Dog vs. cat vs. cops

[Gator6x4]

Valid point Roy about not having time to "AIM" a firearm in an emergency situation. While you are trying to aim and the other person is shooting and the bullets are whistling by, the stress level goes out the roof further affecting ones ability to effectively bring fire on the target. A nine millimeter round in the flesh part of the body will penetrate and exit. If the rounds hits bone it will mushroom and stop, most times. NOT KNOCKING concealed carry just saying, I hope I am never in the area when someone with a concealed carry decides it is time to start shooting.

Now about your ten foot target. I know some people who I would not want shooting at me from the hip at fifty foot. I also know a gentleman who given the proper rifle, properly equipped I don't want shooting at me from a mile away.

 

[Car Doc]

I hope I am never in the area when someone with a concealed carry decides it is time to start shooting.

I feel the same way about that about most of the people I run into at the range lots of them scare me with their ideas and techniques.

On the other hand most of the guys I shoot with at our monthly IDPA matches I would want most of them watching my back and visaversa. There is a lot to be said about training and practice and maybe the occasional pit bull etc thats acting up to get a shot off at accurately.

 

[dave1949]

Most reasonable folks aren't going to fire a weapon in a populated area unless it's an emergency of some sort (and to this lady, that was an emergency...and I'd have done the same thing if I was in her place).
Otherwise, your attitude is typical leftwing "guns are evil".

What sort of logic is that Roy? It leads to the conclusion that any reasonable person using a firearm in a populated area was having an 'emergency' by their own definition and is therefore beyond reproach.

You, I, or the lady, are not who ultimately decides if it was an emergency. There are laws, DA's, judges and juries for that; and they were put in place by law-abiding voters in legal elections.

If you read the thread with comprehension, you might conclude my goal is to speak against gun violence, which I believe has deep roots within our culture. Somehow, we have come to embrace a 'gun culture', for lack of a better term. Innocent people are dying or maimed on a daily basis because of this culture. I don't believe guns are evil, I do believe we have some gun-related nonsensical myths within our culture that result in very sad things happening.

Gun culture proponents say we should stop blaming law-abiding gun owners for what criminals do with guns. Well, this lady broke a gun law, which removes her from the law-abiding class of gun owners. Yet, you are unwilling to admit to any guilt on her part, or the fact that she had other non-gun options. I could reach the conclusion that there is no gun law you would not find fault with, or be willing to ignore, in order to maintain the gun culture you are emotionally invested in.

Dave.

 

[Sigarms]

There is a lot to be said about training and practice and maybe the occasional pit bull etc thats acting up to get a shot off at accurately.

Some people I shoot with say I'm a decent shot. One time when I was out by the shed (aways from the house) my wife came out with a couple of our dogs. I got to tell you, one took me by surprise at how fast she came at me, and I remember thinking to myself that it would of been a bugger to try to hit her with a sidearm.

 

[RoyJackson]

What sort of logic is that Roy? It leads to the conclusion that any reasonable person using a firearm in a populated area was having an 'emergency' by their own definition and is therefore beyond reproach.

That's exactly right...any person can use self defense when they consider themselves in imminent danger.
BTW, if one does carry a self defense weapon, they do want to know the laws of their town and state.

You, I, or the lady, are not who ultimately decides if it was an emergency. There are laws, DA's, judges and juries for that; and they were put in place by law-abiding voters in legal elections.

That's also exactly right...even if it turns out to be justified (as it was in this case since the DA dropped the charges), a person acting in self defense of themselves or in defense of another will likely be arrested until things are sorted out. They may even be charged and a jury will decide.

If you read the thread with comprehension, you might conclude my goal is to speak against gun violence, which I believe has deep roots within our culture. Somehow, we have come to embrace a 'gun culture', for lack of a better term. Innocent people are dying or maimed on a daily basis because of this culture. I don't believe guns are evil, I do believe we have some gun-related nonsensical myths within our culture that result in very sad things happening.

