Backhoe Tree Root Cutter Winter Project

[GoodGuy]

Attached is a picture of a plan I've got to build a tree root cutter attachment that will go on the end of my JD47 Backhoe in place of the bucket. I'm posting this to ask for any feedback or ideas you might share with me. My problem is that I've got quite a few stumps to remove & I struggle getting them out because the roots keep hanging me up, so if I can cut the roots then I'd be able to dig around the stump & get it out of the way quicker as well as not having to beat/pound & smash the hoe as much. If anyone has built a similar cutter as to what I'm proposing to do, I sure would like to know any pros or cons. Guys & Gals, take a look at mt sketch & give me some guidance as to what you think....Thanks, Eric

 

[EddieWalker]

I think you got a good idea, just not a practical one.

If the roots are too big for your bucket to cut, then you just go out a little further until you get to a small enough size you can cut.

Also, removing the dirt around the roots makes them allot easier to cut, since there is no protection for them. I wonder if your cutter will really be able to get through a serious sized root.

If you don't have enough power with your bucket, then I question how you'll get a significant increase in cutting ability with the blade.

Even if it works, you still have to come back and dig it up anyway, which means dealling with the roots all over again.

I like to get it done all at once and move on. It might work, and I'd love to see pictures of it in operation, but I have serious doubts as to how effective it will be and if you save any time using it.

Eddie Walker

 

[mopacman]

I have though about this for a long time. I came up with the idea of putting saw teeth on the cutter. Larry

 

[KiotiJohn]

I have to agree with Eddie, not practical. I understand the desire, I just don't think it will work all that well.
Simply starting your digging out where the roots are not as large, and don't have as much grip usually is all that is necessary. I realize you may not want to have to make such a large dig, but I think it will be just about the same even if you cut them first. Either way, you're going to have to get the rest of the roots out after removing the stump, right? John

 

[txdon]

I also need a root cutter to cut the mesquite roots off or pull out when the ground is moist. My idea is to have a "v" shaped piece of metal that would slide on and attach to the bucket teeth so I would have something to grab hold of the root and I could pull it out or pull it till it broke off. If the "v" is sharp it would cut if it was dull it would pull. Of course the size of the root would be limited but It would save jumping on and off the tractor a bit ....Just a thought .... /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

 

[MarkV]

Eric, when the excavation company was digging to install a septic system at our vacation home they used a very similar design to work through rock ledge. It worked well until we got to the solid granite and then had to go to the jack hammer.

Personally I think it will be more functional than some of the others do. With all the power of the back hoe concentrated on the single tooth rather than spread the width of the bucket it should have better root cutting capabilities. I know when I switch to the smaller 12” bucket on my backhoe it is a better stump digger.

MarkV

 

[rswyan]

Eric,

I have planned to build something similar myself but with all the other projects I currently have going I haven't been able to get to it yet. Couple of thoughts:

1. You might consider scalloping the cutting edge so it's serrated. I think having an irregular edge would improve the cutting ability on roots, although this would take a good bit more work to fabricate .... would probably require a mill to do it right.

2. On the tooth attachment to the pin plate - I'd seriously consider adding a couple of angled, welded gussets that go in from the outside of the 10" plate to the ripper tooth to spread out the forces across the entire pin plate. This would make the tooth less prone to twisting itself off the pin plate (although it might transfer those forces elsewhere ... ie the dipperstick)

3. I also wouldn't make the tip so small and pointed - looks like the tooth where it attaches to the pin plate is about 6" and if the scale is accurate the tooh tip is about an inch - I'd make it 2" or 3" instead - and probably make the other end where it attaches to the pin plate the width of the pin plate (8")

 

[Henro]

GoodGuy,

Like others here I also have thought about doing the exact same thing as you are proposing. I think the idea would work. As a matter of fact I want to believe I saw someone selling something similar somewhere on the web in the past.

The biggest shortcoming though, and the reason I will probably not do this sort of thing, is that it would be too much of a pain to keep swapping the bucket and the knife.

My thinking had progressed in line with Txdon's idea of some kind of attachment that could be added to the bucket when needed, that would be easily removable...never got to the point of thinking out how that might be done though.

In the end I have to cast my vote against the dedicated knife idea. I don't think it would be practical, at least not for me. Mainly because of the time and trouble involved with swapping things.

 

[jmc]

Eric,
I think you ought to build it because it will concentrate all your force on one spot of the root and not the dirt around the root. That said, the sharpened edge will make it advance thru the dirt better but I doubt if it it will be sharp enough to really cut wood too deep. And even if it is very sharp, it won't be for long, especially if you don't harden it. But unless you're working close to the stump, just breaking the root is good enough.

