Am I being a noob about ballast boxes...

[aczlan]

That makes me wonder, do the more powerful tractors need more ballast, or does it go in proportion? Nobody's talking about using a loader with nothing on the back, but my CK feels pretty stable with just a cheap box blade. I've had a rear tire come up while operating at the extreme, but generally no problem. Do most people load up with ballast untill it's impossible to get it light in the rear?

IIRC the Kioti machines weigh more than a comparable machine from Kubota, Deere, et al so they do not need as much weight on the back.
Most any machine with a loader will need weight to fully use its lift capacity.
The farmer near my parents place has a Deere 7405 (105HP MFWD loader tractor) and that has loaded tires, cast rims and wheelweights. As he said "if one of those tires starts falling over (when you are working on it) get the #$%^&* out of the way because it WILL crush you"

Aaron Z

 

[TrenaryDucks]

I think we may be getting carried away. His garden tractor can only lift 1,100 pounds with the 3PH.

 

[RoyJackson]

That makes me wonder, do the more powerful tractors need more ballast, or does it go in proportion? Nobody's talking about using a loader with nothing on the back, but my CK feels pretty stable with just a cheap box blade. I've had a rear tire come up while operating at the extreme, but generally no problem. Do most people load up with ballast untill it's impossible to get it light in the rear?

Rear ballasting is to fit the job. Your manual shoud have a section on ballasting for loads. The Deere manuals do.
Might be for light work, that 500lb rear blade would be all you need.
But if a rear tire comes off the ground, you don't have adequate ballast.

Anyone can use whatever they want, or have handy, for ballasting. The thread is actually discussing the use of ballast boxes. Some folks (me, for example) like those boxes due to their compactness and close in to the tractor. Others would rather use a heavy implement. That's just personal preference.
The important thing is to have some kind of adequate weight back there (or on front, if a heavy rear implement) to keep all four tires on the ground.

 

[k0ua]

Rear ballasting is to fit the job. Your manual shoud have a section on ballasting for loads. The Deere manuals do.
Might be for light work, that 500lb rear blade would be all you need.
But if a rear tire comes off the ground, you don't have adequate ballast.

Anyone can use whatever they want, or have handy, for ballasting. The thread is actually discussing the use of ballast boxes. Some folks (me, for example) like those boxes due to their compactness and close in to the tractor. Others would rather use a heavy implement. That's just personal preference.
The important thing is to have some kind of adequate weight back there (or on front, if a heavy rear implement) to keep all four tires on the ground.

+1, if your rear tires ever come off the ground from lifting something with the FEL, you are not properly ballasted. The relief valve should open long before the rear end comes up.

James K0UA

 

[jake98]

Hey TD, Being from the upper penninsula, and raising ducks, you could combine the words into the business name... did you ever think of 'All Ducked UP'? :thumbsup:

 

[Perplexed]

I think we may be getting carried away. His garden tractor can only lift 1,100 pounds with the 3PH.

Curious comment. To whom are you referring?

 

[gladehound]

I do a lot of work in tight woods and tight driveways. I much prefer using a bar between the 3pt links and 700 pounds of exercise weights because the tractor is so much more manuverable with this than an implement. It also weighs more than any of my implements and I had the weights lying around not being used anyway. I find implements to be very cumbersom when doing loader work because you always have check what they might swing into when you turn. Plus, since the weights roll, you can put it very low without worrying about it scaping the ground because if it touches it just rolls along. Also, since the weight is closer to the rear wheels it doesn't pick up the front as much which helps steering when plowing snow compared to a weight farther back

Here's a picture.

 

[JDGreenGrass]

I do a lot of work in tight woods and tight driveways. I much prefer using a bar between the 3pt links and 700 pounds of exercise weights because the tractor is so much more manuverable with this than an implement. It also weighs more than any of my implements and I had the weights lying around not being used anyway. I find implements to be very cumbersom when doing loader work because you always have check what they might swing into when you turn. Plus, since the weights roll, you can put it very low without worrying about it scaping the ground because if it touches it just rolls along. Also, since the weight is closer to the rear wheels it doesn't pick up the front as much which helps steering when plowing snow compared to a weight farther back

Here's a picture.

That works.!! But, I am wondering how you got all that weight onto the bar and 3pt hitch.??

 

[jake98]

Curious comment. To whom are you referring?

Mine lifts 1764 two feet back... must be you..
Didn't this thread start out with something about a condecending comment??

 

[RoyJackson]

Curious comment. To whom are you referring?

I'm curious too...

Anyway, 1100 lbs is a pretty good amount of weight...more then most implements for a Category 1 tractor.

 

[Perplexed]

Mine lifts 1764 two feet back... must be you..
Didn't this thread start out with something about a condecending comment??

Mine lifts 1209 lbs at 2 feet, so it can't be me either

There's been some very useful information posted, but this discussion seems to have come full circle...

 

[radioman]

So now we all noticed there ISN'T one size fit all rear weight fix. Everyone has their own preference/needs/wants. Some prefer liquid ballast and its the best thing in world, some thinks its the devils advocate. Some say spend money on a implement for exact same weight. Some say look around and hob nob a neat/nifty idea. Some say spend the money on a "real" professionally built ballast box.

