Mig Welders

[Sodo]

I've heard all my life the best way to learn how to weld is to start with oxygen & acetylene. This is the fastest way to learn puddle control. Once you learn puddle control, then you have to learn how to read the puddle, and anticipate what the puddle is going to do, so you can make corrections, before the puddle falls on your feet.

I agree with this. We had a Miller with the big "M" of outlets. But I didn't have many (-- any) tractor projects. Consequently my projects were maxed at about 1/8" and more often 1/16" & less. Stick welding is pretty much MINIMUM 1/8" rods & material for a newbie. So the Oxy/Acetylene torch was the best way to do it and I leaned how to weld steel nicely with a torch. Motorcycle exhaust pipes, go-carts, bicycle frames, all kinds of stuff. Also did a lot of brazing. And stick-welding too. I did LOTS is stickwelding rust holes too!, it's good practice and nobody calls it bird poop when it's almost a hopeless repair anyway.

Which brings me around to the MIG (------of course )

Anybody who has 3 or 4 different kinds of welding devices sure as heck ought to learn them all. Stick will take awhile. TIG too. If you try to learn these "all by yourself" (unless you're a natural) you will make a lot of bird poop, ruin a lot of projects and won't want to show your projects to anyone. This could take awhile.

If you buy a MIG, and work at it, you can have reasonable success quickly, which will inspire you to create more. And as you create more, you will gain experience. As you tack stuff together, (and then break the weld) you learn what makes a weak weld and a strong weld (if you're observant). The best way to learn to weld is to have expert help - it's very very lucky to have that and most people don't have that luxury. The next best way is to have lots of projects, and the interest to do them.

 

[Shield Arc]

Since April of 2012 I've been told / cautioned / corrected numerous times that this is a tractor maintenance forum. Even tho I can't find that in writing anywhere! :confused3:
Welp, I must have bought the wrong tractor! I've been all over my tractor, and I can't find any razor blades on it anywhere!

If you want to buy one welder that will do anything a tractor maintenance welder would need, it is a Tig welder. Tig will weld really thin material, and most Tig machines can SMAW as well. Only thing Mig brings to the table is speed! How many of us tractor maintenance welders care about speed?
You can find these Tig welders on Craigs list between $400.00 and $1,000.00 It will weld pop cans together, or structural steel.:cool2:

 

[Sodo]

Uh-oh, I remember this stage. I wrote my opinion and should probably bow out if my advice is not good, and let the pro advise as he sees fit. :shocked:

 

[aczlan]

Or just keep your language family friendly...

Aaron Z

 

[Shield Arc]

Well now you're learning! Some people do it for a living, others play weldor on the Internet.
Is that to abusive for you?

 

[mikehaugen]

Since April of 2012 I've been told / cautioned / corrected numerous times that this is a tractor maintenance forum. Even tho I can't find that in writing anywhere! :confused3:
Welp, I must have bought the wrong tractor! I've been all over my tractor, and I can't find any razor blades on it anywhere!

If you want to buy one welder that will do anything a tractor maintenance welder would need, it is a Tig welder. Tig will weld really thin material, and most Tig machines can SMAW as well. Only thing Mig brings to the table is speed! How many of us tractor maintenance welders care about speed?
You can find these Tig welders on Craigs list between $400.00 and $1,000.00 It will weld pop cans together, or structural steel.:cool2:

I sure saw a lot of those when I was looking for a welder. People were letting them go for $250, then some wanted up to $1500. I ended up with my idealarc tig 250/250 for $1100 with stick leads, tig torch, foot pedal, and 3/4 argon bottle. Not the deal of the century but I was happy. It sure has done a lot of work for me in the last 5 years. I'm sure it has paid for itself.

 

[Sodo]

Way to git'er done shield! But I guess I shoulda knowed it.

----- point taken Aaron, but that one was hard to resist posting,,,,was 'almost' good clean fun. . Understood this forum needs to be watched over.

 

[Shield Arc]

I sure saw a lot of those when I was looking for a welder.

In the 1970s, and 1980s those machines were the Cadillac of Tig welders. Oh man do they have a beautiful arc for 7018 too!
I sold that one for $400.00, and it took several weeks to do it.:confused3:
Here is a 7018 weld I made with that machine. I built my bridge crane with it too.

 

[Underdog57]

If you want to buy one welder that will do anything a tractor maintenance welder would need, it is a Tig welder. Tig will weld really thin material, and most Tig machines can SMAW as well. Only thing Mig brings to the table is speed! How many of us tractor maintenance welders care about speed?
You can find these Tig welders on Craigs list between $400.00 and $1,000.00 It will weld pop cans together, or structural steel.

Now that is some great advice Shield!!!! :thumbsup:
Beautiful work on the 7018

You two settle down, I value EVERYONES comments and would hate to see anyone leave! LOL..LOL.. :laughing::laughing:

Just a joke, couldn't resist. :stirthepot:

 

[Shield Arc]

Beautiful work on the 7018.

Thank you! I should have held onto that welder, just for what it would do with 7018. But I needed the room in my shop.
Here is another 7018 weld I made with that machine. A guy on another site couldn't get anybody to build a stinger for him like this, so I built it and shipped it to him.

