person.

Never mind that they just punched the tickets of probably 10,000 or more innocent Americans. We're better than that. They'll learn from our nobility, is that the idea? Surely it will work, right?

Sorry, but the value of my countrymens' live who were lost in this means a bit more to me than that, and I want to teach them a lesson that they will not forget just in case they think they're going to do it again and get away with it.

Phred · Sep 13, 2001

Todd,

FYI; A mac 10 is a piece of crap. Open bolt, really poor accuracy, piss poor sights.

But then you already knew that. Probably have one in your gun safe /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif.

Fred

GrantMO · Sep 13, 2001

It's amazing that we argue about this. The very fact that we can disagree and even have our own opinions means that we are part of a civilized group. Does anyone really believe that the people who crashed those planes, their masterminds and accomplices wouldn't have used even more lethal means if they could have gotten away with it? What does it take to get people to agree to do away with these terrorists? What if they detonated a low to moderate yield nuclear weapon in NY or DC? Does it take millions of deaths? What if they release some biotoxin and poisioned hundreds of thousands to death? Terrorism can't be allowed to exist. Yes, it's an impossible goal to totally eradicate it but that has to be our goal regardless. Anyone thinking that these terrorist wouldn't have killed millions of Americans and ended our government and way of life are absolutely fooling themselves. It's time for everyone to wake up to what it all means. These terrorist would end my life, all my family, friends, acquaintences everyone I know and don't know in this country. They want to destabilize and destroy everything about this country. Would they stop with us? No way, they want to end western, modern society. I make no apologies to anyone for this opinion: They cannot be allowed to walk this earth. How this is accomplished I'll leave to the people we elected and trained to do the job. Any terrorist or state sponser goes down. If this sounds extreme it's basically paraphrasing what Colin Powell said earlier today.

Toddler, I'm not directing this at you or anyone in particular. I keep saying that civilization is at stake. That may sound alarmist but I completely believe that's the case.

fuzzmental · Sep 13, 2001

Toddler -

You probably think you're cute and chuckled at your last post. I found it quite childish.

I asked you previously in this thread - "I'm curious as to your position on what exactly our response should be?

Well?

richh · Sep 13, 2001

These people are willing to die, it would seam that they even find it fun or rewarding, this makes everything we want to do harder. they don't seam to care about dieing??? Well just maybe this crazy rag head paid off these guys with say 200,000.00 each and they would give it to their family because that are going to die. So maybe we need to find out the who and where the bank acct. are then go after the familys all of them no matter how old or how young stop the seed. Put all on notice that this will not work no one wil be left to spend any of it. Burn the house's of all and any other assets cows, chicken's ect. all and any of it.
Maybe it's a start?

Kelvin · Sep 13, 2001

I am afraid that massive bombing and bloodshed are unavoidable.

The terrorists won't stop until America is destroyed. They've made that clear. I don't like the idea of hurting innocent people, but because of the terrorist's tactics, we have no choice if we are to have any response at all.

Let me address the issue of losing lives of American military. I am an Air Force pilot. We in the military are here to protect our homeland, our freedom, and our way of life. All of these have been violated. As a result, I, along with all of the military individuals that I know, are ready to go do whatever it takes to eliminate the threat to our nation. We understand that our lives will certainly be at risk. We understood that when we raised our right hand.

Since our nation has been attacked by a foreign enemy, we, the military, now have the obligation to attack and destroy the vital elements of the aggressor's war-making capabilities to the extent that they will no longer have the will, nor the ability, to wage war.

If I happen to go for a long period of time without contributing to this board, I think you'll understand.

Kelvin