NASCAR Race to the Chase
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Gatorboy
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<font color="blue"> ( Get a motor vehicle over 140 mph and you would be surprised the "skill" that is needed (let alone having other cars AROUND you). ) </font>
If driving a race car was something difficult to do, you would not see so many father's/son's/cousin's, etc in the sport.
If driving a race car was something difficult to do, you would not see so many father's/son's/cousin's, etc in the sport.
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Sign up for Dale Jarrett's race school at Talledega for a day and then come back here and talk about no skill. Sit in a race car on a 100+ degree day when the car temp is 140 plus and the exhaust pipes run directly under your seat. Remember, you're in a fire suit from head to toe with a full face helmet (granted has some cool air circulation) and do it for 4 or 5 hours with no breaks, no getting out, no halftime, no timeouts.
I was a Davey Allison fan (as well as Bobby) going back to the late 80's. I've become a Stewart fan and I'll be rooting for the 20, but Roush with 5 cars will be very tough for any of the teams to deal with. Like many long time fans, I have grown disenchanted with the new pretty boy drivers and the overall sterilization of what was once a terrific sport. I may have to start following the World of Outlaws.
For those wondering about ownership, NASCAR rules already limit team ownership to two teams per owner. Technically, there are other names on the ownership cards of the multi-teams over two. For example, Rick Hendrick's father Papa Joe owned the 25 until he passed away within the last few years. I'm not sure who technically owns that now.
I was a Davey Allison fan (as well as Bobby) going back to the late 80's. I've become a Stewart fan and I'll be rooting for the 20, but Roush with 5 cars will be very tough for any of the teams to deal with. Like many long time fans, I have grown disenchanted with the new pretty boy drivers and the overall sterilization of what was once a terrific sport. I may have to start following the World of Outlaws.
For those wondering about ownership, NASCAR rules already limit team ownership to two teams per owner. Technically, there are other names on the ownership cards of the multi-teams over two. For example, Rick Hendrick's father Papa Joe owned the 25 until he passed away within the last few years. I'm not sure who technically owns that now.
Farmwithjunk
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</font><font color="blue" class="small">( <font color="blue"> ( Get a motor vehicle over 140 mph and you would be surprised the "skill" that is needed (let alone having other cars AROUND you). ) </font>
If driving a race car was something difficult to do, you would not see so many father's/son's/cousin's, etc in the sport. )</font>
That's exactly WHY you do see so many sons and cousins in the sport. Drivers need a background in the sport to DEVELOPE the skills needed to compete at speeds the human body and mind is not always well suited to deal with.
So... Is Pro Football a skill sport? (I'd say it is.) Do you suppose a multi-time Super Bowl winning coach would know enough to judge what is more difficult, what takes more skill?
Joe Gibbs, won a couple Super Bowls.
He's the car owner of #18 Bobby Labonte, former Cup Champion
He owns the #20 Tony Stewart entry. Past Nascar champion, and current points leader.
Gibbs says driving a race car is much more skilled, and takes far more ability than ANY sport he's ever been around.
I'd value the opinion of someone who's "been there, done that, got the trophy shelf full" over someone who admittedly doesn't like NASCAR.
But that's just my opinion..... And Joe Gibb's too
If driving a race car was something difficult to do, you would not see so many father's/son's/cousin's, etc in the sport. )</font>
That's exactly WHY you do see so many sons and cousins in the sport. Drivers need a background in the sport to DEVELOPE the skills needed to compete at speeds the human body and mind is not always well suited to deal with.
So... Is Pro Football a skill sport? (I'd say it is.) Do you suppose a multi-time Super Bowl winning coach would know enough to judge what is more difficult, what takes more skill?
Joe Gibbs, won a couple Super Bowls.
He's the car owner of #18 Bobby Labonte, former Cup Champion
He owns the #20 Tony Stewart entry. Past Nascar champion, and current points leader.
Gibbs says driving a race car is much more skilled, and takes far more ability than ANY sport he's ever been around.
I'd value the opinion of someone who's "been there, done that, got the trophy shelf full" over someone who admittedly doesn't like NASCAR.
But that's just my opinion..... And Joe Gibb's too
Gatorboy
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<font color="blue">( Gibbs says driving a race car is much more skilled, and takes far more ability than ANY sport he's ever been around. ) </font>
Well, I used to race hydroplanes. I bought the best equipment and in my first season was the top driver in my class in my region. I went on to finish 7th in the nationals my rookie year. I wasn't going 140, but going 75 mph on water with 11 other boats going into the first turn is pretty hairy in itself.