If you really want to cut the root, take mopacman's suggestion of using teeth instead of and edge. Make them cut on the upstroke and the combination of pulling toward you while lifting the ripper should make short work of it. Again, if you're not going to harden it you should use hardened inserts for the teeth, and think about resharpening.

Looking at the blade from the side, I would make it as wide and strong as possible that still will penetrate the ground. Also, the inside curved cutting edge could proabably be straight since you can curl the blade.

That's a great project and we're hoping to see how it works.

John

 

[SteveV]

You might want to take a look at the attached picture on this post. I Love Pine Stumps
SteveV /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[markct]

i have seen a device just like that on fullsize excavators a few times, they use them for landclearing, no reason it wouldnt work on a small backhoe only for smaller roots

 

[GoodGuy]

Mopacman...
I thought about putting some sort of insert over the edge of my bucket (see attached pic) to act as a cutter but thought I'd still have the problem of a 12" bucket taking too much "bite" & the 47 hoe not having the power to pull/cut the root. The whole idea behind my thought has been to eliminate going out 4 feet from the stump & working my way back in. I've spent up to 5 hours on some stumps & really would like to make this process easier. Thanks, Eric

 

[GoodGuy]

Mark....
Would like to see any pics or links if you have them.
Thanks, Eric

 

[GoodGuy]

Steve.....
Son of a Gun, I searched & searched on TBN to find anything with no luck. That is very close to what I'm talking about so please tell us more, please, please. Henro's comment about time to change this has bugged me as well so is it going to be a pain for me or is it fairly easy ??
Eric

 

[SteveV]

Changing the bucket is less than a 5 minute affair, made easier with a drift pin and a hammer. The one inch bucket is made from some 1/2 inch heavy truck frame, doubled up. Steel was perloined from the dumpster at the local truck builder. The truck frame has the bends already in it for the attachment to the dipper stick. Weight of the final assembly is not so bad to pickup by hand to be attached. You'll need basic fabrication: cut, drill holes greater than 1/2 inch, decent welder and a torch to cut the profiles.
I used the tooth for stone wall building; moving rocks from a pile is difficult with the wide bucket. It is a hydraulically powered quarryman's bar with very impressive capability for anyone that has used a hand bar. It lets you pull roots one at a time and break ones that a 12 in bucket can only dream of. The advantage comes from sliding the root up close to the attachment pins and using the end of the tooth to pry against (boom up,dipper retract, and bucket open seems to be the magic formula). The sides of a regular dirt bucket make this difficult. SteveV /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[RonR]

I agree with Henro!

I'd want it so I could attach it with pins or at most 2 bolts, while still leaving the bucket on. That way, I could rip roots and quickly take it off to use the bucket.

Spending 5 minutes every time I wanted to take it on/off would get old for me......... I'd think I would be needing first one, then the other all the time.

My two cents.
Ron

 

[GoodGuy]

Steve....
Thanks for info, I didn't think of truck frame so I appreciate that tip. Could you give me some specifics on the tooth; how long, how thick, do you have a cutting edge or is it flat ?? If you could make any changes, what would they be ?? I planned on welding gussets & support bracing & I cannot see the picture real good therefore can't tell if you have added these, did you ?? You say that you can change this in 5 minutes, I can live with that but I really didn't want to make this a hassle to make the change; it sure would be great if someone made a quick change system, eh ?? Your thoughts on txdon's suggestion of a "v" setup attached to the teeth ?? Appreciate your help !! Eric

 

[SteveV]

Yea, I knew a lot of areas of the country wouldn't understand the purpose of a one inch bucket. You see, we have rock, with entwined tree stumps and a top dressing of composted leaves. Moving dirt is kind of like frosting a cake, most of the serious work has already been done. Nesting the rock to get a flat surface took a lot more effort. A quarryman's bar in Kansas might be used to tamp fence posts? In other words, you probably wouldn't need one of the one inch buckets. I have 40 or 50 hours of prying rolling and setting of rock with this device. my hoe is too small for hardwood stumps, hence the reply agreeing with pine stumps; probably changed to bucket twice in that time. SteveV /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[GoodGuy]

Steve....
Sounds like you & I have similar ground. Take a look at the attached pic & you'll see roots are tangled with rock & soil. What I didn't say earlier was that a lot of the time I would try & get under the root with my hoe bucket but wouldn't be able to because the rock would hold me up. Eric

 

[kevinro]

Being a guy who lives in the trees, I get to see a lot of tree roots and machines that can rip them up. With all due respect to our skeptical friends, you have a fine idea going here. If you want, you can see if you can purchase one.

You are describing a gadget called a ripper tooth. They are pretty common in WA state, since if it ain't a rock, its got a tree growing on it.

AMI Ripper tooth

I haven't seen one on machines our size, but the working theory is the same. These are made for mini-excavators, so they are probably available or easily modified.

Kevin