Buying Advice How can you evaluate a 4310 without seeing it in person?

[mlg]

As a new member I'd like to say hello to everyone, and please bear with me as this is quite a long post.

I'm looking for a JD 4310 with a FEL but haven't been able to find anything locally. I don't mind driving to go pick it up, so I have expanded my search area to include most of the North East. The problem is that I'm having trouble evaluating tractors through the telephone and photographs alone, and don't want to drive eight hours only to find that the tractor is not in the condition I was led to believe. Ask any salesman if a tractor runs well and I'm beginning to think the answer is always the same. I was hoping to be able to get video clips to at least be able to listen to the engine/transmission but that request hasn't gone over well with sellers.

I'm aware that some dealerships will fill out inspection forms when they get new equipment in but I don't know how reliable that evaluation would be. However, I will definitely bring the S/N to my local dealer to pull up before making any decisions.

I've seen other threads on TBN that suggested making estimates on overall body condition. One of the tractor's I'm looking at has 1000 hours but appears to be in great shape except for a dent to the hood guard, a few rust spots on the loader frame, and the unfortunate rust from letting the bucket fill with water. Should I be cautious of the care such a tractor received?

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Now a few not entirely unrelated questions, but please forgive me for combining them into one post.

I'm looking at the eHydro 4310 for general loader work and some rough cutting. Taking TBN recommendations I have already written a 420 loader off my list in favor of the 430, but I have found a couple tractors with the 300CX loader which according to JD has a 33% higher lift capacity than the 430. Even if I fully load the rear tires (the R4s have a 4000# capacity according to the manual online, although I'm not sure if that is each or for the pair) could the 4310 lift 1600# with the 300CX. Would there be any benefit of the 300CX over the 430? Any thoughts?

I'm hoping to keep this tractor for a long time (20 years if kept indoors?) but will be putting only 50 hours on it a year at the very most, so I'm looking at putting up to an additional 1000 hours on the machine I buy. Taking this and maintenance records for the 4310 into account should I not look at a machine with 1000 hours? Or said another way, what hour range should I be looking for?

My apologies as this has been a very long post, but if you have taken the time to read the whole thing I truly appreciate it, and please pass on your advice!

Thank you!

Mark

 

[kennyd]

Welcome to TBN Mark

I can't help with the long distance purchase aspect...but it sounds like you have chosen a good machine that will fit your needs well-the 4310 has a fantastic track record.

I think you could not go wrong with either the 430 or 300CX loaders, both are good units. I also think 1600# is doable if the load is close in, hanging out on pallet forks maybe not.

 

[Zebrafive]

I bought my JD 6415 without seeing it in person. I can tell you they always look better in the pictures, that said I am happy with my purchase. I had the local dealer run the serial number for build info and warranty/service work records.

The selling dealer said it was a one owner tractor, traded for a cab tractor, he provided me the owner's name and number.

Selling dealer offered to send a Dyno test report and hard copies of all warrantry work too.

I could tell from the pictures (lack of rust, paint not faded) that it had been shedded.

Mine had 2562 hours when I got it.

The local YMCA summer camp has JD 4300 that is ten years old and has about 3600 hours on it. Still running good, but looks like cr@p. I would not let 1000 hours deter me.

 

[mlg]

Thanks for the replies.

This tractor with the 1000 hours does have some rust on it and the plastic does look slightly faded to me so it could have been stored outside. I'm trying a picture so hopefully it will work. The tires also look pretty worn to me. But the 3 point is immaculate. Would you buy a tractor that was in this shape? Also, how much internal damage could a previous owner do from lack of maintenance in 1000 hours? One last question: how much does it cost to replace the rubber on a 4310 such as this, closer to $500 or $1000?

http://www.tractorbynet.com/photos/showphoto.php/photo/8420

You are all so helpful thanks so much, please keep it coming!

Mark

 

[kennyd]

Tires look OK for 1000 hrs. You can spend $1000 easily to replace all 4. That machine has Power Beyond also so you could run a backhoe or logsplitter.