Gun culture proponents say we should stop blaming law-abiding gun owners for what criminals do with guns. Well, this lady broke a gun law, which removes her from the law-abiding class of gun owners. Yet, you are unwilling to admit to any guilt on her part, or the fact that she had other non-gun options. I could reach the conclusion that there is no gun law you would not find fault with, or be willing to ignore, in order to maintain the gun culture you are emotionally invested in.

Dave.

See..."gun culture"...that phrase defines your whole post. It also defines most of the anti-rights radicals.
We all abhor violence...but you (and those anti-rights groups) focus upon the tool used rather then the perpetrator. You're not against violence, you're against guns. Well, if you don't like guns...no problem, don't own one. But don't even try to impede my (and millions of American's) rights.

 

[Car Doc]

Some people I shoot with say I'm a decent shot. One time when I was out by the shed (aways from the house) my wife came out with a couple of our dogs. I got to tell you, one took me by surprise at how fast she came at me, and I remember thinking to myself that it would of been a bugger to try to hit her with a sidearm.

I agree totally I would not want to be in that situation. This topic just came up last weekend I was talking to a friend and he is the training lieutenant for the city PD and he said he was doing some real close quarters low and fast moving target training for this exact reason.

They have quite a few dog attacks and have had their share they had to shoot or get chewed to pieces and there isn't that many one shot kills mostly legs backs noses rarely a dead animal on the first shot dogs on the move and up close are hard to hit I believe it.

 

[Car Doc]

You, I, or the lady, are not who ultimately decides if it was an emergency. There are laws, DA's, judges and juries for that; and they were put in place by law-abiding voters in legal elections.



Gun culture proponents say we should stop blaming law-abiding gun owners for what criminals do with guns.

Dave.

Dave,

I am taking something out of context I realize but remember this about law enforcement they are only minutes away when seconds count.

And on the second part there guns dont kill people stupid people do.

 

[dave1949]

See..."gun culture"...that phrase defines your whole post. It also defines most of the anti-rights radicals.
We all abhor violence...but you (and those anti-rights groups) focus upon the tool used rather then the perpetrator. You're not against violence, you're against guns. Well, if you don't like guns...no problem, don't own one. But don't even try to impede my (and millions of American's) rights.

Let see, I say I am against the violence that follows from our gun culture, you say I'm against guns. Brilliant. You have been paying too much attention to your signature. :laughing: We are not even discussing the same topic and you are foaming at the mouth.

You never did answer my simple question; what if the bullet glanced off the dog's skull and injured someone? Your only answer so far, is to label me left-wing, anti-rights and radical. If you don't know something, it's not my fault.
Dave.

 

[RoyJackson]

Let see, I say I am against the violence that follows from our gun culture, you say I'm against guns. Brilliant. You have been paying too much attention to your signature. :laughing: We are not even discussing the same topic and you are foaming at the mouth.

You never did answer my simple question; what if the bullet glanced off the dog's skull and injured someone? Your only answer so far, is to label me left-wing, anti-rights and radical. If you don't know something, it's not my fault.
Dave.

Ok...the round ricochets of the dog's skull (or any other surface). Then the shooter could be charged with assault or manslaughter...or it could be considered an accident.
"What if's" are highly speculative and one cannot answer such a speculative question...only provide an opinion.

I don't foam at the mouth. I'm a very logical man. No violence follows the "gun culture" (is there actually a "gun" culture?). Violence follows folks who find it easier to commit crimes against others rather then earn a living.

 

[Sigarms]

You never did answer my simple question; what if the bullet glanced off the dog's skull and injured someone? Your only answer so far, is to label me left-wing, anti-rights and radical. If you don't know something, it's not my fault.
Dave.

I happen to agree with you. The fact is it would seem apparent that the cat was already dead and the lady shot because she was pissed off. I'm not saying she didn't have a right to do so, but it was kind of stupid due to the chance of a misplaced bullet (am I correct in thinking this was a "residential" neighborhood?). What was dumber was the dog owner not hightailing it off the property when the lady went into the house.