Loader Advice for FEL newbie

[Post Carbon]

Hello folks,

I am the shy new owner of a used Kubota B7800 with a FEL and a 58" tiller. We have piles and piles of excavated dirt to be pushed back around a foundation and a drainage ditch. Ditch varies from 2' to 5' in depth, while the foundation is from 5' to 10'. Never really used a FEL before, except I cleared snow from our driveway a bit, although fairly incompetently.

I am wondering if you all have any advice for this newbie. I don't want to do anything stupid, and wish I could find FEL lessons on the internet, something that would say "First try this for 30 minutes. Then progress to that."

Any advice is welcome from those of you who've got experience.

PCP

 

[RaydaKub]

I've never heard of an lessons out there like that.
So...

First, GO SLOW!

Second, carry it as low as you can. Especially around a construction site, there are often ruts. You hit a rut with a front wheel and the loader is up high, it'll roll you over before you can hit the lever to lower it. Even a few guys here that have been running their FEL for years get bit by this once in a while.

Third, if any hillsides are present go up and down, never sideways if you can help it, especially if there is a load in the bucket.

Fourth, get enough ballast. You can load the tires with fluid (and there are lots of references here on how to do that), add wheel weights, or add ballast on the rear end. The further back, the better. Loading the wheels with either fluid or weights keeps the rear end down. Mounting it further back keeps the rear end down AND transfers weight to the rear end from the front. Keeping the tiller mounted while doing this would be great if it isn't too big and cumbersome to move around; much better than an empty 3ph.

Don't worry about your inexperience. When moving dirt, a few mistakes doesn't matter. You just get to do it again, and that's more seat time. :thumbsup:

Oh, did I mention GO SLOW? Speed is not your concern here. You'll get it done and you'll get faster at it as you go. Above all, ENJOY yourself! :cloud9:

And :welcome: to TBN. Great group of guys here!

 

[TripleR]

Pretty much what Ray says and I can't over emphasize the necessity of proper ballast and keeping the bucket low. It doesn't need to be dragging the ground or just a few inches, but as low as practical. While you are in the initial phases, you might want to carry less than optimal volume/weight in your bucket to get acclimated.

I would strongly recommend buying Operator Manuals for the tractor and loader as there will be information in there on the proper use and maintenance.

Follow Ray's advice and with practice comes skill. I have been doing this a long time and I'm still not as good as I would like to be.

 

[RoyJackson]

I'll add to check your front tire pressures...increase it to the maximum. Soft sidewalls (low pressure) can result in the tires running off the rim.

 

[teg]

Don't ram the dirt pile, start out with the bucket flat/level (on level ground, too) then push in and carve up (lift and curl at the same time). Get the motion down by going slow... speed is after you get the hang of it.

FEL for clearing snow is not the greatest (even after you know what you are doing) so don't worry about that.

 

[bigtiller]

Hello folks,

I am the shy new owner of a used Kubota B7800 with a FEL and a 58" tiller. We have piles and piles of excavated dirt to be pushed back around a foundation and a drainage ditch. Ditch varies from 2' to 5' in depth, while the foundation is from 5' to 10'. Never really used a FEL before, except I cleared snow from our driveway a bit, although fairly incompetently.

I am wondering if you all have any advice for this newbie. I don't want to do anything stupid, and wish I could find FEL lessons on the internet, something that would say "First try this for 30 minutes. Then progress to that."

Any advice is welcome from those of you who've got experience.

PCP

Pushing dirt back around a foundation can be an expencive lesson. It is very easy to get the front wheels to close to the edge and fall in. That will force the bucket into the basement wall. At the very best, that will cause a hairline crack that water will seep into. Or it could knock the wall over. I have heard of this happening 3 times in my little town over the years and it isn't to often a new house gets built around here.

 

[sawduster98]

Looks like you've been given some good advice from everyone above. I was in the same situation with the same equipment 2yrs ago. You'll get very comfortable with the FEL after a couple hours. The tiller should be a pretty effective counterweight. I found that by throwing a couple bags of seed on mine it was even better. Have fun and go slow!

 

[Post Carbon]

OK, great advice so far ! I do have the operator's manual for both the tractor and the front loader, so I will read those first before I go out to play in the dirt. Thanks for the pointers on not ramming the dirt pile, and to keep everything low. I don't have hills here, but there is a bit of a slope, maybe 5 degrees-ish.

I know the FEL isn't great for snow, but we so seldom get a snowfall here that's more than a fast-melting inch, it's pointless for me to get a blade just for that.

My tires have been loaded--I checked that out--so I do have some ballast there, plus I'll try leaving the tiller on for now for its weight.

The guy at the equipment place taught me how to "float" the bucket down so it rides across the ground, but I think I forgot the technique. It didn't seem to work the same when I tried it here on the place.

PCP

 

[jbrumberg]

PCP- There's probably an "indent spot" point when you move your FEL joystick forward that will put you into "float".

The best teacher is experience.

Use your new tractor often and safely and enjoy the seat time.

 

[teg]

"float" is using the back heal of the bucket to drag backwards to flatten an uneven area, works better with a load of dirt in the bucket The joy stick should lock into place pushing it all the way forward.

 

[LD1]

Heres a good thread for about 3-4hrs of reading:thumbsup:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/221036-worst-things-do-front-end.html

 

[samandmax]

A tooth bar on the bucket will make it much easier for digging into the piles of dirt.

 

[Post Carbon]

Yep, ok, found the little sweet spot for the float. Had to go out there and really push on the joystick.

