Would synthetic oil benefit me?

scsims · Mar 6, 2011

LD1 said:
I agree with the general consensus here.

Technology has improved oil BIGTIME. A good synthetic and a high quality filter and you can easially go 8-10k+.

But to elaborate on a few things mentioned. When people say a quality oil filter, they arent refering to a "ph" fram or STP either.

I know there are more but I'll name a few of the "quality" filters IMO

Napa GOLD, WIX, Purolater, "xg" series fram, K&N

These are some examples of quality filters but expect to pay ~$10 each, not $2-$3.

Also, if you extend your interval, be sure and check the oil often until you get to "know" your engine and how much oil it burns.

All engines burn oil. And according to most manufactures, 1 quart burned ever 1000 miles is still an acceptable level before an overhaul/rebuild is required. So if you never check your oil, you may be burning a quart or more every 3000 miles. But you may never know if you are always changing it @ 3000mi and only a quart low. But now if you push it to 5-6k miles, you are now going to be 2 qts low. You get the idea.

My saturn gets oil changes ever 10k. It burns about 1/2 qt every 1500-2000miles, which isnt bad. And if I did oil changes @ 3k, would be no big deal. But since it only holds 4qts, if I never checked it, it would be bone dry well before my next change.

Also, my personal filter of choice is the fram "XG" series. Fram got a bad rap, but the XG's are top notch. Good synthetic media, etc.

I looked on the back of a Fram TG series filter that I have. The XG claims it catches 95% of particles. The TG say it catches 99%. So I guess their TG Tough Gaurd one are better?

texasjohn · Mar 6, 2011

Best discussion of oil I've ever seen is here. It is truly comprehensive and it seems unbiased to me.

Welcome

I have used synthetic for many years..... frequently go 10K miles or more. Highly recommended.

PoorMansCat · Mar 6, 2011

Mobil1, Fleetguard, Baldwin, Donaldson, Cat, the "high end" Napa filters (aka WIX) AC Delco, are all examples of quality filters.
Modern gasoline engines do not require as frequent of oil changes. Honda simply goes by the OLM, and Mazda recommends the same. Changing the oil more frequently is a waste of resources and money.

DarkBlack · Mar 6, 2011

hrcarver said:
I was just wondering what the consensus is. It would be worth it to me I could go 5k with synthetic oil between changes instead of the 3-3500 I have been doing with conventional oil. It's good for the sponsoring companies

Is that safe? I drive my truck. Off road miles, dust, heavy towing (for a gas pickup) for a few k a year, most of my trips are a couple miles.

Does it even matter:

Does it matter- NO!.
You will either trade or junk your truck for reasons other than the engine oil you ran. normal oil will allow your oil lubricated engine parts to outlive the rest of your truck, and at 5K intervals- just use a good air and oil filter. Beleive me, your truck will most likely die of rust, crash, transmission failure, wheel bearing failures, cooling failures. But if you want to throw away money- use the synthetic engine oil.

DarkBlack · Mar 6, 2011

To be fair, I have to say I am aware that some people today are made afraid of everything, because of the media hype, and the ever changing technology.
To that end I can concede that to some people, the cost of something, let's use synthetic oil...is worth the price because to them they have just bought an insurance policy. So... when I make a hard real world based post like my past post, I must admit that I have not factored in the new 'sleep good at night' cost that many will glady buy in the face of reality. Feeling good about your decisions is important. If you have the money- then sure- you should buy the synthetic.

sw03 · Mar 6, 2011

texasjohn said:
Best discussion of oil I've ever seen is here. It is truly comprehensive and it seems unbiased to me.

unbiased??? You have not been there for a long time. I have seen posted removed, altered etc since it is VERY biased...Just need to look.

Why do you think several sponsors left..

clemsonfor · Mar 6, 2011

DarkBlack said:
To be fair, I have to say I am aware that some people today are made afraid of everything, because of the media hype, and the ever changing technology.
To that end I can concede that to some people, the cost of something, let's use synthetic oil...is worth the price because to them they have just bought an insurance policy. So... when I make a hard real world based post like my past post, I must admit that I have not factored in the new 'sleep good at night' cost that many will glady buy in the face of reality. Feeling good about your decisions is important. If you have the money- then sure- you should buy the synthetic.

