48 8n wont start- Help

[presta24]

Drove the tractor up to the house one day to take out the trash, it fired up fine as always. Parked it by the house and did a few other things for an hr or so. Went back to take down the trash cans and it wouldn't start. Wont do anything. no clicking doesn't try to turn over, nothing. Haven't worked on this tractor at all so looking for some help. I did take out the battery and give it a full charge. No dice. Its a 6v with the side mount alternator. I'd love to convert to 12v. Per my dad, who I inherited the tractor from, the side mount distributors don't have a conversion kit?

Hate to see her sit. Runs well and is good for a lot. Also keeps hrs off my '21 CK2610, and gas is cheaper lol.

 

[claggstractors]

Have you checked the ground cable condition and connections?

 

[presta24]

Have you checked the ground cable condition and connections?

I disconnected it from the push button and tried to ground it out on the frame somewhere to get it to crank. Didnt have any luck. Ground from the battery to started is relatively new.

 

[claggstractors]

Would need to pull out the manual to go much further for me, been at least 10 years since I've had an 8N in the shop. If I remember right though, the switch on the tranny passes power to the solenoid. Wish souNdguy was still here. He knew the Ford N's like the back of his hand. Anyways, if it isn't even clicking at the solenoid, it nearly has to be a voltage issue. Have you checked the voltage at the battery while trying to crank it?

 

[John0829]

First you do have it neutral, right? Make sure all the connections are clean and tight. Next try by passing the solenoid and see if it cranks if it does the solenoid is bad and you must get a solenoid made for the 8N. They are different in that they are internally hot and the push button switch provides the ground. If you still get nothing jumping directly to the starter, with a known good battery, then it is time to remove the starter for R&R. Since you say it will not click I think your problem is going to in the solenoid or the connections.

Not sure what you mean about the side mount dissy and a conversion unless you mean to EI. They do make them for 12V systems but I do not recommend changing.

 

[presta24]

First you do have it neutral, right? Make sure all the connections are clean and tight. Next try by passing the solenoid and see if it cranks if it does the solenoid is bad and you must get a solenoid made for the 8N. They are different in that they are internally hot and the push button switch provides the ground. If you still get nothing jumping directly to the starter, with a known good battery, then it is time to remove the starter for R&R. Since you say it will not click I think your problem is going to in the solenoid or the connections.

Not sure what you mean about the side mount dissy and a conversion unless you mean to EI. They do make them for 12V systems but I do not recommend changing.

Thanks for the info. Yes in neutral, the button wont press if in gear. I'll try the solenoid and see where that gets me. All good advise. Really appreciate it. Haven't been able to find a battery (reasonably priced) I have literally been waiting on RK to get them in stock for 2 damn years. May have yo break down and spend $200 on a damn batt.

Why would you not recommend going to 12v?

 

[gstrom99]

There is a key to energize the system and allow it to crank, right? Bypass that first. Then, check/clean all connections. Simple, reliable machines. Go ahead an convert it, add electronic ignition too if you want. I did both to my 9n and never had an issue.

 

[John0829]

I firmly believe in converting to 12V, I just do not believe in the electronic ignition conversions. Converting to 12V is child's play, a GM alternator, a little wire, battery and coil is all that is needed. No need to change the starter, everything else stays the same.

 

[jwmorris]

and you must get a solenoid made for the 8N.

Actually, if you are in a pinch, you can use a regular solenoid but you must NOT bolt the case to metal but Plastic or some other insulator. Where it’s bolted to the insulator, also attach the wire from the push button.

The normal start wire just goes to 12v+. So when the button is pushed the case is grounded and activates the solenoid.


Looks like this. The blue wire going to button and the only way the solenoid is grounded. The little red wire on the starter side goes to the coil, giving it full 12 volts when cranking.

It looks like it’s bolted to the starter but it’s isolated by 1/2” plastic.

If you get it cranking and want an easy way to clean the points, this method has saved me a lot of time, on the front mount ones.

I do fid it odd that our ‘52 side mount distributor never has points issues but you can almost count on the ‘48 not starting if you have let it sit for a few months.

 

[presta24]

Actually, if you are in a pinch, you can use a regular solenoid but you must NOT bolt the case to metal but Plastic or some other insulator. Where it’s bolted to the insulator, also attach the wire from the push button.

The normal start wire just goes to 12v+. So when the button is pushed the case is grounded and activates the solenoid.


Looks like this. The blue wire going to button and the only way the solenoid is grounded. The little red wire on the starter side goes to the coil, giving it full 12 volts when cranking.View attachment 759828
It looks like it’s bolted to the starter but it’s isolated by 1/2” plastic.

