GM Truck Warranty

[gemini5362]

I would guess 1/2 the jobs in this country involve basically doing the same thing over & over again. I also have seen where assembly line workers can rotate repetitive jobs.

What I think is pretty sad is that a pilot charged with being responsible for the lives of people and cargo and who must undergo training in flight school & avionics make about the same salary as an unskilled laborer bolting seats into a pontiac.

The pilot probably works rougher hours, is away from his family more, has less retirement perks and can't get paid for not working for a year, either.

I agree with you 100 per cent on this one it is sad that the pilot might not make more than he does. But there is one fact that you cannot escape from. As far as I know there is no reason why the pilot could not quit being a pilot and go to work as unskilled labor if he wanted to.

I also believe you migth be a bit inacurate on the salary. I am sure that chris is probably not makeing less than the factory worker. Everyone wants to quote their salary with benefits etc. Keep in mind those high numbers you are talking about are not just salary. I would imagine that chris has benefits also and that if you add them together he is still probably making more than a factory worker.

 

[Builder]

I agree with you 100 per cent on this one it is sad that the pilot might not make more than he does. But there is one fact that you cannot escape from. As far as I know there is no reason why the pilot could not quit being a pilot and go to work as unskilled labor if he wanted to.

I also believe you migth be a bit inacurate on the salary. I am sure that chris is probably not makeing less than the factory worker. Everyone wants to quote their salary with benefits etc. Keep in mind those high numbers you are talking about are not just salary. I would imagine that chris has benefits also and that if you add them together he is still probably making more than a factory worker.

But a pilot should make 2-3X what an assembly line worker makes. not about the same or slightly more.

I don't want to speak for D/P, but I'd guess his bennies pale in comparison to a UAW workers.
Also, if D/P loses his job, he might get state unemployment for 6 months. A UAW worker will get 90+% of his salary for much longer from his union benefits program.

 

[gemini5362]

But a pilot should make 2-3X what an assembly line worker makes. not about the same or slightly more.

I don't want to speak for D/P, but I'd guess his bennies pale in comparison to a UAW workers.
Also, if D/P loses his job, he might get state unemployment for 6 months. A UAW worker will get 90+% of his salary for much longer from his union benefits program.

Builder I agree with you that a pilot should make a lot more than an assembly line worker but the reality is that they dont evidently. If you want to go through and do comparisons look at what a plumber makes, or someone that is an expert at stamping and dieing concrete. To be honest take a look at what an attorney makes not the high dollar ones that are in the news but a regular corporate attorney. They have to pass law school then take a test that is unbelievably hard and then they probably will make less than someone working on an assembly line

 

[redneckford]

Builder I agree with you that a pilot should make a lot more than an assembly line worker but the reality is that they dont evidently. If you want to go through and do comparisons look at what a plumber makes, or someone that is an expert at stamping and dieing concrete. To be honest take a look at what an attorney makes not the high dollar ones that are in the news but a regular corporate attorney. They have to pass law school then take a test that is unbelievably hard and then they probably will make less than someone working on an assembly line

FAIR TRADE NOT FREE TRADE---It boils down to our standard of living----Who what where is that standard at----Sure people can do more or less if they have an education---the big problem is that those without an education have to do less because they have not been trained to do more!!!! Many work harder because they have not been trained to work with their brain only their back----But that is what made this country GREAT---people with education working with people with strong backs to get a product built and have a fair standard of living ------THEN GREED TOOK OVER!!!! anyone needed a TV repair man Lately????----Throw it away and get another one!!! At some point a strong back will be worth more than a strong mind---ask those computer guys on Wall Street????? The working man matters!!!!!

 

[Dargo]

Builder I agree with you that a pilot should make a lot more than an assembly line worker but the reality is that they dont evidently. If you want to go through and do comparisons look at what a plumber makes, or someone that is an expert at stamping and dieing concrete. To be honest take a look at what an attorney makes not the high dollar ones that are in the news but a regular corporate attorney. They have to pass law school then take a test that is unbelievably hard and then they probably will make less than someone working on an assembly line

Slightly off the subject, but try to find a good cleaning lady for less than $20 an hour. I don't think any around here are in any union, but their pay sure seems to exceed their skill and education level. Worse yet, even at that price, they stay all booked up!

