Dump Trailer

[Iplayfarmer]

... a hand held grinder with a wire brush attachment...

I do have one of those.

How "clean" does the metal have to be? I've heard the old timers quip about how you need some rust on the metal to give the paint something to stick to. I'm a converted wood guy, so I'm used to roughing up a wood surface with 00 steel wool or 100 grit sand paper to give the varnish something to hold on to. Is there something analogous in metal working?

 

[gemini5362]

I do have one of those.

How "clean" does the metal have to be? I've heard the old timers quip about how you need some rust on the metal to give the paint something to stick to. I'm a converted wood guy, so I'm used to roughing up a wood surface with 00 steel wool or 100 grit sand paper to give the varnish something to hold on to. Is there something analogous in metal working?

rustoleum claims it can be painted over rust. If you get the rust off with a wire brush then paint it with that should be ok

 

[john_bud]

I do have one of those.

How "clean" does the metal have to be? I've heard the old timers quip about how you need some rust on the metal to give the paint something to stick to. I'm a converted wood guy, so I'm used to roughing up a wood surface with 00 steel wool or 100 grit sand paper to give the varnish something to hold on to. Is there something analogous in metal working?

Gulp! Paint over rust - them old guys, were they sitting at the bar from sun up to closing time before you got that that "sage" advice?

In case you're wondering, go find some rusty iron and see how hard it is to peel off a flec of rust. Pretty easy. It's still pretty easy after it's painted.


You asked for the "best method", that is sand blasting. As you don't have a blaster, strip it down to the bare frame (no axles) and haul it to a sand blasting place. Tell them to do it at the end of a big job - don't have them set up just for you. Give them 7-10 days to do the blasting. Have them prime it for you with a good etching epoxy primer. Heck, they can probably color coat it for you too. I would expect blasting, prime and color coat to be in the $50 to $100 range.

If you tag onto a bigger job and just accept what ever color - it can be pretty cheap.

Oh, I was thinking that it could be 8-10" longer behind the axle.

jb

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Disassembly is a given. I've got a friend at work that tells me you always build something twice ... Once when you fab it and once after you paint it.

I have considered having somebody else do the prep and paint job. I'm still thinking. It has become part of the experience to scrap and scrounge to keep costs down.

 

[john_bud]

Well, think on this. You will spend an hour or more on wire cleaning the unit, then still have to sand it by hand to get a good tooth for the paint to stick to. Then buy a qt of primer, and a qt of color. Materials costs are probably close to the cost of having it done.

jb

 

[Iplayfarmer]

I'm still thinking through the do it yourself vs. hiring out for the paint job. I priced out rattle cans just as a base line to start from. I'm going to be painting about 80 square feet of metal when all is said and done. I figure this will cost about $60 for primer and top coat. I based that on 15 square feet per can that I found on the Rustoleum website and on the cost of paint at my local hardware store...$5.08/can after tax.

I figure if I can get someone to do the paint for $60 I will jump at it. I have a smaller air paint sprayer, and I might be able to do the job cheaper buying larger containers of paint, but if someone will do the prep, prime, and paint for the cost of rattle cans, I'm there. I've still got some time to think it over. I'm probably only half done with the fabrication.

Also, I'm posting a scan of some sketches I've done for the sides. I've decided to make the sides removable just in case. The stake pockets are out of the same 2" tubing that I made the cylinder brackets out of. I'm also putting 3" section of this tubing at the top of each upright to act as stake pockets for the side extensions when I get them built.

Take a look at the tailgate latch design. I wanted a system to allow the tailgate to pivot at the top like a dump truck tailgate or pivot at the bottom like a pickup truck tailgate. I also wanted one handed operation. My wife came up with the system I sketched out. She claims it wasn't her idea, but she was the only one in the truck talking to me about it, and I didn't come up with it, so I'm blaming her. It's actually a pretty elegant design. I just hope it works.