Its really all about your preference and needs/finances. Which ever way you decide to go, it will be the right fit for you. :thumbsup:

 

[jake98]

Mine lifts 1209 lbs at 2 feet, so it can't be me either

There's been some very useful information posted, but this discussion seems to have come full circle...

It takes me at least three full circles before I get dizzy and nautious..

The thing I don't get about a ballast box is as soon as you need something else on the back, they're obsolete. I was just looking at another poster's beautiful build with storage for all the stuff I'm always lugging around. But if I want to bring the chipper out to the woods I'd have to drop the weight there and go back for it. Same as if I needed to fill some ruts with the box-blade. So the thing would only be good for the trip out to carry the tools, and then back... (I just put a garden cart hitch on the back of the chipper.)

 

[beersngars]

I have the larger Kubota ballast box (1000lb) and a box blade. I have NEVER used the ballast box. Got it when I bought the tractor, filled it with gravel and stuck it in the barn. It just seems to me, when using the loader hard enough to need more ballast, I need the box blade or some other implement anyways. BTW, my tires are loaded with rimguard and that made a huge difference.

If anyone is interested, I would sell the ballast box.

PS....I get to keep the gravel.

 

[boggen]

*thunderstorm nocking out satilite* so forgot name of poster / picture already

if 3pt lift arms allow you to swivel them left and right some. cut the "lifting bar" with weights on it. down just enough that you can wiggle ends of the arms over the bar. that way ya not pulling/pushing on each weight individually.

if memory serves the picture of the weights. had "large diameter" weight out near the lifting arms. i am assuming this is done to help act like wheels. to roll the entire thing around.

=========
if your lifting arms have latches instead of eye ball holes. length of bar would not be a problem. exception keeping bar short enough. so it would not run into the tires of tractor.

i would assume. the weight bar came with a couple "clamps" for each end of bar so weights would not fall off, and they are being used to keep "lifting arms" fully spaced out and to keep the bar in placed on the lifting arms.

=================
on a side note. remember if rear tires come off ground. the front tires end up being the point of the teter totor. and in that the further the same amount of weight sticks out behind the tractor. the more ballast you end up getting.

doing actual math. and see difference between 300lbs right at 3pt lift arms vs 2 to 4 feet behind tractor. would be interesting to see.

 

[RoyJackson]

If anyone is interested, I would sell the ballast box.

If it's the one I'm thinking of (straight sides), that will fit any Category 1 3PH. Dimensionally, it shouldn't be much different from my Deere box (has 600 lbs of sand in it...about 2/3rds full once settled).

I paid $95 (included most of the sand...I added 4 bags later) for mine...like you, the seller got it with his tractor and never used it.
So, a reasonable price would be about $100.

Here's one on eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/John-Deere-Ballast-box-compact-utility-tractors-/110676371679 for an asking price of $74.

 

[brandoro]

I got a ballast box with the tractor when I bought it. The dealership wanted to fill the tires but I don't always want the tractor to be that heavy so they didn't fill the tires and 'gave' me the box instead. I filled it with scrap steel and concrete with a frame embeded in the top for carrying chains, chainsaw and other things. I also bolted a hitch receiver to one of the slabs of steel inside before I filled it with concrete. I figure it is around 900 lbs. If I am digging dirt, pulling out stumps or dragging logs there is nothing better or I can put a drawbar in the receiver and move trailers around.
Compact weight, low center of gravity and space to carry extra stuff.

 

[beersngars]

If it's the one I'm thinking of (straight sides), that will fit any Category 1 3PH. Dimensionally, it shouldn't be much different from my Deere box (has 600 lbs of sand in it...about 2/3rds full once settled).

I paid $95 (included most of the sand...I added 4 bags later) for mine...like you, the seller got it with his tractor and never used it.
So, a reasonable price would be about $100.

Here's one on eBay: John Deere Ballast box for compact utility tractors | eBay for an asking price of $74.

Yea, $100 sounds about right. Think I paid about $250 new when I got my tractor. Mine is the larger tapered one that Kubota lists as 1000lb capacity.

 

[TrenaryDucks]

I think you need to look at the what sort of loader work you are going to be doing in order to determine your ballast needs. With only 1180 lbs of lift capacity for the 3ph, I'm going to assume the front end loader can only lift 700 to 800 pounds max. You don't need much ballast for that. Furthermore, you don't want your 3ph ballast to be near the maximum load rating due to wear and tear on the tractor.

I think a box blade or carry all will work just fine for a Cub Cadet. We aren't talking about 100 hp tractors where the weight of a box blade would too light for ballast.

 

[KennyG]

The great thing is that everyone is different. I didn't get a ballast box originally because I got a box blade and figured I would use it whenever I used the loader. I've since found I regularly use the loader at times I don't need the BB and, if I put the blade on for ballast only, it's in the way. So I'm planning on building a compact 500 to 600 lb ballast box.