 

[toy]

I have no idea where you are coming from or who did what to you, but your view appears to be consistent with one shared among people standing in line at the unemployment office commiserating with each other as to why nothing is their fault and how "the man" got them. I cannot think of a worse attitude. I've worked jobs doing everything from cleaning septic systems, running a jack hammer, operating all sorts of heavy equipment, working as a welder, to sales jobs before I worked in management, training and then owning my own businesses. At no point in time has any management ever tried to divide workers and pit them against each other! I don't intend to be rude, but that is about the most ludicrous statement I've ever heard. Someone from some sort of twisted union has fed you the most bogus "them against us" BS I've ever heard and you've fallen for it.

My managers have several duties to perform, but in general they are commissioned with keeping operations profitable and running smoothly. When I have to get involved it is because one of my managers has not done their job properly or a situation is so large that they have asked for my assistance with the matter. Management is there to increase the productivity of the people they are in charge of. In no way, shape, or form are they there to divide and conquer! There are no mind games to pit one worker against another. How would that possibly serve any manager?!

Again, I don't intend to be to blunt, but what you typed is ridiculous. It sounds like some ploy by a bad union to keep their sheep from opening their eyes. What you imply is a "them against us" mentality. That is a guaranteed recipe for failure! If a company does not work as a unit towards a single goal it does not have a chance of surviving. Maybe that is why all of the non-union automakers have a "team" concept. They all work together, utilizing ideas from everyone, to achieve their goal. There is no "them against us" attitude with management. If the UAW has succeeded in convincing even a small portion of their membership to swallow that farce it's no wonder the union shops are failing to the point that they cannot weather the current world recession. In the last twenty five years that I've spent in management and ownership I've never seen any manager attempt what you suggest. If they did, I'd be forced to remove them from their position. And, since I do not have any union telling me what to do, I can do that with my employees. Apparently they don't do that because I've never had to fire a manager. Actually, I have extremely low turnover with employees now that I think about it. I don't think you could run most of them off even with a big stick.

You are talking about your little small company, that you don't run it that way and that is your opinion whether truthful or not I won't question it, but I have seen managers intimidate their employees, evidently you are not all seeing all knowing all understanding but have limited knowledge of what you are talking about in accordance to your own experiences. Your office response sounds good but often times on the job that isn't what happens, but it is a good response if you get someone killed that may save your butt when the accident is being investigated. You say you are a good operator and I have no reason to doubt you, I have seen some good operators and they do have a good work environment in which to work so I trust that is what you try to achieve and that is good but the bad operators give the same line as you do when there is trouble to defend their self. If you listened to the news reports from the crandle canyon mine he was giving the same response that you gave he even stopped the trucks taking rescue equipment on the mountian so he could give his good operator report but something that bothered me about that, he had men trapped underground and didn't know if they were dead or alive. If you know what I am talking about at that mine accident there was several miners that didn't get to go home that night, they never got to kiss their wife and hug their children, they won't get to see their children grow up marry and have grand children. This is more important than your little anti union attitude and I also wonder who did what to you, evidently somewhere the man stuck it to you. You give the impression that all union people are lazy["the farm boys and girls have a good work ethic"] as one poster put it implying that all union people are lazy with no work ethic you may have been the poster I don't know, but whoever it was is wrong. The unions is not responsible for the down turn in the economy, the foreign auto plants have took a 10% across the board pay cut and the foreign countries have already pumped money into their industries a little something that no one has mentioned.

 

[Dargo]

Oh, give me a break from the babble. I was a member of one of the largest unions and most powerful unions in the country until they put themselves out of work. I've stated several times that many of the members were hardworking people stuck in a bad and corrupt union. However, there were also some complete deadbeats who not only didn't do their job but destroyed tens of thousands of dollars of equipment along with stealing everything they could carry off. Still, the union protected these people. Save your "evidently you are not all seeing all knowing all understanding but have limited knowledge" babble for someone else. I lived it buddy.