 

[jenkinsph]

After looking at the pics of the tractor I would say the appearances indicate it has a reasonable amount of wear. Doesn't look to be missused, if it had been, the light loader bucket would show more wear and tear. The tires look pretty good, at 50 hrs a year I would wait to change them when needed. Most likely you can put another 500 to 1000 hrs on them, depends more on the age of the tires I would think. They may crack badly before you wear out the tread.

The overall paint looks good, you may want to touch up a little but remember you are buying a tractor to use not a trailer queen.:laughing:

If you are shopping for this model I think this ones deserves a closer look.

 

[mjncad]

The bucket rust will disappear with the first few loads of rock you move with the loader.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

After looking at the pics of the tractor I would say the appearances indicate it has a reasonable amount of wear. Doesn't look to be missused, if it had been, the light loader bucket would show more wear and tear. The tires look pretty good, at 50 hrs a year I would wait to change them when needed. Most likely you can put another 500 to 1000 hrs on them, depends more on the age of the tires I would think. They may crack badly before you wear out the tread.

The overall paint looks good, you may want to touch up a little but remember you are buying a tractor to use not a trailer queen.:laughing:

If you are shopping for this model I think this ones deserves a closer look.

2x.

I have found most people will shoot straight from buying sight unseen. All used equipment is a crap shot at best. Knowing why it is on the market is important to me. i prefer to buy low enough to do some repairs and still not be over high retail afterwards and just plan to keep it for years.

 

[RoyJackson]

I did buy a 2003 790 "sight unseen" other then pictures. This was a very low hour (24 hours on the meter) machine. This was from a dealer in SW Virginia. The Dealer was James River company (they have a few stores in VA).
I'd do it again with no problem...once there was a comfort level with the dealer!
I would not buy a "sight unseen" tractor from a private seller.

BTW, before you elimnate things like loaders models, realistically review your needs. The 420 loader will lift quite a bit...are you really planning to lift a ton 88 inches up?

 

[crazylunker]

What kind of money are they asking? I'n march I bought a 4310 with a 430 loader and 3 point out of machinefinder from a dealer in chatham NY. It had 1600 hrs on it and new rubber (turf) they also had installed a new hood as the orig was damaged. I payed $10,000 for it with a complete service (oil and filters etc)

Also I really wish I had a 300cx loader.

I had a 4610 with the 460 loader and there was aBIG difference in lifting capacity which I really miss.

 

[mlg]

Thanks for all of the comments on the hours, it's very encouraging to hear that it shouldn't be too much of a problem.

I've spent a lot of time on machinefinder and tractorhouse looking at prices over the last month, and never came across a deal as good as the one you just described. They were originally asking 16500 for it which I thought was ludicrous, but have already lowered it to 15900 (still over-priced). From the prices on the two websites I figure it is worth more like 14500.

Since my last post I have actually looked at the pictures more carefully (enlarged a great deal) and noticed that the tractor itself looks to be in fantastic condition. The only rust I could see on it was on the ends of the swinging drawbars, and the associated sway bars, both unpainted surfaces. That limits the rust just to the loader (cosmetic). I am going to call them again tomorrow, but I have a hunch the loader was stored outside while the tractor was inside.

How much would you all pay for this machine?

 

[RoyJackson]

How much would you all pay for this machine?

It's hard to say since tractor prices are somewhat regional...and New England prices are a bit higher then other areas.
That said, I paid $13000 for a 4400 with 804 hours on it (see attached picture taken at the dealer's lot). This was 6-8 months ago. I do think I got a better deal then average. This wasn't sight unseen...the dealer was a local guy.

So, your estimate ($14.5K) is reasonable. Any higher, you might want to look elsewhere. Remember, since you're buying sight unseen, that implies shipping costs have to be factored in as well.

We had a fellow TBNer, Defed, buy a 4300 about the same time I bought the 4400. If I recall, the price of the 4300 was pretty close to $15K. He has had a number of problems with that machine.

 

[Zebrafive]

I think it looks good for the hours. Bucket would not bother me in the least. I bought mine used, I can now say that scratch was from the former owner. Plus the first scratch I put on it wont give me grief.