Spent about 2 hours in the seat, but didn't get too much filled in. I'm staying far back from the edge of the ditch because I don't want to get stuck. My piles are about 3 feet high, so I can't just push them in....

 

[wcampbell47]

So far the guys have given great advice. I'll try to add to that. Use 4wd which will improve the ability of the tractor to push into the material. The FEL is not a bull dozer blade. By that I mean fill the FEL with dirt then move it to the dump area unless it is very close. When pushing dirt resistance builds up fast and the tractor loses traction - starts spinning the tires.

How to load up the FEL. Just prior to pushing into the material shift to low range and 4wd at about 1500 - 1600 rpms or maybe a little less until you get some practice. As the tractor pushes into the material lift the bucket and curl it back toward you. You might try this action with an empty bucket a few times to get the hang of it. On my tractor I pull the joystick back toward me and to the left at the same time. If the bucket is full it may not raise or curl. Just tap the reverse pedal a time or two to ease out of the dirt.

As best you can try to load the same amount of dirt all across the bucket. Too much dirt on one side or the other may make the tractor feel tippy. That is why you want ballast. The 58" tiller should work well - just be mindful that it is back there.

Now you have a full bucket, go fill a hole, come back do it again.

On the right hand side of the bucket you will see some metal about two inches wide. That represents the angle of your bucket. Tilted up toward you means your are not digging. Flat means you are skimming across the ground. Tilted away from you means you are digging.

By lunch tomorrow you will be a pro.

PS: sorry if some of this is repeat ....

 

[k0ua]

Here is something to try, sometimes less is more. Instead of getting a full bucket width and trying to push the whole bucket width in at once, and you have stated you cannot, how about taking a half or even a third of a bucket and just keep the bucket level and push into the ditch. If you can reverse quickly and jog over 2 foot and repeat, you may be able to move more dirt in a given time than trying to take a full bite by just shaving on the edge all the time.. Give it a try.

James K0UA

 

[flusher]

Be careful with your little tractor/FEL. I nearly rolled my 2005 Kubota B7510HST when I was moving excavated dirt around my new house. I had a load in the bucket about 3 ft above ground, backing up, the right front wheel dropped into a tire rut. I dropped the bucket immediately and recovered as the tractor was rolling over. Keep your hand on the FEL joystick while you're moving a load of dirt in the bucket.

If your tractor has 4WD and your using it in 4WD while scooping dirt, be careful when you ram the bucket into the pile. The front wheels have to be able to break traction and spin when the tractor's forward motion goes to zero and the rear wheels have traction and are still driving forward. Otherwise you could damage your 4WD transfer box and other parts of your drive train. That's why it's not recommended to use 4WD when scooping material off a concrete surface like a street or driveway.

Good luck.

 

[miramadar]

When backfilling around a foundation, do it very carefully. Don't try to dump too much dirt in at once. A bucketful of dirt is pretty heavy. And if it hits the foundation walls to hard, you can break something. Also, try to make sure there are no huge rocks that you're dropping in there. I actually did a little damage to my basement wall by trying to "gently" slide a big rock over the edge. Once that thing fell, it flipped over a couple of times, hit some of the dirt below, and smacked into the basement wall HARD.

Using your tiller as ballast is a great idea. A bucket of dirt can really make you light in the rear end! I carry around a 6' box blade that works really well.

Getting the hang of getting a "full" bucket can be hard to do. What I do is hit the pile in 1st gear (slow) with bucket level. As I go into the pile, I rev the motor up to about 2500 rpm as a slowly curl the bucket up...all the while still pushing forward. A toothbar makes this much easier, especially if the piles have hardened a little over time.

 

[Ron JD670]

PCP
One Newbie to another ... CHeck out YouTube
Some of the bits are advertisements and other are really poor quality, but I have gotton some good ideas. There is one of a guy with a NewHolland machine that is pretty good and I got some ideas from. This forum of course is great.
Grading Dirt with New Holland Tractor Using Box Blade and Loader - YouTube

 

[k0ua]

PCP
One Newbie to another ... CHeck out YouTube
Some of the bits are advertisements and other are really poor quality, but I have gotton some good ideas. There is one of a guy with a NewHolland machine that is pretty good and I got some ideas from. This forum of course is great.
Grading Dirt with New Holland Tractor Using Box Blade and Loader - YouTube

The guy in the video is not a bad operator, but I would criticise a couple of things, and I am not a safety policeman, but you should not carry your bucket, especially fast like he was doing up that high. Yes I know he had a small load each time and was in no real danger, but if you get in the habit of running fast with bucket up high, well it will bite you sooner or later. Of course ROPS should have been up and belt on.. I know I know the ground was pretty level and nothing happened, but notice how the tractor bounced quite a bit when he stopped, because he had more dirt in the bucket that time. All I am saying is be careful and watch out and form good habits, because bad things happen quick. There now. badge OFF

James K0UA

 

[Ron JD670]

kOua, PCP, et al
Yea! I watched it again after a sent the message, and saw the stuff I would not try now that I have had a few hours (and almost stupid mistakes) on my JD compact. Both the high bucket and the box scraper on the side hill. Looked like he puckered up on that seat a little. I guess I should (have) also comment that there are some good examples on you tube of what not to do as well. I just keep remembering when I get in a hurry that the machine is alowing me to get more done than I possibly could without it even if I slow down. And my dads voice "do you want to do it right once or practive two or more time" amd "measure twice cut once"
Here is to hoping I do not have to learn very much more by making (dumb) mistakes.

Best wishes