If you still believe in the "divide and conquer" bologna when it comes to management, I have nothing else to say to you nor feel the need to bother responding further. Your statement "The unions is[sic] not responsible for the down turn in the economy, the foreign auto plants have took[sic] a 10% across the board pay cut and the foreign countries have already pumped money into their industries a little something that no one has mentioned" is very telling. You just need to wake up and smell the coffee if you think the UAW has nothing to do with the collapse of the domestic automakers.

 

[toy]

Oh, give me a break from the babble. I was a member of one of the largest unions and most powerful unions in the country until they put themselves out of work. I've stated several times that many of the members were hardworking people stuck in a bad and corrupt union. However, there were also some complete deadbeats who not only didn't do their job but destroyed tens of thousands of dollars of equipment along with stealing everything they could carry off. Still, the union protected these people. Save your "evidently you are not all seeing all knowing all understanding but have limited knowledge" babble for someone else. I lived it buddy.

If you still believe in the "divide and conquer" bologna when it comes to management, I have nothing else to say to you nor feel the need to bother responding further. Your statement "The unions is[sic] not responsible for the down turn in the economy, the foreign auto plants have took[sic] a 10% across the board pay cut and the foreign countries have already pumped money into their industries a little something that no one has mentioned" is very telling. You just need to wake up and smell the coffee if you think the UAW has nothing to do with the collapse of the domestic automakers.

Did I hit a little sore spot for you? my my. Despite what you may say the union had absolutely nothing to do with the sinking of the Titanic.

 

[gemini5362]

If I was a member of a large and corrupt union (not my words just responding to a previous post) That would automatically make all unions large and corrupt because mine was. I dont agree with that sentiment.

The union protected lazy people who were thieves. I dont know about protected. I am sure if they were fired the union filed grievances and fought to get them rehired. If you want to be upset about that place the blame where it belongs. The United States Congress and the United States department of Labor. Every advocate I know is very careful when they dont follow through on a grievance. A member can go to the department of labor and file a complaint at any time. If they do you are looking at having to defend why you did not represent someone. If you think that because they were a thief I did not defend them to be a suitable reply think again. Nothing is ever that black and white. The union tends to over defend people that might not deserve it the same way that doctors tend to order tests that a patient does not need. If something goes wrong and you have not covered your behind then you might be paying that union members salary until he reaches maximum retirement age. A lot of people that do grievances and arbitrations do not like representing some of the members but you dont have a choice. To think otherwise is simply silly and unrealistic.

 

[WilliamBos]

If I was a member of a large and corrupt union (not my words just responding to a previous post) That would automatically make all unions large and corrupt because mine was. I dont agree with that sentiment.

The union protected lazy people who were thieves. I dont know about protected. I am sure if they were fired the union filed grievances and fought to get them rehired. If you want to be upset about that place the blame where it belongs. The United States Congress and the United States department of Labor. Every advocate I know is very careful when they dont follow through on a grievance. A member can go to the department of labor and file a complaint at any time. If they do you are looking at having to defend why you did not represent someone. If you think that because they were a thief I did not defend them to be a suitable reply think again. Nothing is ever that black and white. The union tends to over defend people that might not deserve it the same way that doctors tend to order tests that a patient does not need. If something goes wrong and you have not covered your behind then you might be paying that union members salary until he reaches maximum retirement age. A lot of people that do grievances and arbitrations do not like representing some of the members but you dont have a choice. To think otherwise is simply silly and unrealistic.

So are you denying the fact that the sweetheart deals they signed in the 50's and 60's have nothing to do with it?? And they seem to get more and more greedy every time a contract is up for bargaining. Yeah, I know they are mis-managed too, but still, the Unions are not innocent. How come the Japanese are muche better off, non-unionized??

Face it, the Unions have outgrown their usefulness!!