In fact, I used to also race canoes and kayaks. It took much more practice and training to be competitive in a "sport" that requires physical strength, stamina, etc. than it does to drive a machine.
I know with several months of practice I could be competitive with the Home Depot crew. I'm not trying to be cocky, I'm just trying to point out that there are many people that if given the opporturnity to drive a race car could do just as well as those driving today -- it's not like becoming a professional baseball player. A few months of practice and I still could not be a Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens, Derek Jeter, etc. That's talent.
Well, I used to race hydroplanes. I bought the best equipment and in my first season was the top driver in my class in my region. I went on to finish 7th in the nationals my rookie year. I wasn't going 140, but going 75 mph on water with 11 other boats going into the first turn is pretty hairy in itself.
In fact, I used to also race canoes and kayaks. It took much more practice and training to be competitive in a "sport" that requires physical strength, stamina, etc. than it does to drive a machine.
I know with several months of practice I could be competitive with the Home Depot crew. I'm not trying to be cocky, I'm just trying to point out that there are many people that if given the opporturnity to drive a race car could do just as well as those driving today -- it's not like becoming a professional baseball player. A few months of practice and I still could not be a Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens, Derek Jeter, etc. That's talent.
Farmwithjunk
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</font><font color="blue" class="small">(
I wasn't going 140, but going 75 mph on water with 11 other boats going into the first turn is pretty hairy in itself. I know with several months of practice I could be competitive with the Home Depot crew myself. )</font>
Maybe....But don't bet the ranch on this one.
I wasn't going 140, but going 75 mph on water with 11 other boats going into the first turn is pretty hairy in itself. I know with several months of practice I could be competitive with the Home Depot crew myself. )</font>
Maybe....But don't bet the ranch on this one.
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</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Gibbs says driving a race car is much more skilled, and takes far more ability than ANY sport he's ever been around. )</font>
Like Gatorboy, I do not think of a Nascar driver as an athlete, in the same regard as a baseball or football player. It is definitely a skill, but is on the same level as someone who can hit a 95mph fastball? How many Hollywood actors have you seen playing professional baseball or football? However, Paul Newman and other actors have been able to compete in various types of racing. It takes money (or a sponsor) to get behind the wheel, but it takes talent to get hired by the professional sports teams. No matter how much money he has, Michael Jordon could not enter the ranks of professional baseball. JMHO.
Like Gatorboy, I do not think of a Nascar driver as an athlete, in the same regard as a baseball or football player. It is definitely a skill, but is on the same level as someone who can hit a 95mph fastball? How many Hollywood actors have you seen playing professional baseball or football? However, Paul Newman and other actors have been able to compete in various types of racing. It takes money (or a sponsor) to get behind the wheel, but it takes talent to get hired by the professional sports teams. No matter how much money he has, Michael Jordon could not enter the ranks of professional baseball. JMHO.
Farmwithjunk
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Agreed. Several things I'd like to comment on. First off, money isn't the "prime mover" in NASCAR. It takes LOTS of cash, but this year shows just what money will buy you. Jeff Gordon drives for the highest funded operation in NASCAR. This year, he doesn't even make the final 10. It takes $$$$$$$$$ to have a competitive program, but it takes a skilled driver to WIN. And in this case, even skill doesn't always get you a trophy. (You don't know how much it hurts me to say Gordon has ability.....)
Race car drivers don't have the SAME athletic skills as an NFL lineman, but it's becoming more obvious as time goes by that racecar drivers that are "athletic" have a decided advantage. Mark Martin for instance, has a workout program that rivals anyone in sports. He isn't an imposing figure, but I'd venture to say he's in fine condition. It takes stamina unimagined by most of us to sit in a racecar, surrounded in 100 degree heat, for 3 or 4 hours, and still have the incredable reactions that it takes to drive INCHES away from other cars, pit crewmen, and a CONCRETE WALL, at 200(+) MPH.
Money will get you a long way in entry level forms of auto racing (or any other motorsport for that matter) but when you reach the top rung, skill makes the difference as to who's there and who's not.
Also, you see Hollywood actors competing in auto racing, but you DON'T see them at top level events (NASCAR NEXTEL CUP, INDY CARS, ect.) There are many lower "skill level" arenas for motorsports. That's where money will buy your way in. The local "beer league" softball leagues are much the same story. Just because you can fork out a $500 entry fee to get a team in a summer league doesn't automatically qualify anyone for the New York Yankees.
