Shaver HD10 not lifting pounder head

[SSdoxie]

Reading through this thread and trying to remember what I used to know about the 656. Dad had one and we used it a lot with a wood splitter. Only 1 lever will lock into detent for constant oil flow at the remote, I believe this was the left lever closest to the seat. This was setup with a auto-return to neutral when relief valve opened. If the lever isn't snapping out of detent probably not going over relief unless the auto-return is not working.
The valve on post driver looks like a typical Gresen valve with a pressure relief valve in it. That big hex plug just to left of the control handle. This maybe stuck.

 

[wfd2]

Can you raise the pounder.

Will the pounder come down when you activate the valve?

Will the pounder stop anywhere in the fall?

Have you checked the pressure at the input to the pounder valve?

Do you have detent in your remote valve?

Have you checked the relief pressure for the pounder?

Here's where I am so far:

1. Pounder will attempt to raise (nudge about 1/8").
2. Pounder will drop using lever.
3. Pounder will stop during drop if I release lever mid-drop.
4. I have not checked pressue at input of valve. I am in process of buying a gauge. But the remotes have been tested on my IH 2000 loader and they operate it.
5. Detent, yes I think. If detent is a lever on the operator's platform that opens flow to the remote, yes. When I'm operating the pounder, the lever is open, held by a bungie cord.

No I didn't check relief pressure. Now it's Saturday I'm going to take the valve apart and check these things, take pictures and post.

Thanks
Bill

 

[wfd2]

Reading through this thread and trying to remember what I used to know about the 656. Dad had one and we used it a lot with a wood splitter. Only 1 lever will lock into detent for constant oil flow at the remote, I believe this was the left lever closest to the seat. This was setup with a auto-return to neutral when relief valve opened. If the lever isn't snapping out of detent probably not going over relief unless the auto-return is not working.
The valve on post driver looks like a typical Gresen valve with a pressure relief valve in it. That big hex plug just to left of the control handle. This maybe stuck.

Yes, you are right. There are levers close to the seat, two of them as I have dual remotes. The left lever is held open with a plate. It operates my loader. The other is held open with a bungie cord and it operates the remote where the pounder is plugged in. I'm going to check the hex plug to left of control handle today.

Thanks!

 

[wfd2]

V-20 valve.

http://www.munciepower.com/clientuploads/directory/Resources/SP/SP03-02.pdf

I believe it is the same valve, or very similar, but the end plates are different. The IN and OUt ports are on the top.. They are also using a single action cyl, as one of the work ports is plugged.

G19 is the out port in the Shaver picture, but your OUT port is above to the left.

G-16 is the cyl port.

G-21 is the IN port

G-14 is the open center plug kit.



You might consider changing out those pipe fittings.

Are there any numbers on the valve starting with 20?

A few other quick questions before I open this valve for inspection.

I am going to disconnect hyd line from tractor first.

1. Will there be pressure in the valve after I lower the cylinder completely?
2. When I take the plugs out, are they going to spew oil with pressure?
3. Based on my pictures, the hex plug just to the left of the lever is the relief valve. I'm just confirming that's correct.
4. Which plug on my valve is "G14" (Open center plug kit) from the Shaver manual? I'm looking over the Gresen manuals for the v20 valve and it looks like it's the silver hex plug in the middle bottom on the right end of the valve in my picture. Or is it the hex plug directly above the lever?

 

[RickB]

Yes, you are right. There are levers close to the seat, two of them as I have dual remotes. The left lever is held open with a plate. It operates my loader. The other is held open with a bungie cord and it operates the remote where the pounder is plugged in. I'm going to check the hex plug to left of control handle today.

Thanks!

Right there is your problem. You need to place the valve that is feeding your loader valve in the neutral position in order to direct pump flow to the Shaver valve AND LIFT THE HEAD.

You can't ask two open center valves that are plumbed in parallel to supply oil to different functiions concurrently.

 

[J_J]

wfd2,

If the tractor is not running, then wiggle all the valve levers to relieve any fluid that might have been trapped in the system. Ensure the pounder cyl is down fully.

Now you should be able to remove anything hyd you want with out any pressure release. I would still use a rag over the tool you use to loosen the fittings.

I am still try to determine if you have raised the pounder fully, because if you have, you had pressure. Then if you release the pounder cyl, fluid will flow out the out port, to the sump.

That was the reason for the gage at the input to the pounder valve.

Before you tear things apart, test the pressure and see if it is available to the pounder. Set the remote lever for the loader to neutral. Set the other remote lever to provide fluid to the pounder, and see if the pounder will work.

 

[wfd2]

RickB,

I'll try that tomorrow- putting the valve on the 656 in neutral and try again.

I Never even got to looking at the valve today as it poured rain. And the stuff in the barn has displaced my tractor outside, under a tarp.

 

[wfd2]

wfd2,

If the tractor is not running, then wiggle all the valve levers to relieve any fluid that might have been trapped in the system. Ensure the pounder cyl is down fully.

Now you should be able to remove anything hyd you want with out any pressure release. I would still use a rag over the tool you use to loosen the fittings.

I am still try to determine if you have raised the pounder fully, because if you have, you had pressure. Then if you release the pounder cyl, fluid will flow out the out port, to the sump.

That was the reason for the gage at the input to the pounder valve.

Before you tear things apart, test the pressure and see if it is available to the pounder. Set the remote lever for the loader to neutral. Set the other remote lever to provide fluid to the pounder, and see if the pounder will work.

JJ,

I have raised the pounder [almost] fully, but not under the load of the 656. I used another loader on a different tractor to slowly pull up the pounder head. Pushing the valve in release mode, the pounder head falls freely. And I can even stop it in mid-drop my releasing the handle on the gresen valve. So there is pressure in the cylinder, just won't lift it up. Again, tractor tests fine using my loader on the 656. The remotes will lift it just fine.

I did not get to fiddle with it today. It was a rain out here. I will keep you guys updated with what I find.

Bill

 

[wfd2]

Right there is your problem. You need to place the valve that is feeding your loader valve in the neutral position in order to direct pump flow to the Shaver valve AND LIFT THE HEAD.

You can't ask two open center valves that are plumbed in parallel to supply oil to different functiions concurrently.

RickB,

I got to thinking about your suggestion here and wanted to let you know results of a few tests I did with my 2000 IH loader mounted on the 656.

If the valve (stock IH valve to the right of the operators seat) on the 656 is in what I think is neutral (middle of the throw, it will push forward and pull back, but I have it sitting in the middle) and I hook the loader to the remote that the lever controls, then the loader will not operate. If I pull the lever back (where I have it now), then the loader will work.

Am I misunderstanding your post? I very well could be as I'm pretty new to hydraulics but I'm learning quick thanks to you guys!

Respectfully,
Bill

 

[RickB]

RickB,

I got to thinking about your suggestion here and wanted to let you know results of a few tests I did with my 2000 IH loader mounted on the 656.

If the valve (stock IH valve to the right of the operators seat) on the 656 is in what I think is neutral (middle of the throw, it will push forward and pull back, but I have it sitting in the middle) and I hook the loader to the remote that the lever controls, then the loader will not operate. If I pull the lever back (where I have it now), then the loader will work.

Am I misunderstanding your post? I very well could be as I'm pretty new to hydraulics but I'm learning quick thanks to you guys!

Respectfully,
Bill

If your 656 has 2 remote valves, one has to be in neutral in order for the other to work. That's about as basic as I can make it. Forget everything else and start there.