 

[Underdog57]

Thank you! I should have held onto that welder, just for what it would do with 7018. But I needed the room in my shop.
Here is another 7018 weld I made with that machine. A guy on another site couldn't get anybody to build a stinger for him like this, so I built it and shipped it to him.

Very nice work

 

[newbury]

<snip>
If you want to buy one welder that will do anything a tractor maintenance welder would need, it is a Tig welder. Tig will weld really thin material, and most Tig machines can SMAW as well. Only thing Mig brings to the table is speed!<snip>

I thought the order of utility for us "tractor maintainers" was SMAW MIG then TIG.
SMAW because it can do dirty, THICK and outside in the wind
MIG second because it can do thin, is fairly easy to learn and usually can do fluxcore outside in a breeze
TIG being last because it requires extremely clean conditions and no wind.

Is that not true?

 

[Shield Arc]

My point was a Tig machine will do anything you need. Thin material, aluminum, stainless steel. SMAW will do all your thick material welding. Mig welders are a luxury! And not needed, unless you're in a production shop! I think I proved a Mig welder in the wrong hands can be very dangerous! Just because you can set a Mig machine with auto set, and pull a trigger to glue something together doesn't mean you should be making critical welds! And it doesn't make you a weldor either.

 

[Shield Arc]

Here's a Tig weld I made on 10-GA stainless steel, with my less than $100.00 Tig rig, and $300.00 PA-200 SMAW machine.

 

[Sodo]

Mig welders are a luxury! And not needed, unless you're in a production shop! I think I proved a Mig welder in the wrong hands can be very dangerous! Just because you can set a Mig machine with auto set, and pull a trigger to glue something together doesn't mean you should be making critical welds! And it doesn't make you a weldor either.

Well,,, I guess you could say "this is the kind of advice you can't find in a book". Lots of info on the good ole' internet.

 

[rankrank1]

rankrank1

I agree with the concept but reality bites.

Where does this store selling quality exist?
I searched Craigslist, auctions, rebuilt etc. for a year and RARELY in my area did a < $100 stick welder show up that looked like it would even work.
And then it would be gone right after posting. And mailorder had horrendous shipping costs.

It's like telling people they can get a nearly new 5' tiller for $500, or a 5' bush hog for $250. I score a lot of deals on Craigslist and auctions but when I was seriously looking for a welder the only areas they were popping up were the west coast (SA hand me downs?) and depressed areas of Ohio.

I finally gave up on the used stick welder search and bought a new PA 300 (for $287.05).

Even that pinnacle of cheapness, Harbor Freight, charges about $150 to $200 (?list? $300) for their "225 amp" 240V stick welder.

So please all you pros stop enticing us with references to a used $75 240V buzz box and be more realistic.

And I agree an inexpensive 240V stick and a decent 120V MIG may be a good mix.

First I ain't no pro and never claimed to be one.

Bought my first Lincoln AC225 stick welder for $60 at Auction. Sold it 10 years later for $120. Bought this Miller Thunderbolt AC/DC is disguise for $100 off of CRaigslist. Have less than $40 in it accordingly. Also have one of those $280 Everlast PA-300 deals. Thought the deal was just too good to pass on. That said if I ever have to shed a welder the Thunderbolt is never leaving.





Plenty of $100 or less AC only buzzboxes on Craigslist all the time, but they do not last long. Lots a people read the net think they must have DC to weld. As they read more they then think they must have an inverter to weld. Neither scenario is even close to being true though.

 

[MossRoad]

I've heard all my life the best way to learn how to weld is to start with oxygen & acetylene. This is the fastest way to learn puddle control. Once you learn puddle control, then you have to learn how to read the puddle, and anticipate what the puddle is going to do, so you can make corrections, before the puddle falls on your feet.

That's the way I learned.... Introduction to oxy acetylene was first, to learn puddle control, just as you said. Then stick. Then mig. Then tig. However, that's not what they teach in tech school anymore when it comes to novice welders with little to no experience. Its intro to arc, then mig. Then, if you are recommended by the instructor, its on to tig. Let's face it.... there are few novice job openings that require knowledge of gas welding. Pretty much all production welding is electric. Gas is a specialty field now. Too bad. There's really something special about putting a flame to metal, seeing that puddle form and then moving it along with a nice motion, getting two pieces of metal to join with NO filler rod just to see if you can keep two puddles joining at the same time. Blowing holes through it just makes you go back and try harder next time. If someone has never done oxy/acetylene torch welding, they really ought to take a crack at it. Its an art.

 

[MossRoad]

See what I mean?

Oh so nice! :thumbsup:

 

[MossRoad]

While mig is not needed, I'd reach for that to tack together something before my stick welder. Just stick the gun in the spot, close your eyes and pop the trigger. Very easy for tacking. Way easier than stick. But if I had to buy only one welder, it wouldn't be mig. But I got to by three, so there ya go.

 

[Shield Arc]

Hey, don't get me wrong! I'm all for Mig / wire feeders. I made a very good living for a very long time pulling trigger. Been on jobs for months at a time running 70 plus pounds of wire a day. Wire feeders can't be beat when it comes to production! But before wire feeders came into construction we still made a good living running stick. Just not near as productive as with a wire feeder.

God, I can't even remember the last time I used oxygen & acetylene to weld anything! :confused2: