Kioti Broken in Half

[ranger danger]

Wow, 23 pages of comments from people who have no idea what happened to the tractor to cause the failure. No one has any clue how a modern tractor is designed, to what specifications, to what safety margin or even tested. However, everyone is an expert.

I drove trucks for 38 years. Ask me what the the breaking strength of the frame is! I have no idea! Whats the safety margin on the maximum load? I have no idea. Does that mean I don't know anything about trucks and how they work? Lots of good info on here despite one keyboard commando.

 

[BigBlue1]

Wow, 23 pages of comments from people who have no idea what happened to the tractor to cause the failure. No one has any clue how a modern tractor is designed, to what specifications, to what safety margin or even tested. However, everyone is an expert.

No, only one or two are acting like experts. The rest are assuming the actual experts are the experts and know what they are doing when designing their stuff.

 

[ptsg]

Right there is a reason the warranty may not be honored since this tractor is obviously exceeding the drawbar tow rating.

It's close, but it's not exceeding the tow rating. That tractor gets 5,500 KGs or just above 12,000 lbs of tow rating with a braked trailer.

 

[CJONE]

It might be time for you to consider a construction machine that’s more capable of withstanding abuse.

I may already have them but I use what I have on the job site mainly because of the transportation time. The tractors are so handy for building small roads and drives that when tree work is needed all I have to have is the grapple attachment with me. So yes I have them with a Cat 416 on the way, BUT the tractor will still get used for the occasional tree job. My small frontend loader is the main grapple wearer now! CJ

 

[MinnesotaEric]

It's close, but it's not exceeding the tow rating. That tractor gets 5,500 KGs or just above 12,000 lbs of tow rating with a braked trailer.

I stand corrected. My reasoning was from my own NX6010, whose drawbar is rated only at 7500 pounds.

 

[ovrszd]

"It has really well thoughout controls, all work is done one hand on the wheel, the other on the loader control, with forward and reverse there, and a gas pedal. Totally simple."

The modern wheel loaders are doing away with the steering wheel making operating even simpler.

Yep our local rock quarry has one. Single joystick with built in switches. Took the operator a few hours to get the hang of it. Now he swears by it and doesn't want a steering wheel.

 

[ovrszd]

Caterpillar got rid of steering wheels in the early 2000's.

Yeah they did that with their road graders too. Now they offer the steering wheel again. Lost a lot of business to JD.

 

[kevin37b]

I'm only a 30 year tractor/loader/excavator owner, so I can always learn more, what can you offer?

I enjoy learning about structural testing and safety margins, I test and certify airplane designs for a living....

Tractors and airplanes are different animals ?

 

[ranger danger]

My father in law was a mechanical engineer. He worked as a guidance engineer for Lockead missles and space designing guidance systems for nuclear weapons for 40 years. My wife is named after a missle he worked on. His side job was in stress fracture analysis. He would determine why something failed and what might be done to prevent it. He worked on Farris wheels, military hardware, home explosion etc. The list goes on and on!
From a metallurgical standpoint the answer to "are tractors and airplanes differant?" The answer is a resounding NO!

 

[LouNY]

Tractors and airplanes used to be built with different philosophy's;

one which I still agree with is'
if in doubt build it stout.

an airplane has to balance stout with weight;
because even though with enough power even a brick can fly it doesn't work worth a dang.

 

[deezler]

^ sure, but the same principle is also true for a tractor or any other vehicle. If you overbuild your CUT to the tune of an extra 1000 lbs of metal, it's gonna suck at driving up hills, etc. Any extra weight you add to the tractor is theoretically directly subtracting from lifting or towing capacity.

 

[4570Man]

^ sure, but the same principle is also true for a tractor or any other vehicle. If you overbuild your CUT to the tune of an extra 1000 lbs of metal, it's gonna suck at driving up hills, etc. Any extra weight you add to the tractor is theoretically directly subtracting from lifting or towing capacity.

More weight only detracts from lifting capacity when you’re adding something like an oversized grapple on a loader that’s already built. Beefing the frame, axel and loader mounts doesn’t decrease capacity. If you want something be be strong you either have to build it heavy or spend a pile of money to make it light and tractor manufacturers aren’t doing the latter. Making a lifting tool light doesn’t work anyway. You can lift over the wheels like a moffit lift or add counter weight.

 

[deezler]

Well sure, it obviously depends on what your current limiting factor is. On many of our CUTs, it is front axle strength and durability. So any weight above the axle is part of the equation. And all weight obviously still applies to driving performance.

 

[4570Man]

Well sure, it obviously depends on what your current limiting factor is. On many of our CUTs, it is front axle strength and durability. So any weight above the axle is part of the equation. And all weight obviously still applies to driving performance.

Maybe they should add a heavier duty front axel. Front axel problems are high on the list of compact tractor problems. Almost all heavier duty equipment uses a double jointed axel with a driveshaft through the center that drives a planetary hub. A uniball axel is also proven tough. A ring gear in the hub isn’t a very strong design.

 

[Username Taken]

I wonder if he didn't buy it as salvage and is trying to flip it. Looks like that might be (more than) possible. I also wonder if the prior owner didn't have a backhoe and, while operating it, continually lifted the rear of the tractor off the ground with the outriggers, causing the frame to crack and then it finally took a dump when it got jostled in the woods. I'd bet a beer. As long as you're buying

 

[TMGT]

It also could have been used within design limitations and has a weld failure due to manufacturers defect, I've seen a few post lately of various weldments cracking/breaking on Kioti equipment. If not caught in time could lead to catastrophic failure.

Not a bash on Kioti, just an observation. Based on the grapple it might not have lived an easy life, but doesn't necessarily mean it was abused.

Sent from my SM-G715U1 using TractorByNet mobile app

 

[WRX]

Nothing compact about the grapple on there. I wonder what that thing weighs? It will also get the load farther away from the lift pin, compounding the problem. Add the weight of a cab, big rocks, etc. Were boats being picked up in the boat yard? That might have exceeded the design limits of the tractor.

 

[Jstpssng]

OMG. my junk tractor is going to fall apart in the middle real soon. I best be trading it off. I sure have moved a lot of heavy boulders with it. Darn. Sure stir up some more FUD.

First you'll have to learn to beat the living crap out of it every time that you start it up.

I don't think you have what it takes to destroy a good piece of machinery for no reason.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

It also could have been used within design limitations and has a weld failure due to manufacturers defect, I've seen a few post lately of various weldments cracking/breaking on Kioti equipment. If not caught in time could lead to catastrophic failure.

Not a bash on Kioti, just an observation. Based on the grapple it might not have lived an easy life, but doesn't necessarily mean it was abused.

Sent from my SM-G715U1 using TractorByNet mobile app

Grapple stuff is normally pretty easy on a tractor's drivetrain as it is nabbing lighter-weight stuff—especially if there isn't any counterweight at the back—than three-point earth engaging stuff on the drawbar where all four wheels are working at or near a maximun effort to drag along.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

Maybe they should add a heavier duty front axel. Front axel problems are high on the list of compact tractor problems. Almost all heavier duty equipment uses a double jointed axel with a driveshaft through the center that drives a planetary hub. A uniball axel is also proven tough. A ring gear in the hub isn’t a very strong design.

Look at the photos again: The axle didn't break, the welds or bend in the subframe that bolts the axle to the rest of the machine broke making the transmission's bell-housing the only stressed member to hold everything together which then failed. I'm sure the failure was almost simultaneous.