Finally, we are starting to muddy up the difference betwenn SKILL and ATHLETESISM
Some of NASCARS finest make millions a year. It's been my finding that no one is willing to fork over that sort of cash to "just anyone", unless you have what skills or abilities it takes to EARN it. (unless you win the powerball /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif)
Race car drivers don't have the SAME athletic skills as an NFL lineman, but it's becoming more obvious as time goes by that racecar drivers that are "athletic" have a decided advantage. Mark Martin for instance, has a workout program that rivals anyone in sports. He isn't an imposing figure, but I'd venture to say he's in fine condition. It takes stamina unimagined by most of us to sit in a racecar, surrounded in 100 degree heat, for 3 or 4 hours, and still have the incredable reactions that it takes to drive INCHES away from other cars, pit crewmen, and a CONCRETE WALL, at 200(+) MPH.
Money will get you a long way in entry level forms of auto racing (or any other motorsport for that matter) but when you reach the top rung, skill makes the difference as to who's there and who's not.
Also, you see Hollywood actors competing in auto racing, but you DON'T see them at top level events (NASCAR NEXTEL CUP, INDY CARS, ect.) There are many lower "skill level" arenas for motorsports. That's where money will buy your way in. The local "beer league" softball leagues are much the same story. Just because you can fork out a $500 entry fee to get a team in a summer league doesn't automatically qualify anyone for the New York Yankees.
Finally, we are starting to muddy up the difference betwenn SKILL and ATHLETESISM
Some of NASCARS finest make millions a year. It's been my finding that no one is willing to fork over that sort of cash to "just anyone", unless you have what skills or abilities it takes to EARN it. (unless you win the powerball /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif)
The athletics in NASCAR really can't be compared to those of other major sports. It's just different.
There's the physical aspect:
- As already mentioned, they're in a car whose cabin temp is between 100-150 degrees. That'll do something to you.
- Now throw in a 5 second bursts of 3-4 g's every 15 seconds or so for 3 hours. Another physical demand.
- You're inevitably going to wreck. Hitting a wall or car at those speeds has to hurt. Yea, they walk out of their cars but I'll bet they're as bruised/banged up as any NFL lineman.
Then there's the mental aspect (and I believe this one is what trumps many other sports):
- They're driving at speeds approaching 200 mph. That's downright scary.
- They're doing it 3" from a wall and the same distance to several other cars. A hair-raising experience.
They're mentally concentrating for hours on end on:
- When to pass vs. hold back?
- What's going to happen if there's a wreck in front of you? Can you blast through the incident going through it blind over 100 mph?
- What to do on the next pit stop?
- When to pit?
- How not to hit cars or pit crew staff as you're whipping by them at 55mph? (Ever just miss a pedestrian at 55 mph? I'll bet your blood pressure and stress raised a bit).
- Who's helping vs. hurting you at any one time?
- What's the spotter and crew chief telling you. What are you going to do with that info?
- What to do for any/all incidents they haven't predicted? For most, they have only seconds to act.
I guess what I'm saying is that drivers require a high degree of physical demand but more so require an incredibly high mental demand to handle all the stress that goes with the sport.
Brian
There's the physical aspect:
- As already mentioned, they're in a car whose cabin temp is between 100-150 degrees. That'll do something to you.
- Now throw in a 5 second bursts of 3-4 g's every 15 seconds or so for 3 hours. Another physical demand.
- You're inevitably going to wreck. Hitting a wall or car at those speeds has to hurt. Yea, they walk out of their cars but I'll bet they're as bruised/banged up as any NFL lineman.
Then there's the mental aspect (and I believe this one is what trumps many other sports):
- They're driving at speeds approaching 200 mph. That's downright scary.
- They're doing it 3" from a wall and the same distance to several other cars. A hair-raising experience.
They're mentally concentrating for hours on end on:
- When to pass vs. hold back?
- What's going to happen if there's a wreck in front of you? Can you blast through the incident going through it blind over 100 mph?
- What to do on the next pit stop?
- When to pit?
- How not to hit cars or pit crew staff as you're whipping by them at 55mph? (Ever just miss a pedestrian at 55 mph? I'll bet your blood pressure and stress raised a bit).
- Who's helping vs. hurting you at any one time?
- What's the spotter and crew chief telling you. What are you going to do with that info?
- What to do for any/all incidents they haven't predicted? For most, they have only seconds to act.
I guess what I'm saying is that drivers require a high degree of physical demand but more so require an incredibly high mental demand to handle all the stress that goes with the sport.
Brian