The things sticking out of the top of the tailgate are 3/4" pins. One on each side of the top and one on each side of the bottom. Each side wall of the trailer will have three "Hooks" welded to the back as illustrated in the attached sketch. When I want the tailgate to swing, I put the top pins in the top hooks and the bottom pins swing freely. When I want the tailgate to open and shut like a pickup bed, I put the bottom pins in the bottom hooks and the top pins in the second hooks down from the top. The bottom hooks have a little bit longer slot so that I can lift the tailgate to pull it out of the top hooks without it coming loose from the bottom slot. When the tailgate is down, the bottom pins rest in the same bottom slot, and a cable or chain keeps the tailgate horizontal, parallel to the ground.

 

[MrJimi]

Get a gallon of you favorite color in rustoleoum and brush paint it and be done with it !
Jim

 

[Defective]

I based that on 15 square feet per can that I found on the Rustoleum website

Don't bet on it...

That figure is based on a large, flat test surface and no air currents while the robot sprayed a perfect, even coat of paint.

You're more likely to cover about half that area with a rattle can. (Or any spray method...)

If you end up painting it yourself, either brush & roll it or plan on a lot more paint.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Get a gallon of you favorite color in rustoleoum and brush paint it and be done with it !
Jim

I like your style. After looking at the welds I've done and some of the "in-situ" engineering, you can conclude that this is not a factory quality product. It probably doesn't need a factory quality finish on it either. The main reason that I'm painting it is to protect the metal.

I'll have to price gallons of rustoleum. If I can get it cheap enough, I may go the route you suggest.

I'm still of a mind, though that if I can have it painted professionally for even close to the cost of the materials, I'm having it done professionally.

 

[KentT]

You'd likely be surprised at how good a paint job you can get with a quality, low-nap roller, if you're careful... use a small brush to trim it in first, then roll the open spots.

I've seen some old farm equipment painted that way that from 10' away you'd think is was a spray-gun job...

I'd recommend that over spray-cans. They simply put on too thin a coat of paint -- when you're interested in protection and durability.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Is the brush on/roll on painting a single coat application? Do you brush on the primer too?

 

[Renze]

I repainted and totally overhauled a muck spreader 3 years ago. I wire brushed it first to remove all loose rust, then applied 2 layers of RAL 3009 zinc-phosphate primer and painted it in the original colour, RAL 3000 fire red.
Even though i dont clean it as often because i use it all year round, whenever a field is cut or grazed, but even in this very corrosive environment, the paint holds very well on wire brushed steel.

Last winter i rebuilt a 2 ton tandem car trailer for my brother. With just wire brushing i got very nice results, the paint job looks automotive. I just blasted some loads of thick primer and colour paint on it, then put on a shiny finish by spraying a very thin layer of extra thinned paint. the result was a heavy coat of paint with no seepers, with a very shiny finish.

I usually apply wet-on-wet, which means spraying the next layer of paint within about an hour, so that the paint is dry enough to stay in place, but there is no dried skin on the paint yet.
If you spray over a dried skin when the paint under that skin isnt dry enough, either the skin is going to wrinkle like a sweaty d*ck or areas of the skin of paint just sinks down....

 

[AllWaysBreakinSomething]

It is a dump trailer and will get scratched. So a perfect paint job is like driving a new truck to load gravel..

Sandblasting is cheap and easy with a pressure washer with a sandblasting wand. It does more than any air compressor sandblaster I've ever seen. Awesome and the wand is not that expensive. You may be able to rent and will not take you but about an hour.

Definitely use primer and make sure the metal is dry. I mean no moisture in the metal. Don't paint in the sun. Make sure the metal is close to 76 degrees but not over 80 degrees. Also the room or outside air should be about the same. I prefer to paint indoors as bugs like the odors. I like to spray several times for a thick coat. Wait at least 4hrs between coats so they harden and spray again. I would spray a few times to get a thick coat.