I am not sure of the price to offer, but the dealer knows that if he has to keep it over the winter it will be a year older and more weathered, being open station, I'll bet the dealer is ready to deal.

One thing that may ease your mind, ask if they will warranty it for say 90 days and 50 hours so if there are any real problems you will have recourse.

 

[mlg]

I am not sure of the price to offer, but the dealer knows that if he has to keep it over the winter it will be a year older and more weathered, being open station, I'll bet the dealer is ready to deal.

The dealer has had it since at least the beginning of September. When I spoke with him Friday he said that he thinks it will sell soon due to people preparing for the winter (in PA). When I spoke with dealerships in New England they told me the majority of their sales were late spring/early summer. Are second surges in used sales common in the fall?

This dealer is a 900 mile round trip from me and I'm planning on picking it up myself, so it won't be entirely sight unseen. I figure it will cost me about $300 in gas. I could probably have it shipped for about the same price (?) but this way gives me the peace of mind of seeing it before completing the sale. If I noticed anything I really didn't like I could still back out even though I'd then be down several hundred and wasted a lot of time. That said, I'm not looking to waste time and money either so I'd like to be "sight unseen" comfortable with the machine. I'm basically viewing the situation as a sight unseen purchase with a panick button.

The power beyond looks to be about a $300 option, and the mid pto $400. I don't need either. How much would these and the 300CX loader warrant an increase in price from the dealer's perspective?

 

[RoyJackson]

The dealer has had it since at least the beginning of September. When I spoke with him Friday he said that he thinks it will sell soon due to people preparing for the winter (in PA).

The power beyond looks to be about a $300 option, and the mid pto $400. How much would these and the 300CX loader warrant an increase in price?

Sounds like the dealer is in northwest PA (just a guess, but NW PA gets hit pretty hard with snow).

I might give an extra hundred for the power beyond. I wouldn't pay any extra for the mid-PTO. As far as I'm concerned, the 300cx loader is part of the current price.

Well, at worst, it'll be a nice ride this time of year...

 

[foggy1111]

I bought my 3320 under similar circumstances as you are planning (dealer and tractor some distance away)....but my tractor had quite a few less hours.

In my case, the dealer represented the tractor very well and it was all he claimed it would be. As said earlier, I think the dealers represent things much better than a private party would.

I bought mine without any kind of a warranty....and have had zero problems from my purchase. BUT I would try to get some type of a basic warranty and your price negotiated BEFORE you show up with a trailer to pick it up. MAKE YOUR BEST DEAL ON THE PHONE.....and then I'd tell him you have a deal PROVIDED the tractor is as represented over the phone / pics.

Once you show up with the trailer at the dealers door......all price and warranty discussions are pretty much over. That dealer knows you plan to go home with your new baby.....IMO.

BTW....I think that bucket is a HD and not a Light Duty as said earlier. IMO.....It appears to be a good tractor from the pics.

 

[foggy1111]

Just remembered one other point....sales tax. If I wudda had my tractor delivered about 20 miles (over eithr of two state lines) it could have been bought without tax. I paid the ^&*((()_& sales tax as I picked it up off my dealer's lot. At least the tax in his state was somewhat less than my state tax.

Forewarned is forearmed.

 

[RoyJackson]

That dealer knows you plan to go home with your new baby...

And that's part of the discipline...you've got to be ready to walk away...

 

[jenkinsph]

And that's part of the discipline...you've got to be ready to walk away...

I agree with Roy on that one.:thumbsup:

 

[mlg]

So I just got off the phone with the dealer. When it was traded in they replaced the hood, the RF axle seal, and touched up the paint (whatever that means, but obviously not on the loader), on top of the usual filter changes. He didn't have any idea what the previous owner used it for or why they ended up with it.

I'm a little concerned about the hood and repainting; it makes me feel like it might have not been cared for all that well.

Anyways he said that the "best he could do" on price was 15,900. Which I think is quite inflated for what the machine is.