If you get it cranking and want an easy way to clean the points, this method has saved me a lot of time, on the front mount ones.

I do fid it odd that our ‘52 side mount distributor never has points issues but you can almost count on the ‘48 not starting if you have let it sit for a few months.

If it was the points, would it do anything at all? Because nothing happens when I press the button

 

[RustyA]

This is the reason the following terms are used . ...No Crank-starter will not turn engine over.
No Start-engine turns over fine but will not run.
Bad points may cause a no-start condition but will not cause a no-crank event.

 

[gstrom99]

There's two threads for this (continuing?) issue. They should be merged, or one deleted.

 

[presta24]

There's two threads for this (continuing?) issue. They should be merged, or one deleted.

I deleted the other. Didn't remember that I had already posted on this forum

 

[ROUSTABOUT]

Actually, if you are in a pinch, you can use a regular solenoid but you must NOT bolt the case to metal but Plastic or some other insulator. Where it’s bolted to the insulator, also attach the wire from the push button.

The normal start wire just goes to 12v+. So when the button is pushed the case is grounded and activates the solenoid.


Looks like this. The blue wire going to button and the only way the solenoid is grounded. The little red wire on the starter side goes to the coil, giving it full 12 volts when cranking.View attachment 759828
It looks like it’s bolted to the starter but it’s isolated by 1/2” plastic.

If you get it cranking and want an easy way to clean the points, this method has saved me a lot of time, on the front mount ones.

I do fid it odd that our ‘52 side mount distributor never has points issues but you can almost count on the ‘48 not starting if you have let it sit for a few months.

Yeah the points short to the circlip spring.

 

[jwmorris]

If it was the points, would it do anything at all? Because nothing happens when I press the button

Yes, it would just turn over and over cranking but not starting. Like you ran out of fuel but you just don’t have fire.

If it won’t turn over at all you would go in a different direction.

Is the engine locked up?

Is your battery dead?

Are the + & - connections clean and corrosion free on both ends?

Is the button sending ground signal when depressed?

Is power making it to the starter?

You could put a jumper cable directly from the battery to the + post on the starter (make dam sure your in neutral so you don’t drive over yourself as you are bypassing a safety device) and see if it cranks. If the battery is good and it won’t crank like that the starter itself is dead (assuming the engine isn’t locked up).

 

[presta24]

Yes, it would just turn over and over cranking but not starting. Like you ran out of fuel but you just don’t have fire.

If it won’t turn over at all you would go in a different direction.

Is the engine locked up?

Is your battery dead?

Are the + & - connections clean and corrosion free on both ends?

Is the button sending ground signal when depressed?

Is power making it to the starter?

You could put a jumper cable directly from the battery to the + post on the starter (make dam sure your in neutral so you don’t drive over yourself as you are bypassing a safety device) and see if it cranks. If the battery is good and it won’t crank like that the starter itself is dead (assuming the engine isn’t locked up).

I was able to turn it over by bypassing the solenoid with a set of jumper cables and a spare 12v batt I have. Going today to buy a new battery. The old one was on a charger over night, still drawing 10amps this am. Guessing its toast? The day of the issue it started on its own with the current battery. We'll see if she starts with a new one.

 

[jwmorris]

Yeah, batteries always work, until they don’t.

However, if it cranked completely bypassed. Now, you need to (again, making sure it’s in neutral first and last) ground the solenoid where the wire from the push button attaches and the other end to ground.

If it doesn’t crank, your solenoid is the problem.

If it does, the ground signal isn’t going from the push button or you are trying to crank it in gear and you can’t do that, they didn‘t want people driving over themselves. If they hit the starter button while off the machine. Kind of like “butt switches“ on new tractors but reliable because it’s mechanical and not electronic.

 

[presta24]

Found the fix

The positive battery cable was bad. Well, at least the terminal. It was pretty marred up on the inside of the eye. Wasn't making a good connection. Cut it off and put a new one on. The ol girl sputtered to life just fine. After sitting for almost a yr. Have to love the reliability of these old tractors. I remember by dad telling me years ago a buddy of his tried to jump it off a 12v running vehicle. Maybe that deformed the terminal?

Gave her some love and an oil change. Topped off the coolant. Now to just figure out what I am going to do about lights. The tractor hasn't had working lights since its been in the family.

 

[John0829]

Glad you got it running, these old tractors are stupid simple to work on. Getting lights, no sweat.

 

[presta24]

Glad you got it running, these old tractors are stupid simple to work on. Getting lights, no sweat.

I went with 12v LED headlights and a step up converter to run them. Was cheaper than any 6v options I saw out there.