Electric vehicles during a disaster

[deserteagle71]

Do not fear; there will be revenue collected from vehicle owners for road maintenance!

Many different ways to do it.

Yup. Nevada is already mandating reporting the odometer reading of a vehicle when the registration is renewed, collecting mileage data. We all know where that is leading - a "per mile" tax.

 

[bdhsfz6]

Yup. Nevada is already mandating reporting the odometer reading of a vehicle when the registration is renewed, collecting mileage data. We all know where that is leading - a "per mile" tax.

Pennsylvania has been doing this for many years and so far, have not instituted a per mile tax. Mileage reporting is on the honor system with no way to verify. Garages who do state inspections have no way of knowing the mileage you report and do not submit the odometer reading to the state.

This could change in the future but so far, there are no "odometer cops" on the scene yet.

 

[cqaigy2]

As far back as i can remember Washington state has had a honor system mileage reporting too on when registering. I thought it was more of a fraud reduction attempt. So for instance car A sold and mileage was reported to be 1000, car A sells and when it's reregistered, it's mileage was reported to be 500.

 

[cqaigy2]

Back when I lived in Pennsylvania the 55 mph speed limit wasn't much of a burden. The way the roads twist and wind around all the hills, many places you can't even drive 55. And there's a town every few miles and a city generally within 50 miles. So no need to travel any real distance. But out here in Nevada and other western states with wide open spaces the 55 mph speed limit was a real burden. Many roads are straight and level; you can see for miles down the road and traffic is light. But cities are many miles apart. It is 520 miles between Reno and Salt Lake City, with only 4 small towns in between them. Case in point - this past Monday I had to travel to Reno to see an ophthalmologist. That put 402 miles on my truck's odometer that day, but that was the closest ophthalmologist to me. Can't even imagine having to drive that at 55.

So a speed limit that works for one area doesn't necessarily make sense for another area. And why an EV makes a lot of sense some places but not so much in others.

Easy, you just put the car in auto mode and either sleep or take care of business. It's not so bad going from 60MPH to 80 or more, but when you've been driving for hours at 90MPH and all of a sudden hit, yet another accident/road work etc, it feels like you could just step out of your car and trot along side it.

 

[Joel/ak]

My brother just ordered a electric Silverado. Each to their own I guess.

Curious to see how it does.

Not gonna start building them til next august and by then the gen 3 battery will be out.

 

[oosik]

Electric vehicles during a disaster. You mean kind of like right now. Folks in CA told to not charge their EV's because of the extreme heat. They are being told - "buy" but don't recharge.

I fear this entire EV situation will go over like a fart in church.

Hey - sure I will loan you my Tesla. BTW - it has the self driving feature - enjoy.

 

[RoyJackson]

Electric vehicles during a disaster. You mean kind of like right now. Folks in CA told to not charge their EV's because of the extreme heat. They are being told - "buy" but don't recharge.

I fear this entire EV situation will go over like a fart in church.

Hey - sure I will loan you my Tesla. BTW - it has the self driving feature - enjoy.

Yep, what's going on in CA is definitely going to be a wake-up call

 

[oosik]

Doofy - I can just see you in an EV - middle of the winter - trying to make it all the way to Palmer to recharge.

NOT A PLEASANT THOUGHT. No, until things improve a whole lot - EV's will not be the "WAY" for the majority.

 

[Egon]

Don’t get too carried away about power supply. The distribution grid is old and needs updating. It’s designed around large generating stations meaning power loss in transmission. With wind and solar in numerous locations fewer line losses
Different ways to more effectively use power will be developed. Note all the city building lights on all night to stabilize the grid. Use of off peak power for thermal heating storage might happen.

 

[ponytug]

Electric vehicles during a disaster. You mean kind of like right now. Folks in CA told to not charge their EV's because of the extreme heat. They are being told - "buy" but don't recharge.

I fear this entire EV situation will go over like a fart in church.

Hey - sure I will loan you my Tesla. BTW - it has the self driving feature - enjoy.

Just to clarify, the actual request was not to charge electric vehicles during peak demand times, e.g. 5-8pm. As indicated elsewhere electric vehicle owners tend to charge whenever the rates are at the lowest, I.e. the middle of the night. I can't recall ever having charged during peak times.

Bottom line: this was a non-issue for electric vehicle owners.

We made a chunk of change last night exporting power from our batteries to the grid because of the high demand. ($2.k/Wh) I expect this sort of export in times of grid need to become more common with increasing home battery installations, and more electric vehicles that have bidirectional chargers that can export power. Of course, with time, I expect the price to drop a little, but not much. The price paid was the spot price for power last night.

All the best,

Peter

 

[bnold]

Just to clarify, the actual request was not to charge electric vehicles during peak demand times, e.g. 5-8pm. As indicated elsewhere electric vehicle owners tend to charge whenever the rates are at the lowest, I.e. the middle of the night. I can't recall ever having charged during peak times.

Bottom line: this was a non-issue for electric vehicle owners.

We made a chunk of change last night exporting power from our batteries to the grid because of the high demand. ($2.k/Wh) I expect this sort of export in times of grid need to become more common with increasing home battery installations, and more electric vehicles that have bidirectional chargers that can export power. Of course, with time, I expect the price to drop a little, but not much. The price paid was the spot price for power last night.

All the best,

Peter

Peter, don’t you dare pull this group’s sound byte away. “California said don’t charge EVs.” You have to eliminate the rest of the information for better click bait.

The times I’ve needed to charge during peak are slim to never.

