Dealer XR4140 stalling

   / XR4140 stalling
  • Thread Starter
#31  
Tractor has been at dealer 2 weeks.

GOOD MORNING DAVID,

I HAVE DRIVEN THE UNIT AND HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO DUPLICATE THE ISSUE. I HAVE ALSO STARTED AND LET RUN NUMEROUS TIMES WITH NO STALLING. I WILL RUN THE UNIT AT SOME POINT TODAY TO TRY AND GET IT TO REPEAT THE ISSUES YOU ARE HAVING.

THANKS, SHAWN

Not encouraging and confirms my biggest concern, being able to duplicate issue. I can’t believe it self healed on the 80 mile trailer ride.
 
   / XR4140 stalling #32  
Tractor has been at dealer 2 weeks.

GOOD MORNING DAVID,

I HAVE DRIVEN THE UNIT AND HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO DUPLICATE THE ISSUE. I HAVE ALSO STARTED AND LET RUN NUMEROUS TIMES WITH NO STALLING. I WILL RUN THE UNIT AT SOME POINT TODAY TO TRY AND GET IT TO REPEAT THE ISSUES YOU ARE HAVING.

THANKS, SHAWN

Not encouraging and confirms my biggest concern, being able to duplicate issue. I can’t believe it self healed on the 80 mile trailer ride.

Sounds like what I go through.

Had an issue with my ZTR stalling....turned out to be sediment in the fuel line that would of course back itself out of the way during diags and refills. Ended up disassembling the whole fuel system and cleaned the tank out too.

I am hoping you have a positive outcome, soonest.
 
   / XR4140 stalling
  • Thread Starter
#33  
Thanks, Mike
Had that problem with the BX, so naturally I thought maybe same with the LS. I really think I purged that tank and lines well.
While I have been concerned that issue is not duplicatable, actually it is in sense it happens every time I use the tractor, just I’m not sure the why. Thinking it maybe need a ‘load’.
 
   / XR4140 stalling
  • Thread Starter
#34  
Still no joy. Am emailing below to the Dealer tech and LS tech. Hopefully it will trigger a solution. Frustrating.

“Shawn,
If you would indulge me a bit.
Although you have not been able to replicate the stalling issue I am 99.99% confident that after we have given up and I made another 160 mile trip to retrieve the issue will occur my very first use. Confident because it has my every use last couple of months. This being true, I guess the issue can be replicated. Wonder if being under load is somehow a factor? If this is the situation is there a way I can be more helpful?

Perhaps, if I review the situation, your reading might trigger a thought, solution. I say this because I just had it happen with a friend. He had a problem, asked my advise, I made most obvious, simple suggestion and he was stunned it had never occurred to him as he was focused on a more complicated solution. His wife laughed, but in a good way.

I am ccing the LS factory tech and perhaps you might choose to share with anyone you might feel helpful.

My very limited diesel experience says there are 2 ways to stop the engine, fuel or air. I have done both manually on another unit so a bit familiar in that the stoppage sounds abit different. In this case, I suspect fuel starvation, but could be wrong. I believe that my tractor is designed to quit via fuel control, electrically triggered.

