Climate Change Discussion

[K7147]

To be brutally honest, I suppose I'd try to "enlighten" you, knowing full well that whatever I write here isn't going to change any opinions you already have.

The intention for my post was to raise awareness a bit - maybe there are some members here who haven't really thought about it one way or another. I suppose I also want some physcological reasurrance that I'm not turning into a nutcase - that other regular tractor folks are concerned as well.

I would like to understand your statement "you should NOT be concerned about running out of fossil fuel". At a macro level, I think most would agree that we are probably consuming fossil fuel faster than the earth is creating more. The question is really when are we going to run out? 10 years, 50, 10,000? For the last 20 years "they" have been predicting that the end is near - it does sound like a "Sky is falling" story. Every time I've stopped at the gas station, I'm able to fill up...

Hazmat!

Your “green” actions are commendable and many others follow suit so you can rest assured that some other tractor folk are as concerned. That said, you may well be turning into a “nutcase” if you think that an application of logic and enlightenment will stick to the Teflon surfaces of those with a closed mind.

Did I ever explain my theory of infinity to you?

Ken

 

[TCowner]

Global warming seems to be on everyone's mind these days but the truth be told is that with the exception of the few us that enjoy winter and love the snow, most don't. In Southeastern Minnesota a "typical" January would involve about three spells of 20-30 below nights with highs of 10-15 below for five to seven straight days. ANd of course you would add a 25-35 mph NW wind dropping windchills to around 80-90 below range. Agains about three of these episodes just in the month of January.

SO the reality nobody, except me cause I love winter, wants a return to those days. Most talk tough and it sound really cool to talk about removing all of the humvees from the road and inserting the hybrids but if you really asked 95% of the U.S. population to tell the truth they would say, bring on global warming.

As a winter lover I hope its just a cycle but I am worried a bit. I hope I live long enough for the next ice age. Because if I do I will have an excuse to get a new tractor with a factory installed quiet and warm cab. But I say bring back the days of brutal wind chills. It the best way I know to keep the fire ants and killer bees in Texas.

 

[N80]

You are what you read.

That thought seems to be about a hundred years too old! Maybe it should say: You are what you watch (on TV).

 

[Tig]

We don't make wine from the wild grapes but during a dry summer they make great jelly. We have vineyards where we grow grape for make wine. As for tropical plants in North America? Could you post I link so I can check this out? Continental drift could be one explanation.
From the link you posted, the biggest flaw in their stance that this is a purely natural phenomena is; "Singer and Avery note the studies also show that temperature changes preceded the CO2 changes by about 800 years."
Right now CO2 levels are 27% higher than at any time in the past 650,000 years. That is not the result of the last 800 year warming cycle. See the link in my previous post.
It's not hard to find more credible sources to disprove the substance of the link you posted.
In the antartic the Müller Ice Shelf is gone (melted) after 16,000 years. (that would be 11 natural warming/cooling cycles) An interesting observation that cotradicts the authors statements about us being safe because of "the melt-resistant Antarctic.".
NASA has "their minds made up". EO News: Study Shows Potential for Antarctic Climate Change - October 6, 2004
What happens when me melt the ice? How the antartic regulates climate around the globe. Climate Change Position Statement
Time will tell how this all plays out.

 

[k6dyc]

[tongue firmly planted in cheek] Should I sell my diesel Excursion (I think the biggest SUV available) and my F350 Powerstroke and my AM General Hummer H1 and my Bobcat because of their contribution to global warming? Maybe we should all sell our tractors and start posting at HorseDrawnPlowsByNet.com.

Seriously, at least the conversation is polite here, but I think I'll pass on this discussion and go back and read Eddie's lake creation thread again, it's more on topic for this forum and I enjoy it MUCH more!

 

[Egon]

Eddie:
There are some problems with grapes freezing in Canada. Ice wine requires frozen grapes and there are times the freeze does not come soon enough for the vineyard.

Backyard grapes in the picture.

 

[thingy]

Global warming,,new yuppy catch phrase,,,is it a bad thing if the globe warms up a little? no,,,its not,,,how much is the worst gluom and doom sayers saying,,5 degrees?People in 1/3 of the world would welcome global warming. The vikings settled greenland,,and called it greenland what,,5-600 years ago?,,than we had global cooling and run them off it??something like that,,they didn't have coal power plants than and cars,,,,the dinasors lived in alaska,,they have found mastadones,[big hairy elephants],,frozen with flowers in their mouth,in alaska,,[musta been quick huh?],,than theres that ice age thing that came and went,and made ohio level,,,,,,point is,,we don't know whats happening now but theres a good chance its happened before,,and besides,there ain't a **** thing we can do about it anyways. thats my view,,,,don't worry,,be happy,,,,thingy

 

[EddieWalker]

Eddie:
There are some problems with grapes freezing in Canada. Ice wine requires frozen grapes and there are times the freeze does not come soon enough for the vineyard.

Backyard grapes in the picture.

Egon,

Sorry, I should not have replied to your comment on grapes in Canada. It has no bearing on my earlier post about wine grapes in England 2,000 years ago.

When the Romans grew wine grapes, the weather in England was much warmer. I have no idea if wine grapes could grow in Canada 2,000 years ago.

What I found interesting about this is that they "DID" grow in a place when the planet was warmer thousands of years ago, and today when we're supposedely worred about global warming, they will not grow there because it's not warm enough.

How much warmer will this natural warming cycle have to raise the tempature of the planet until it's warm enough for wine grapes to grow in England?

Eddie

 

[AndyM]

[tongue firmly planted in cheek]Maybe we should all sell our tractors and start posting at HorseDrawnPlowsByNet.com.

No, it's not HorseDrawnPlowsByNet.com, it's just plain HorsesByNet.com

 

[LMTC]

Hazmat!

Your “green” actions are commendable and many others follow suit so you can rest assured that some other tractor folk are as concerned. That said, you may well be turning into a “nutcase” if you think that an application of logic and enlightenment will stick to the Teflon surfaces of those with a closed mind.

Did I ever explain my theory of infinity to you?

Ken

So only your side of the discussion possesses logic and enlightenment?

Isn't it interesting which side of the "discussion" keeps tossing demeaning remarks at anyone disagreeing with their position? If you don't agree with them you have a closed mind, need enlightenment, or you "see any difference of opinion as an attack of their lifestyle or birthrights." (not sure where the poster pulled that one out of)
I do not accuse them of needing enlightenment, or having closed minds, regarding their belief that GW is an issue....my only, and consistent, criticism has been of this attitude of superiority, this unwillingness to accept that some others do not think GW is a valid issue. Wow, what a tolerant lot.