Very cool on the $2/kwh

Crossed 30,000miles this am on the EV, will hit 40k miles in the 1st year of ownership. Never a public charger, never ran out of charge. I must be doing it wrong with all these problems out there.

 

[lman]

Around here as far as I know there is no peak/off peak electric rates. Maybe in town.

 

[Fuddyduddy1952]

Someone double check my math. This is what would happen if we transitioned from ice to EVs. In other words, all ice vehicles replaced with electric. Of course this doesn't include tractors, heavy equipment, mowers, etc. Just cars & trucks AND at present usage. In the future of course (2035?) numbers would be higher.

EVs consume an average of 0.35 kilowatt-hours (kWh) per mile driven (cars).
290.8 million registered vehicles in USA in 2022
Average yearly miles driven 14,263 miles
Electricity usage in USA 3,995 TWh (in 2021)
(1TWh=1billion kWh)
1,451,688,140,000 kWh (USA vehicles miles driven average rate times average electric power consumption...cars only.
Therefore = 1,451 TWh at CAR rate: however, if you factor in truck usage which is 1.89 kWh/mile.
Of the 290.8 million vehicles registered in USA, 156 million are trucks!
So...back to the drawing board!
134.8 million cars+156 million trucks
134,800,000 at (.35×14,263)=4,992.05 kWh
156,000,000 at (1.89×14,263)=26,957.07 kWh
Cars: 672,928,340,000 kWh
Trucks: 4,205,302,920,000 kWh
Total: 4,878,231,260,000 kWh
Total: 4,878.23126 TWh
Therefore grid system would have to be more than doubled to meet demand.

 

[oosik]

Peak vs off-peak electric rates. That must be a feature in larger urban areas. Here - it's the same 24/7/365.

 

[bnold]

Someone double check my math. This is what would happen if we transitioned from ice to EVs. In other words, all ice vehicles replaced with electric. Of course this doesn't include tractors, heavy equipment, mowers, etc. Just cars & trucks AND at present usage. In the future of course (2035?) numbers would be higher.

EVs consume an average of 0.35 kilowatt-hours (kWh) per mile driven (cars).
290.8 million registered vehicles in USA in 2022
Average yearly miles driven 14,263 miles
Electricity usage in USA 3,995 TWh (in 2021)
(1TWh=1billion kWh)
1,451,688,140,000 kWh (USA vehicles miles driven average rate times average electric power consumption...cars only.
Therefore = 1,451 TWh at CAR rate: however, if you factor in truck usage which is 1.89 kWh/mile.
Of the 290.8 million vehicles registered in USA, 156 million are trucks!
So...back to the drawing board!
134.8 million cars+156 million trucks
134,800,000 at (.35×14,263)=4,992.05 kWh
156,000,000 at (1.89×14,263)=26,957.07 kWh
Cars: 672,928,340,000 kWh
Trucks: 4,205,302,920,000 kWh
Total: 4,878,231,260,000 kWh
Total: 4,878.23126 TWh
Therefore grid system would have to be more than doubled to meet demand.

Lot of power.

I’m not in the EV replace all vehicles camp, I find that unrealistic even though I think they would be fine for a majority of commuters.

From your numbers I gleam a more than double consumption/generation. Doesn’t directly relate to grid/production ability shortcomings (double consumption doesn’t equal double capacity required). That would be an interesting study.

 

[MossRoad]

Remember in college where all the kids in a dorm would get together and flush their toilets all at once at the exact same time? Often resulted in poop on the floor in the lowest levels.

 

[MossRoad]

Our local electric company is offering off-peak charging for EVs at 45% off the regular price of electricity between the hours of 11PM and 6AM. Plus a $500 rebate once you set it up. Applies to people that already have chargers installed, too.

Charge at Home in Michigan

www.indianamichiganpower.com

The other major electric company in the area, as far as I can tell, only offers off-peak to non-residential customers.

 

[MossRoad]

Our local electric company is offering off-peak charging for EVs at 45% off the regular price of electricity between the hours of 11PM and 6AM. Plus a $500 rebate once you set it up. Applies to people that already have chargers installed, too.

Charge at Home in Michigan

www.indianamichiganpower.com

The other major electric company in the area, as far as I can tell, only offers off-peak to non-residential customers.

Applies to their Indiana customers as well...

Charge at Home in Indiana

www.indianamichiganpower.com

 

[Fuddyduddy1952]

Remember in college where all the kids in a dorm would get together and flush their toilets all at once at the exact same time? Often resulted in poop on the floor in the lowest levels.

I made a toilet discovery (I was always instigating something ). Remember those huge toilet paper rolls they used to have in the 70s? They must have been 2ft diameter. One day I discovered if you pulled a few feet of paper out and put it in commode water then flushed, the toilet would continue to flush until that huge roll was empty, leaving that center roll spinning about 5000 rpm.
I showed it to someone then it was all over, you'd hear toilets running for several minutes and no more paper!
I've never figured out why it would do that.

 

[MossRoad]

I made a toilet discovery (I was always instigating something ). Remember those huge toilet paper rolls they used to have in the 70s? They must have been 2ft diameter. One day I discovered if you pulled a few feet of paper out and put it in commode water then flushed, the toilet would continue to flush until that huge roll was empty, leaving that center roll spinning about 5000 rpm.
I showed it to someone then it was all over, you'd hear toilets running for several minutes and no more paper!
I've never figured out why it would do that.

Strong paper, I guess. I can see that it would cause a siphon effect, but the valve should shut off after the water pressure drops, assuming a normal valve like a Sloan or such.