The benefit most use it for is extended drain intervals. The viscosity stability allows this to work better. Also there is a miniscule MPG increase. I cant tell but supposedly its there. I dont buy it for this reason though. Mobil 1 (the reason i mention them is cause thats what i try to use all the time) costs $24/gallon at walmart. Walmart Brand dino oil is $11. If you change the walmart oil at 5K and the Mobil 1 at 10K its basically the same price if you say the filter is the same price. But buy an oil like Castrol, valvoline, penzoil or any of your other favorites your looking at something like $15-20/gallon so if you run those 5K and the Mobil 1 10K you do see a cost savings and the fact that you dont have to do it as often!! My first job was 110 mile round trip to work. I changed oil at 3K then. That meant i changed my oil every month!! I wish that truck did not burn oil so it would have been fesiable to use the syn oil. I still have it and the only reason i dont use syn is that it burns several qts every 3K miles so it would get pricy to run a syn oil in it.

Just pointing another view.

kenmac · Mar 6, 2011

For what it's worth,,,Quality oil & filters cost $. If you buy a cheap filter ,you are going to get lower quality. Same with oil. $3.00 per qt. oil just isn't going to compare to $8.00 per qt. oil.

texasjohn · Mar 6, 2011

sw03 said:
unbiased??? You have not been there for a long time. I have seen posted removed, altered etc since it is VERY biased...Just need to look.

Why do you think several sponsors left..

I do hope people look at the site and, being an intelligent reader, they should decide which of the several opinions and arguments, expressed both here and there, they wish to believe and apply to their oil change habits. Given the diversity of opinions, there should be a conclusion to suit the predispositions of everyone.

I suppose sponsors themselves would have to document their support or lack thereof.

lostcause · Mar 6, 2011

i run synthetic in one car because that is what it ran from the factory. if the manufacturer did it, then i may as well too.

i also switched to rotella t6 synthetic in one truck too. not because i was worried about less frequent oil changes, but because on cold days this winter the diesel would actually start, but it would not pump the 15-40 oil through it. the 5-40 synthetic is noticeably easier on the engine at startup.

my other vehicles all have conventional oil, and i've never had any issues and i believe that virtually every vehicle out there will tell you that you can go 5000-7500 miles on it, and i'm sure that new oils won't break down like old ones, but they still hold dirt, and dirt is the enemy. personally, i think 3-5k is good on any oil - regular or synthetic.

i'm not a dirt expert, so when a filter says it stops 95 or 99% of the particles, or that it is 1 micron, or 5 micron, or whatever... it's all greek to me. i have no idea how small the dirt particles can get, or whether they can or will sneak by... i suspect that have of the number game is marketing anyways.

Toyboy · Mar 7, 2011

I can vouch for a gain in mileage from Mobil 1. I bought my Mountaineer new in 2000 w/the 4L engine. The MPG indicator said I was getting 20mpg on hi way, not bad I thought. At 5k I switched from Pennzoil 5w 30 to Mobil 1 5w 30 and and immediately saw a 1mpg improvement. I still own that SUV and to this day (72k on it now) it averages 21 mpg. On a trip to Gulf Shores I got as high as 24 (tail wind?) but normally on a trip I'll get 22.5 -23mpg. I'm sold on synthetics and that's all I use in our 3 vehicles. I change the filters at 3-3,500k and add make up oil with a complete dump at 9 to 10.5k.

TMR · Mar 7, 2011

I changed to synthetic a few years back for the many reasons mentioned. I also changed from a 3,000 mile change cycle to closer to 7,500 miles...and did Blackstone oil analysis a few time to verify all was fine...even at 7,500 miles. I now change twice a year...oil and filter...annual 15,000 miles.

I must say I would use synthetic JUST for the viscosity benefit...in COLD minnesota at -30F+ dino oil is like sludge...I am convinced that syn oil gets to the engine parts much quicker and allows the motor to turn over easier. Also, stands up better at very high operating temps.

FWIW...TMR

dmccarty · Mar 7, 2011

I track my mileage every fill up and I hand calculate the MPG. The truck's MPG calculation is off from .5-1 MPG and it is always higher than reality.

The Shell and JD synthetic oils I have been using said you should see something like a .3 mpg increase. Which is about what I have seen. Certainly not enough to cover the cost of the oil but it helps.

I used to use an engine block heater in the winter when using 15Wx40 oil. The truck would start without the heat but the engine did not like that thick, cold oil. The 5Wx40 and 0Wx40 oil does not require the block heater. Using a 1500 watt heater, at .10-12 cents per watt for 3 hours adds up to a lot of money per month. Which DOES help pay for the synthetic oil.

