Fuel Additives for Kubotas

[VTForester]

Regarding Throttle response, easier starting, better mileage, more power etc...for diesel engines this boils down to Cetane.

ASTM spec Diesel Fuel (US standard) is required to be 40 Cetane. Engine manufacturers pretty much universally recommend 45 Cetane. If you see Premium Diesel being sold somewhere, it is required to be 45. Based on +/- 1000 lab tests for Cetane we run every year most that comes out of the refinery will hit 45 and very often it will get to 50 even without treatment. The problem is as a consumer you have no way of knowing what you got. If you are seeing a noticeable response from an additive it is likely you are regularly buying diesel on the lower end of the spectrum 40-42 cetane. If you see no response it is likely you are already buying higher cetane diesel because that's what is in your area.

From a practical standpoint, there is little to no benefit to a diesel engine when cetane goes beyond 52 or so. But you should legitimately be able to tell the difference in a machine you are used to between 40 and 50. Bottom line, try it, if it works for you, decide if the cost benefit is there.

Note: Instead of getting any deeper in the weeds I'm leaving out the difference between cetane number and cetane index. It does matter but not unless you are lab testing to prove one batch against another.

 

[ovrszd]

Although I really appreciate your expertise in this area, what I appreciate most is your ability to voice it in an understandable way.

We have some very intelligent and knowledgeable folks here on TBN. Sometimes they struggle to "Dumb It Down" for us slow readers.

I've never noticed any change in performance when treating my fuel. I only treat during cold months, October thru March. I've never had any water problems. I buy 99% of my fuel from the same vendor.

Thanks again for great info.

 

[Paystar]

That's all I'm getting at ovrszd......I never felt any difference between using and not using Power Service. But I sure felt it when I put the Cat brand stuff in.
And the Howes has straightened out some rough running engines.

The other scary thing I am learning now that our company is opening a gas station/truck stop.......is how much cross-dilution happens. Talking to the fuel truck drivers and hearing about how many gallons of gas and diesel gets mixed in the tanks.
And stories of service stations mixing product themselves.....like when gas is cheaper than diesel, they will dump a couple hundred gallons of gas into the diesel tanks, and vice versa. Makes you really wonder what you are buying.

 

[ovrszd]

That's all I'm getting at ovrszd......I never felt any difference between using and not using Power Service. But I sure felt it when I put the Cat brand stuff in.
And the Howes has straightened out some rough running engines.

The other scary thing I am learning now that our company is opening a gas station/truck stop.......is how much cross-dilution happens. Talking to the fuel truck drivers and hearing about how many gallons of gas and diesel gets mixed in the tanks.
And stories of service stations mixing product themselves.....like when gas is cheaper than diesel, they will dump a couple hundred gallons of gas into the diesel tanks, and vice versa. Makes you really wonder what you are buying.

Ford sells some branded additive Supposed to do all things. I'll try a bottle. Don't have a Cat distributor around here.

I'm very, very paranoid about fuel.

 

[carlhwv]

Couple of things....first, I agree VTforester provided great in a way it was easy to understand. Kudos. Second, I pulled a 7040m operators manual from the net and regarding fuel, it says No 2 above -10C, No 1 below -10C. I found that interesting. Sticker by tank filler says ULSD of LSD. Engine is 2011 vintage. Got this tractor from my cousin...he ran a fuel track for the local heating oil company and I'm guessing that is where he got the red fuel I found when I did my initial service.

This is my first newer tractor and I also just got a new F350, both of which need to last me for a very long time. I want to get the fuel right. Working in the orchard growing up and the commercial fishing industry later in life, I've had my share of fuel related issues, so like ovrszd, I'm paranoid about fuel.

Ford make really pushes their own branded tiger juice making you feel like you can't use anything else, but upon further review, even in the diesel supplement manual states that any top brand of additive not containing alcohol can be used. If only used the Motorcraft pm22, as the over the road diesel I'm using is a 'winterized' reputable brand and I know the station owner, who I know uses it for his 4 wreckers. I ask him to get more info on the and we will see what we get back from his distributor. I do keep a bottle of the Winter Motorcraft and will use it if I get fuel from an unknown station.

For the tractor, I'm still struggling with what to do, though I now fell I'm armed with enough info to make an informed choice. While we get plenty of -10C 14F here on the mountain, we also have plenty of days warmer in the winter when I will be running. I'm not going to use No 1 diesel.

I'm either going to be running the same road diesel as I do in my truck...most likely...or will get some red and I will treat it. I've got a big jug of white PS and based on the fact my engine was built to run on LSD or ULSD, I'm just going to treat everything that goes in, doubling up as VTforester suggests, and hope I'm doing the right thing.

Got to love the sharing of information and the people e get to interact here.

 

[ovrszd]

I've read several times that No. 2 starts to Gel at anything below 20F.

Having had fuel Gelling problems once, I'll do whatever is necessary to avoid that. So, I probably over treat rather than under treat.

 

[murphy1244]

I've read several times that No. 2 starts to Gel at anything below 20F.

Having had fuel Gelling problems once, I'll do whatever is necessary to avoid that. So, I probably over treat rather than under treat.

And I always run my fuel through a Mr. Funnel. Water will not go through it.

 

[ovrszd]

And I always run my fuel through a Mr. Funnel. Water will not go through it.

I've never tried one. I'll check that out Murph.

 

[murphy1244]

I've never tried one. I'll check that out Murph.

I had to show my FIL the funnel too. Had to pour a cup of water in it as he is from Misery. Not one drop of water came out of it. I spilled the water out and filled up my tank. He bought two of them, not from me.

 

[rScotty]

I've read several times that No. 2 starts to Gel at anything below 20F.
Having had fuel Gelling problems once, I'll do whatever is necessary to avoid that. So, I probably over treat rather than under treat.

I'm beginning to understand that the problem for us diesel users starts with not knowing what kind of diesel we are getting in the first place. I'm not sure that the diesel stations and vendors know either. It wasn't always like that around here. It used to be that the vendors would label their pumps. Nowadays labeling isn't so common. Yesterday I took the time to look around a few stations. It seemed to me that the best bet would be one of the independent small refinery/stations which we have a few of locally, so I stopped by one that I used to buy from. In years past, that station used to have pumps labeled as either #1 diesel or #2 diesel. Some also had a kerosene pump labeled 1-K.

What I found was no different than the name brand stations. The independent producer stations no longer label #1 or #2. They sell a lot of Diesel, but all their pumps are all simply labeled "Diesel Fuel"..... Which leaves me wondering just what is the mix they are selling in those pumps and what temperature is is good for? And is it treated in any way? With what? After some conversation, I've no idea and doubt if there is much of any way to find out. The people selling it don't have a clue. BTW, that particular station still sells 1-K kerosene. Kerosene is obviously different from diesel, though - and costs almost twice as much. They keep that pump and tank under a double roof .... for keeping water out?

The weather forcast says it's going to get cold this weekend. My curiosity got the best of me and I took some last summer fuel I had and made up a couple of fuel samples in clean ball jars. With luck we can see if untreated summer fuel clouds with wax - or not - and also if the sample with the JD winterizer has any effect.

Good luck beats good planning,
rScotty