FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal

   / FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal #131  
2 years ago I was in need of chain saw gas and didn't have any non alcohol in cans, so I want to the local gas station and got some drunken gas
Mixed it up and used it for what I was needing and let the rest of it sit after I got "good gas mix", figured I would use the drunken gas up starting a brush pile sooner or later.

Well fast forward to today, I wanted to burn one of my brush piles, got that little jug of gas out, started pouring it into a spent plastic fertilizer jug for putting it on the fire, and I swear, smelling it was rank,

Tell me gas will hold for years.....

I think some of yas are smokin wacky terbaccy
:rolleyes:
 
   / FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal #132  
You are so wrong. Go to any mower shop or marina and talk to the guys there. I am in the marine business and maintain about 75 motors. It keeps lots of money in my pocket so for me ethanol and it's problems are a good thing.

I will agree with you on stores carry what is in demand but to say there is no issues with ethanol is crazy.

Chris

I never said or meant to imply that there are no issues with ANY fuel. I did say that storage and usage and the type of fuel containment could be an issue. And that is the crux of the issue... a lot of folks will blame the fuel, when in fact, most times it is their incompetence that actually caused a problem. Not following proper fuel management and maintenance procedures has led to more problems than the fuels themselves. And that is why no one has been able to collect on the quarter million dollar award they could get if they could prove that the fuel was the culprit. And non of us likes to admit we screwed the pooch in how we did something. It is common today to blame someone or something else for our stupidity.

Now, from some in the marine industry....

From the Boat Owners Association of the U.S.

Three Ethanol Myths Clarified - BoatUS Magazine

From the Marine Engines and Fuels website:

MYTH: Ethanol-blended fuels are bad and should be avoided.

TRUTH: Ethanol blended fuels (E10) are common throughout much of the United States. After the transition period from non-ethanol fuel, E10 may actually be a superior marine fuel, as it tends to keep low levels of water moving through the fuel system, keeping the system é›»ry? For over a decade, marine engines have been engineered to handle E10 gasoline. However, all types of fuels should be treated if they won't be used in a few weeks.


And this from Higgins Classic Boats Association

Fuels
 
   / FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal #133  
"After the transition period from non-ethanol fuel, E10 may actually be a superior marine fuel, as it tends to keep low levels of water moving through the fuel system, keeping the system é›»ry? " copperhead ???

not sure what is being said....so it's good for low levels of water moving through an internal combustion fuel system? regards :)
 
   / FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal #134  
I didn't write it, they did. Take it for what it's worth. The previous argument was expressing how marine engines are affected, and I just took a quote from the Marine Engines and Fuels website. I have no dog in that hunt, as I don't own a boat.
 
   / FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal #135  
I didn't write it, they did. Take it for what it's worth. The previous argument was expressing how marine engines are affected, and I just took a quote from the Marine Engines and Fuels website. I have no dog in that hunt, as I don't own a boat.


Oh, that doesn't mean you don't have a dog in the hunt.

Bottom line, ethanol laced fuel is crap, another of the green rip-offs visited upon the consumer and tax payer by XXXX (censored in a valiant attempt at not having this post deleted by management).
 
   / FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal #136  
If you feel so strongly about it, then don't buy it. If you have no choice, then call your hired help at the state captitol or in D.C. I don't feel as strongly about the issue. I can live with it or without it. My vehicles and equipment run fine on either, so I will not join the chorus. Be that as it may, line up some folks that think the way you do and make some noise about it. You might actually make a difference. It will not hurt me in any way, so I am all for anyone raising a stink about it one way or the other. Good luck.
 
   / FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal #137  
"After the transition period from non-ethanol fuel, E10 may actually be a superior marine fuel, as it tends to keep low levels of water moving through the fuel system, keeping the system é›»ry? " copperhead ???

not sure what is being said....so it's good for low levels of water moving through an internal combustion fuel system? regards :)

Water injection has been around for a long time. It doesn't hurt an engine. The point though that the article is making that the alcohol is picking up the small amounts of water in the fuel system and burning it before it becomes a large amount of water and stops the engine from working. Same thing as people who put heet in their gas tank to stop fuel lines from freezing up. It is just alcohol.

It can be said a lot of times that this is a conspiracy but if you look at the research and data you will see the E10 is there to replace things like MTBE and other octane boosters and oxygenation chemicals, look that up and see what they do for the water system.