If you plan to brush just by the spray primer. It does the job.
Also use foam brushes and do not go back touching up until dry. Paint small areas completely and move out from there. This will leave less brush marks etc.

Hope this helps... If you really want some hard paint use the industrial yellow from CAT or equivalent. That stuff is strong.

Again I wouldn't spend a lot on the paint either. You can always touchup. I do this all the time with my tractor underbody. Noone ever knows it isn't original.


Oh! Cool project and very well documented. I like the pictures along with your progress.

My guess is those lawnmower axles are rated at less than 1000lbs each. I would however check the tire rating. Should in the writing close to the rim. You may have a limit there. Those tires are usually not very thick.

Good Luck

 

[KentT]

Is the brush on/roll on painting a single coat application? Do you brush on the primer too?

Yes, you can brush or roll on the primer too... or you can spray it.

One coat of paint, rolled or brushed on will usually cover.

I'd suggest you get the shortest nap rollers you can find -- and narrower ones, not the 12" ones. That way you can "control it" much better. I have one that is 4" wide or thereabouts.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Thanks for all the responses. Keep them coming. I'm finding my life filling up with other things, and I need to keep motivated to get through this project. I am having a blast building this. It's the first project of this type and magnitude that I've built. It's challenging me, but it sure is fun.

I'm glad I'm posting here too. If nothing else I feel motivated to spend at least a little time whenever I can because I owe it to the forum to show some progress.

Tonight I cut out one set of "stake pockets". It took me about two hours to cut 11 three inch sections of 2" tubing with 1/8" wall. I'll need to cut out another set of 11 to ring the top of the side rails.

Milwaukee sent me an "Ice Edge" sawzall blade in the mail the other day. It cuts like a hot knife through butter, but I got a little carried away early on today and dulled it. Now it cuts like a butter knife through steak. I cut out the second half of the sections with my trusty angle grinder and a skinny wheel.

I looked this past weekend for some more of this blade, but Lowes said that it was a new blade and they wouldn't have any in for 6 months or so. I think that's bogus and someone was just due for a coffee break. I see that Amazon has them. I'd rather not wait for them to ship. I'll probably go to my local hardware store that never fails me and look for them there. If they don't have any, I'll order them from Amazon.com

 

[Iplayfarmer]

I'm back to fabrication now. I went to my local hardware store, and though they didn't have a Milwaukee 'Ice Edge" blade, they did have another brand of demolition blade. It wasn't quite as good as that ice edge blade, but it worked faster than waiting for shipping from Amazon.com.

I got the pockets all cut out. There are 22 in all. I've attached pictures of the stakes set loosely in place to give an idea how this whole thing is going to look. The stake pockets are just tacked on for now until I get the frames of the bed sides all fabbed up. I already had to take the first two off. I forgot that I was going to drill a 1/4" hole in each pocket to allow for bolting the sides to the base. It was a whole lot easier to just break the tack welds and drill them on my drill press rather than try to drill them in place.

 

[AllWaysBreakinSomething]

Iplayfarmer,
I used a discarded feon container for my hydraulic fluid on my log splitter (not too small or too big). It's the only thing I could find in a container that wasn't dangerous to weld on. Make sure to use wire welder as it's thin.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Iplayfarmer,
I used a discarded feon container for my hydraulic fluid on my log splitter (not too small or too big). It's the only thing I could find in a container that wasn't dangerous to weld on. Make sure to use wire welder as it's thin.

I think the small tank that came with the hydraulic pump is going to be good enough. Since I'm using a dual acting cylinder the actual displacement of fluid is pretty minimal.

The one thing about it, though, is that it didn't have a cap when I bought it. I got a regular old pipe plug for it, and I hear it "hissing" now when I actuate the cylinder. I will probably get some kind of vented cap for it eventually.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

I've got meetings tonight, and I'm taking my son camping tomorrow night. I probably won't post much progress until later on Saturday.

In the mean time keep any comments and suggestions coming.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

I got the side frames welded today.