Not Charging

[clemsonfor]

My battery is 4 years old. I keep a HF solar charger maintainer on it. I wanted to check the health of my battery. It's been parked since last weekend. Put meter on it 12.15v , ok that's low but I bought a cheap battery. So after I used the tractor for like 30 mins I get back to shed leave it running check to see if charging with meter. I only see 11.67 at high idle. I go up to about 2000rpm and see 11.8. I cut it off and it stayed about 11.8. I had 11.8 running everywhere, battery both terminals on the alternator plug, 11.8 at solonoid. B lug on battery had nothing if I remember right.

If my trouble shooting mind is still right this points to a bad alt and not regulator sice it's not outputting any voltage but I just get battery voltage at connections. OR is this wrong and alt is not being excited by a bad regulator?

Weird thing is charge light never comes on except when engine is off. This also could be due to the type problem and me not fully understanding the circuit or external regulator?

I will poke around the regulator when I get back to the house in a bit.

Thoughts and suggestions, I don't plan to just parts swap and throw parts at it.y goal is to diagnose and repair.

 

[Roadworthy]

It sounds like an alternator issue. It could be brushes or it could be diodes. Remove the alternator and take it to a starter and alternator repair shop. They can test it and tell you for sure. They can probably even repair it for a fraction of the cost of a replacement.

 

[California]

If it tests out to be the alternator dead, I see prices $29~49 on ebay for cheap rebuilts, more for quality. Datsun 510 1973 + several other Nissans, and I see one Chev Luv application claimed. BTDT but verify this!

You want the 35 amp non-AC version. The 50 amp version for AC is fatter and will touch the block, so you would need a longer belt and likely a new adjustment arm or even mounting bracket.

What's on there OEM is 6 amp as I recall - and the manual says put a battery charger on every couple of months. How's that for Old School!

But test what you have and consider replacing a diode or something before throwing parts at it. I would replace the old mechanical regulator with a modern potted electronic one at the same time. I smoked my alternator by hosing down the regulator, not realizing it was open for ventilation underneath.

 

[clemsonfor]

I do have the more modern style regulator.
Good call on the 50 amp alternator. I was looking up the same 78 Subaru application as the oil filter and only saw 50 and 60 am listed. They looked just like the original but didn't realize they were fatter. Thanks for the heads up. Rock Auto had those reman units for like $16+ shipping. I'm going to look around. I unplugged my regulator and plugged back in to hopefully clean the prongs and connections, but I am just sure this alt is dead, the output is only 10.8v the battery voltage before I start it was right around 12v. I think the only reason this battery is not dead is because I use it for 3 to 6 hours each weekend lately when I use it and it goes right back on that maintainer. Which is not really a charger just to keep it topped up in storage. I think trouble shooting the light may be more of a pain. I know it use to work cause at low idle it use to flicker. I cleaned the connections and that cleared up that issue, but that was a few years ago.

I guess I can't complain, mechanical parts fail, so I have to replace a $20-30 alternator...eeeeehh. better than buying a more expensive modern tractor replacement!

 

[clemsonfor]

Found it useing your application. $17 plus about $8 shipping on Rock Auto. This is a rebuild. I will have to look and see what a new one costs. My guess is that the price you listed off eBay are new shiny chinese units, vs shiny chinese rebuilt units.

California check your PM.

 

[bmaverick]

If it tests out to be the alternator dead, I see prices $29~49 on ebay for cheap rebuilts, more for quality. Datsun 510 1973 + several other Nissans, and I see one Chev Luv application claimed. BTDT but verify this!

You want the 35 amp non-AC version. The 50 amp version for AC is fatter and will touch the block, so you would need a longer belt and likely a new adjustment arm or even mounting bracket.

What's on there OEM is 6 amp as I recall - and the manual says put a battery charger on every couple of months. How's that for Old School!

But test what you have and consider replacing a diode or something before throwing parts at it. I would replace the old mechanical regulator with a modern potted electronic one at the same time. I smoked my alternator by hosing down the regulator, not realizing it was open for ventilation underneath.

You an call me lazy or just too busy, but my machine has the same issue. I've not yet taken the alternator in for testing. Battery holds a charge from a wall unit and the green light would be on after an overnight trickle.

My YM2610 would have the same alternator as a YM2500 and the JD 850/950/1050. What vehicles from RockAuto would be best. And I would like to go 50A or so. Just added a winch and some additional lighting too.

Best to get this solved before old man winter hits.

 

[denchen]

It is very rare the wiring in an alternator goes. Brushes, yes,. rectifier, yes, voltage regulator, yes. And even a loose `fan belt`.

 

[clemsonfor]

You an call me lazy or just too busy, but my machine has the same issue. I've not yet taken the alternator in for testing. Battery holds a charge from a wall unit and the green light would be on after an overnight trickle.

My YM2610 would have the same alternator as a YM2500 and the JD 850/950/1050. What vehicles from RockAuto would be best. And I would like to go 50A or so. Just added a winch and some additional lighting too.

Best to get this solved before old man winter hits.

Does it not look the same as the ones for the ym2000 and most of the other tractors in that size range?

I would almost bet it's the same alternator. Those tractors are Yanmar built, been those JD models. It might be the size case that the 50a model sits in already?

 

[bmaverick]

Does it not look the same as the ones for the ym2000 and most of the other tractors in that size range?

I would almost bet it's the same alternator. Those tractors are Yanmar built, been those JD models. It might be the size case that the 50a model sits in already?

Not sure it's the same alternator. Here's the YM2610 page for the engine side of the electrical.



And here's the YM1700/YM2000 page also for the engine side electrical.