Rotting fuel lines and carb issues, I have never seen it and I have ran it through a Model 80 Owatana windrower, a Massey Harris combine, several old Oliver, John Deere and IH tractors with no issues. All built long before E10 was thought of. Maybe it is the luck of the draw but again I have never had issues and no one I know personally has ever had an issue with it. /shrug

It does have less energy than gasoline but only 10% less, so with 10% of the mix being 10% less energy that would be 1% total reduction of energy. But there is also the extra O2 that is in the mix and extra octane which can also give you more power if you have an engine that can take advantage by changing the settings to extract more power. Alcohol will also clean carbon out of combustion chambers.

I will say I am against E85, not because of conspiracy or anything like that, it is because we make it out of corn and it has a terrible diesel to alcohol ratio. Over 10% mix and it isn't to provide a replacement for other chemicals but to just be a substitution of gas. If we are going to something like E85 we need to be using something like switch grass or something that has about a 20 to 1 conversion ratio.

I do agree though if you feel better buying ethanol free fuel then by all means. I am just sharing my experiences and what I have researched. (I did some engineering research and study in college on alcohol as a motor fuel.)
 
   / FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal #138  
It does have less energy than gasoline but only 10% less, so with 10% of the mix being 10% less energy that would be 1% total reduction of energy. But there is also the extra O2 that is in the mix and extra octane which can also give you more power if you have an engine that can take advantage by changing the settings to extract more power. Alcohol will also clean carbon out of combustion chambers.

I will say I am against E85, not because of conspiracy or anything like that, it is because we make it out of corn and it has a terrible diesel to alcohol ratio. Over 10% mix and it isn't to provide a replacement for other chemicals but to just be a substitution of gas. If we are going to something like E85 we need to be using something like switch grass or something that has about a 20 to 1 conversion ratio.

)


10%??
I'm pretty sure that's way off. More like 40%

And what does E85 have to do with diesel?


Sorry, you lost all credibility with me here.
 
   / FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal #139  
Well, the BTU energy content is less than gas, but that does not equate to less mpg or performance when the engine is designed specifically to take advantage of all the features of the fuel. Case in point, the GM 3.2L EBDI engine in testing right now. Primarily designed for E85, but is also flex fuel capable. On E85, it has the same HP and Torque as the 6.6L Duramax diesel, while getting the same fuel economy as the diesel. Now there is a strong difference between the BTU content of ethanol compared to diesel, much more than the difference between gas and ethanol. Yet, an engine half the size of the 6.6L can generate the same HP and Torque using a fuel with lower BTU content and considerably cheaper in price at the pump. This engine has been under testing in 3500HD pickups. No idea when or if it will ever be made available to us out here in the cheap seats. BTU content of the fuel is only one aspect to consider. There are other aspects of the fuel that can be taken advantage of. In ethanol's case, significantly higher compression ratios than can be run with even premium gas. Ethanol, when injected, has a cooling effect on the intake air temperature and combustion chamber. You can not only have higher compression ratios with ethanol, but you also get a higher air density from the air being cooled. Something neither gas or diesel offers. And these are just some of the characteristics of ethanol that can be taken advantage of.

The problem with the lower mpg in current flex fuel vehicles using E85, is that they are designed primarily for gas, and cannot fully take advantage of things like diesel engine level compression ratios and other factors, to glean all the capabilities out of using higher ethanol concentrations. Same can be said of all other gas engines using E10. The engines were not primarily developed to take advantage of the fuel. Just basic modifications to allow the use of it. Hopefully soon, engines designed around ethanol specifically will be made available, and we can then use all the E85 we want and allow those with older engines to use all the gas they want. We all will win!

Those that have such an aversion to using ethanol should be championing the OEM's to bring out these newer E85 specific engines so that they will have more traditional gas to use for themselves. It is called... "lighting a candle instead of cursing the darkness". And who cares what the ethanol is made from... corn, sugar beets, or granny's fruit cake. If it is not cost effective to make one way, then folks will find a way to use another source. The market price will determine what is cost effective to use as a feed stock for the product.
 
   / FUEL PROBLEMS with Ethonal #140  
I am going to depart this thread,
Copper inundates the thread with so much word count, I get exhausted trying to read it.

What's that old saying, If you cant dazzle them with brilliance, baffle em with BS?

Enjoy
:rolleyes:
 

Tractor & Equipment Auctions

2018 Chevrolet Tahoe SUV (A48082)
2018 Chevrolet...
2022 Massey Ferguson 1825E 4WD Tractor (A50860)
2022 Massey...
2011 Chevrolet Impala 1FL Sedan (A48082)
2011 Chevrolet...
2025 Swict 84in Bucket Skid Steer Attachment (A50322)
2025 Swict 84in...
2020 Chevrolet Malibu LT Sedan (A50860)
2020 Chevrolet...
2015 FONTAINE VELOCITY 102" X 48' STEP DECK TRL (A50459)
2015 FONTAINE...
 
Top