Later,
Dan

scsims · Mar 7, 2011

dmccarty said:
I track my mileage every fill up and I hand calculate the MPG. The truck's MPG calculation is off from .5-1 MPG and it is always higher than reality.

The Shell and JD synthetic oils I have been using said you should see something like a .3 mpg increase. Which is about what I have seen. Certainly not enough to cover the cost of the oil but it helps.

I used to use an engine block heater in the winter when using 15Wx40 oil. The truck would start without the heat but the engine did not like that thick, cold oil. The 5Wx40 and 0Wx40 oil does not require the block heater. Using a 1500 watt heater, at .10-12 cents per watt for 3 hours adds up to a lot of money per month. Which DOES help pay for the synthetic oil.

Later,
Dan

1.5Kw for 3 hours would be 4.5KwHr. so about 54 cents. Yep that would add up if ran everyday for 3 hours about $15 a month give or take.

brucew44guns · Mar 7, 2011

A few years ago, I sold Mobil Oil products---and knew a few sales reps that worked for the company. Those guys had to provide their own cars for the work of getting around their areas calling on Distributors and large customers, they drove a lot. Many of them, I was told, used Mobil 1 from the start. They changed the filter every 5,000, and then drained the oil pan at about 25,000. Many of those cars would have well over 150,000 put when trade time came, still running just fine, no indication of oil related problems soon coming. Synthetics work quite well in extended service.

clemsonfor · Mar 7, 2011

brucew44guns said:
A few years ago, I sold Mobil Oil products---and knew a few sales reps that worked for the company. Those guys had to provide their own cars for the work of getting around their areas calling on Distributors and large customers, they drove a lot. Many of them, I was told, used Mobil 1 from the start. They changed the filter every 5,000, and then drained the oil pan at about 25,000. Many of those cars would have well over 150,000 put when trade time came, still running just fine, no indication of oil related problems soon coming. Synthetics work quite well in extended service.

This is kind of not really impressive. Im in forestry, many wood buyers supply their own truck but the company gives them like $900/month to buy a truck and pay insurance with and the company buys all the gas. Either a situation like that or they use their own truck and they get paid mileage which is around .50/mile. These guys put something like 40K on a year and mostlikely change oil every 6K with dino. I have a ranger that i use walmart oil on and have pretty much 95% of the time changing it at 3K religiously and have put 130K on it in the last 6 years i have had it and when i got it it already had over 150K on it. Thats 280K now that it has. No oil failure yet. Showing wear yes as it burns oil at high rpms. Would syn oil have stopped this, il never know, but it really dont matter as its still a 20 yr old ranger with 285K miles on it.

kenmac · Mar 7, 2011

Engine performance tends to drop off little by little over time so, it's probably not noticed that much until 1 day you notice your engine doesn't have as much power as it once had. Synthetics provide better wear protection over conventional oil. Is the xtra cost worth it to every one ? It may not be. Vehicles, etc, cost alot of $$ these days & I like to keep the performance of the engine, tranny, & drivetrain in the best condition possible. For me, my choice is synthetics

Elviscaretaker · Mar 7, 2011

I used to run taxis in another life, I did an experiment based on oil change intervals, 2k 2.5 and 3k. 3k I lost the motor at about 300k miles, 2.5k and 2k were no different as I put the cars out to pasture after a million miles. This was on conventional oil. My newer rigs require a blend. I still stick to my 2.5k changes and my 03 Ranger has 400k on it, runs and looks like new, goes through .5 quarts between changes. Same with my 150 but not as many miles but a much harder life. If you want to keep your rig long term, change it more often (cheaper than a motor) but if only 250k then trade, go longer. Just check that you are running the right oil and type. Most newer cars require a blend. Just never put any sort of Teflon crap in it!
By the way, a newbee that knows a bit about cars but not diddy about tractors yet

DarkBlack · Mar 8, 2011

I'm just amazed at the flimflam posted here by sythetic oil pushers here on this tractor site.

kenmac · Mar 8, 2011

DarkBlack said:
I'm just amazed at the flimflam posted here by sythetic oil pushers here on this tractor site.

Doesn't take much to amaze you. Does it ?

I don't read any post here where someone is pushing dino , synthetic or any other product. Anyone can use what they want. The OP asked