So at this point:
1. There are no computer codes, nothing to indicate a problem that triggers a sensor. Would mean bad sensor or just a problem not monitored by a sensor? Is there a way to monitor for next event?
2. All the wiring harnesses pass inspection, no shorts, open circuits, bare/broken/loose wires, bad grounds, corroded contacts, etc. battery is good, assume alternator is functioning. Relays? ECU or ECU harness?
3. Fuel delivery appears ok or at least not a permanent issue. Fuel filter has been changed, fuel filter sensor has been replaced. Fuel tank and hoses purged, new fuel cap, fresh fuel. What I haven’t done is any check of fuel pump or other mechanical part aspects of fuel delivery. I have experienced a pump failure on a diesel generator, but it was total, not intermittent. Replaced pump and fixed. There is now a fuel level indicator error, reads Empty. I did NOT remove the tank for cleaning, simply flushed several times, last time with plain diesel to be sure no moisture. I also blew the hoses with air. I suppose there could be a foreign object the causes a temporary blockage. It was suggested to run via external tank but haven’t attempted yet. I initially suspected moisture/foreign matter as I had experienced same with our BX2380. Changing the filters, adding a separator filter, purging tank, fresh fuel and no longer a problem.
4. Air cleaner appears unobstructed.
5. I sometimes think the stalling is temperature related in that unit has to run some time and I think under work load. But for it to restart immediately would suggest that whatever it is cools quickly. The length of time before next stall also appears to be related to time between stall and restart. The longer I wait, the longer it runs, but only minutes before next stall, but likely within 100 feet, so multiple stalls getting back to tractorshed.
6. ESC main switch may not be operating properly. This switch ON and adjusted for PTO speed is my usual mode when using flail. Can this be bypassed?
7. The Hand throttle lever is not responsive when tractor reduces to “limp mode, 1500 rpm” before stalling. This is not the limp mode as reported by code, just a falling off of rpms. It may be responsive after restart. A fellow tractor forum member had his replaced by Dealer to solve stalling problem. I don’t know how to test.
8. Dash indicator lights go into repetitive blinking mode when stall occurs.
9. Stalling instances have occurred with 5 ft flail mower installed. Initial stall usually with mower engaged, but subsequent stalls with mower disengaged.

So, my hope you get to observe issue and solve soon, especially if a warranty issue. If not then I need a better approach for if it comes home as is.”
 
   / XR4140 stalling
  • Thread Starter
#35  
Well, 10 1/2 weeks at dealer and no joy. Tech for a weak ground and reflashed ECU. Never could replicate problem.
Got it back home, and as I suspected, able to experience problem first hour at work. Seems tractor has to be under load to malfunction. Took about 20 restarts to limp back home. Fortunately, my friend Jim is visiting and got to witness first hand, the main reason I want back from dealer even if not fixed. Jim is your ultimate fix it guy for this kind of stuff. So know he and I can brainstorm.

Possibly good news on my LS tractor though.
I ‘ve always viewed as a complex issue, fuel starvation, somehow with a temperature component, leading to electric chaos. Could ECU be suspect? My wallet hoped not and tech reflashed. So with the hood up, Jim and I walked thru. Light bulb moment. What if the ECU was over heating due to its location so near radiator?
View attachment 873118 That could trigger a fuel sensor, it could become progressively more frequent as the temp went up, recovery would improve as temp normalized, and it could trigger electrical weirdness. Sound reasonable? I’m hopeful.
 
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   / XR4140 stalling #36  
Are you mowing slopes? Wondering if you're sloshing sediment around enough in the tank to affect the pickup?
 
   / XR4140 stalling
  • Thread Starter
#37  
Considered that. And yes slopes, but doesn’t matter which way I’m pointed or on the flat. Would that any sediment was removed when I drained and purged the tank. (and messed up the float).

I am more and more convinced it is a temperature issue that is causing ECU to fail, triggering fuel starvation and wonky electrical ad I recently posted.

Plan is today install some sort of 12vdc fan to cool ECU.

If that fails, I also have plan to install an external fuel tank, bypassing everything before filter. But that is a couple weeks away as I will be living for mainland tomorrow.
 
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   / XR4140 stalling
  • Thread Starter
#38  
New video
Some ODBII data
Note EGR fail

 
   / XR4140 stalling #39  
Sounds like you may be on to something. You'd think the dealership would have noticed an EGR code. Perhaps not.
 
   / XR4140 stalling #40  
interesting to note that most dealers don't seem to have dyno's to test tractors under load. That is an interesting diagnostic path and at this point it sounds like it is worth exploring before bypassing the fuel tank. I know water and electricals don't usually mix well but perhaps a damp cloth or towel wrapped around the ECU would be an easier test than rigging up a fan. Kubota's have something up with the injectors that sounds a lot like your problem perhaps LS uses the same injectors. I think it applies to M7060 models and there is a tsb that covers the problem.

Interesting, I didn't think any tractors had OBDII ports on them.
 

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