YM2610 124759-77200

YM2000 124756-77200

 

[clemsonfor]

I would almost bet that the larger alternator would fit. I am sure the 35 amp version would fit. I can't say for certain. Probably would take some research. I would look up each of those alternators or listings for the correct application...cheap china eBay alternators even and get physical demensions and then compare to Rock Auto application for the 50a datsun/nissan applications. Also paying special attention to how the alternator is clocked as well. This is not as big a deal. I worked at a parts store and if we were out of one part number alternator for say a certain small block chevy application, we would look up another, as long as connector and amps were same we would pull it and swap pulleys if needed and reclock them to the right position. My point is that can be done. If connections are in a different spot on the body you may also have to lengthen it a few inches but that's not a big deal. Cut it and use marine shirk and heat shrink connectors and reattach.

I am positive there will be another application you can look up.

 

[California]

... and reclock them to the right position.

??? What's this?

 

[clemsonfor]

??? What's this?

The way the mounting ears are placed on the alternator. You can take the bolts out and spin it so that it is in the position it needs to be. Like on say small blocks from back in the day. The alternators all mouth very similar. A bolt through one spot and a tab that tightens it to the adjustment. A full size truck with a 350 may have the adjuster tab at the 11 o'clock position I believe. The same truck in a 6 cyl application may be at the 2 o'clock. Everything is the same but that tab and maybe the pulley. You can swap the pulley of their bad alt onto the new one if the diameter is different and you take the bolts out and turn the case half part so that it will match up correctly. These are just made up positions. And it's been 20 years since I did one and in the year and a half I worked parts counter I may have only done it a few times. I can't remember what I did last week at some points but this is how I remember it.

 

[California]

Thanks. I didn't know you could do that.

 

[bmaverick]

I would almost bet that the larger alternator would fit. I am sure the 35 amp version would fit. ...Probably would take some research. I would look up each of those alternators or listings for the correct application...

Thanks. That was my thinking too. The YM2610 has the 35A version. I was hoping for a 50A or 65A to replace it.

Google shows 0 zero hits for the 124759-77200. The DUCK search shows 17 hits like Startpage.

Fredricks on-line store shows:

Description: Alternator, 12v 35 amp

Applications: 195, 240, 330, 336, 1700, 2000, 2210, 2500, 2610, 3000, 3110, 3810, 4300 (also 1600,1900,2200,2700 but needs different wire ends)

Part Number: 124756-77200 (124756-77210)

So, you are RIGHT. This fits yours and mine. LOL

 

[clemsonfor]

I pulled the regulator off the non running 186 to take to the farm this weekend to see if it's a bad regulator causing my no charge situation. I figure I have it, and I assume it's good and it's free to try so why not.

 

[winston1]

I pulled the regulator off the non running 186 to take to the farm this weekend to see if it's a bad regulator causing my no charge situation. I figure I have it, and I assume it's good and it's free to try so why not.

I believe they are different regulators. The 186 has a dynamo.

 

[California]

I believe they are different regulators. The 186 has a dynamo.

Agree, not similar regulators.

 

[clemsonfor]

I believe they are different regulators. The 186 has a dynamo.

Agree, not similar regulators.

Ahhh, your right!! I forgot about that. I was even eyeing that tiny little thing , thinking man I wish it was an alternator. So we're sure it's different? I guess I can go to hour and look.

Edit: yep y'all are right. I looked them up on Hoye and different part numbers.

 

[clemsonfor]

I would almost bet that the larger alternator would fit. I am sure the 35 amp version would fit. I can't say for certain. Probably would take some research. I would look up each of those alternators or listings for the correct application...cheap china eBay alternators even and get physical demensions and then compare to Rock Auto application for the 50a datsun/nissan applications. Also paying special attention to how the alternator is clocked as well. This is not as big a deal. I worked at a parts store and if we were out of one part number alternator for say a certain small block chevy application, we would look up another, as long as connector and amps were same we would pull it and swap pulleys if needed and reclock them to the right position. My point is that can be done. If connections are in a different spot on the body you may also have to lengthen it a few inches but that's not a big deal. Cut it and use marine shirk and heat shrink connectors and reattach.

I am positive there will be another application you can look up.

Ok looking back Into this. I went onto Hoye site. Pull up the 186 regulator. Look at all the part numbers it replaced. The last one is xxx-77710 . That is the same number that the VR for the YM 2000 lists as the part number that their part replaces. So saying it in a less confusing way. Both Hoye's VR listings list the same Yanmar part number as what it replaces. The listing for the 186 lists way more part numbers it replaced vs their listing on the ym2000. I believe it's the same part. There is some wording that there is a new and old style VR for the 186. One had 2 components and the main one had a 4 prong plug and there was a seperate black box beside it that is now in the new one and if you had this 2 part set up you need a conversation harness. But if you have new style 6 pin connector it's a direct replacement. That said the 186 I have had a 6 pin plug like the ym2000 so this should work on the ym 2000.

 

[bmaverick]

Ok looking back Into this. I went onto Hoye site. Pull up the 186 regulator. Look at all the part numbers it replaced. The last one is xxx-7710 . That is the same number that the VR for the YM 2000 lists as the part number that their part replaces. So saying it in a less confusing way. Both Hoye's VR listings list the same Yanmar part number as what it replaces. The listing for the 186 lists way more part numbers it replaced vs their listing on the ym2000. I believe it's the same part. There is some wording that there is a new and old style VR for the 186. One had 2 components and the main one had a 4 prong plug and there was a seperate black box beside it that is now in the new one and if you had this 2 part set up you need a conversation harness. But if you have new style 6 pin connector it's a direct replacement. That said the 186 I have had a 6 pin plug like the ym2000 so this should work on the ym 2000.

And dear Watson, It's elementary understood. :drink: