Comparison Plastic versus Paper, I mean Metal.

sanmigmike · Oct 24, 2004

It seems as if we are going to go for the M-F 1433 but have not "closed" the deal yet. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

When I started looking I wanted a metal tractor but after reading the note from the man that had a tree bounce off the ROPS and the fender on his 4130 leaving just a little scratch..... /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I began to wonder some, how are the plastic fenders and all holding up and do they still look pretty good in the few years versus the metal ones denting and or rusting? Or should I not worry about it?

Still open to info on the greater Portland OR area dealers.

Thanks!

markie61 · Oct 24, 2004

Plenty of stuff hitting mine, but nothing broken or cracked yet...

I've gotten a few fairly deep scratches (deep enough to expose metal IF it was metal), but since the color goes all the way through, they are hard to see.

Plastic hood and fenders are good for me - so far...

Mark

Oh, yeah. It's a 2001 NH TC40D with 400 hours.

Soundguy · Oct 24, 2004

Plastic vs metal is a trade off.

If you are planning on keeping the tractor.. get metal.. if you are planning on selling it.. get plastic. By far.. metal will 'last' longer, though it's looks will suffer more inthe short term.

Plastic will deforem without breaking and small scratches will buff out whereas metal will need a repaint and repair. That said.. well painted metal will last a looong time. All my antiques are sporting original sheet metal.. and that ranges back from 1946... that's 58 years.. 58 years on plastic is going to be a tad hard.

Metal is also easier to repair. Most any backyard mechanic with a torch /bassing kit or welder can do some passible metal repair that may be invisible once painted... plastic repair is much more limited.. especialy due to the variety of materials. ( yes.. some plastics can be bonded and heat repaired.. this is the exception.. not the rule... ) Fiberglass throws a new facet tot he plastic vs metal as well.. kevlar too.... As far as i know.. kevlar is non repairable.. where as fiberglass is fairly repairable.. and plastice is somewhat repairable..with metal being the most repairable.. etc.

Soundguy

pekabu · Oct 25, 2004

I have metal and so far so good. There was one guy with a JD and a plastic hood that shattered when a good side rock hit it.

On the new TC24da, the area from the gauges down is now metal instead of plactic on the TC24d. I prefer the plastic there.

Bob_Skurka · Oct 25, 2004

There is a small dent in the hood of the Kubota B2910, it will cost about $400 to repair. Consequently the repair has not be made. There are some scratches in the hood of the TC24. But it looks much better than the Kubota's hood. Also the Kubota's orange paint is pretty faded at 4 years of exposure. I think the thing that tips plastic as the slightly better material in my mind is the total lack of care that it requires. I hit a low branch with the rear fender of the TC24, it bent, it deformed, it popped back into place and it didn't even scratch.

Soundguy makes a point that an antique that is 50 years old will have better looking metal than it would if it was plastic, BUT it also strikes me, after working on a few pieces of old iron, that the 50 year old tractors are built like real tanks, the sheet metal is much thicker on those old tractors than it is on the new ones.

BUT 50 years FROM NOW, taking two tractors made this year, one with a metal hood and one with plastic, will the metal hood have rusted through? Will the plastic have shattered or decayed? I dunno.

rockyridgefarm · Oct 25, 2004

Funny, I was thinking about starting a thread on the very same subject...

I really don't care if someone wants a metal skinned tractor, but i keep seeing comments about the plastic skinned ones as if they were throw away junk.

A lot of work must have gone into the Deere and NH products, because they really do hold up well, and shrug off horrendous abuse. Sure, you will hear about a really good smack destroying one, but metal sure won't look good, then, either.

This weekend, a friend had a fall party with a hayride that was a few miles from us. we loaded the kidsa on a trailer and pulled them there with the 4310. It was a ball.

Everyone there kept commenting about our brand new tractor we had polished up for the event.

But its almost two years old, has worked hard and hadn't had a bath! It just looks like its going to a parade, with no care at all...

Mine has a scar that I am the only one that seems to notice. which is good, because I sure don't want to explain what I did to put it there!

jmc · Oct 25, 2004

Sometimes I need to crawl up into the raised fel bucket and the only way up there without a ladder is walking on the hood. That was one of the many reasons I bought a Kubota this time around. I don't know if a plastic hood would support the weight.

John

SPIKER · Oct 25, 2004

my import JINMA has a fiber glas hood and steel rear fenders, so far both are goot, the hood has a deep gouge from shipping it arrived that way, it had 2nd tractor setting on top of it and the frame bent and let the upper frame rub the hood bare. it has been walked on and used a a scafold several time with no problems, the fender often has my woman or kids riding along for a jaunt to the woods or creek, (safely though in low range) they are at least 16 ga steel and have some good deal of bracing under them... no rust yet after 3 yrs with at least 20% of time left outside.

MarkM

SteveH_CT · Oct 25, 2004

I'll be short and sweet...

Plastic is better... Metal may be better in 50 years, but I don't care at all about that. I've seen some of the metal bodied tractors look old after a few years... while plastic looks great. In 50 years I'll be 92 and I seriously doubt that I'll be worried about my plastic bodied Deere - I do think I'll be more worried about walking and breathing.

All kidding aside, others have already related how well the plastic takes abuse. No getting around it, plastic will stand up better to "normal" abuse. Metal is more repairable, but I don't have the time or desire to be repairing the thing everytime it gets a knock or ding, whereas plastic takes the hit and just comes back. My plastic hood took a hit that bent the brushguard on the front of my tractor. If you've seen the Deere brushguard you know it's thick strong metal... and it bent /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif. not the hood, bent, shook and went right back to where it belonged, with nothing more than a scratch.

OK - I wasn't short or sweet... And before someone thinks I disagree with Soundguy - I don't - I think he makes valid points, but he's talking about vintage iron... not the newer stuff. Bob also said his Bota doesn't look as good after a few years - that was my observation when I shopped for used machines. The used iron vs. plastic wasn't comparable - the plastic ones just plain looked better.

Syncro · Oct 25, 2004

Guess I gotta put in my 2 cents worth because this was a big issue for me when I was looking (still am looking, guess I'll always be looking /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif) OK, at first I was against the plastic parts, then after hearing all the good points I sorta thought they were better....until I passed a local rental yard and saw a few NH's with the blue worn off with gray blotches (color does not go all the way through) there is a base gray plastic that has a color top coat, like painted metal. I stopped and looked closer and some hoods were cracked and broken. Now that doesn't mean a metal hood would fair better, just not so convinced anymore about the virtues of plastic. The thickness & shaping of the metal counts too, notice the flex on a TC-30 fender, now look at a Kubota or MF, maybe its the shape, or rolled edges, but sure is a lot stiffer. I think its just a simple draw, more of what a person likes. For me, its metal, but I sure wouldn't pass up a 'plastic' tractor if the price was right. BTW, no offense meant on the virtues of the TC-30 fenders /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif, they are good tractors and I sure would not hessitate in buying one, again if the price was right. For that matter notice all the flex in the plastic fenders, if that bothers you then do the 'fender check' on different brands before buying /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

BillyP · Oct 25, 2004

walking on the hood 

All I can say is wow, unbelievable and I definitely need to go on a diet. /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

GerardC · Oct 25, 2004

( Will the plastic have shattered or decayed? I dunno.
)

It takes plastic at least 100 years to decay. Gerard

Cliff_Johns · Oct 25, 2004

( . . . until I passed a local rental yard and saw a few NH's with the blue worn off with gray blotches (color does not go all the way through) there is a base gray plastic that has a color top coat, like painted metal. I stopped and looked closer and some hoods were cracked and broken. Now that doesn't mean a metal hood would fair better . . . )

I can't imagine what these tractors might have been used for, but I don't think this is represtitive. I can say that the color goes all the way through on my LT and my CUT, both have received scars that would have scratched paint, and you can see the scratches on the plastic too, but you have to look.

That said, I didn't get a tractor with the idea that I wouldn't scratch it. Metal can be fixed more easily, the plastic is less likely to need to be fixed. If a plastic hood were to be hit badly enough to be broken, I don't know if you could eppoxy it or superglue it or what. I don't know.

Has anyone on TBN had a plastic hood or fender so dammaged it had to be repaired? I'd like to hear how the repair was done.

Cliff

eee · Oct 26, 2004

( By far.. metal will 'last' longer, though it's looks will suffer more inthe short term. )

That depends on the type of plastic that is being used,some plastic will never deteriorate. This hoods etc on the compact tractors have a small amount of rubber mixed in with them in some form or another that allows them to flex somewhat. Pure plastic like in your clear plastic forks will shatter,where as the white plastic forks have a small amount of rubber mixed in with the plastic and it will bend somewhat before they break.
True metal is easier to repair,but if my plastic hood took a hard enough hit to shatter it which it has, I know a metal hood would have been crumpled and it would have been a totaled hood.
My tractor has set outside and the hood has shown no signs of warping,not to mention on a hot summer day and the tractor being driven all day.
Out in the woods where I work the repairing the dings and dents I would have on a metal hood would keep me busy all of the time,I have seen the plastic get flexed a lot by tree branches pushing up against it etc,but have never broken it from these low impacts.

kensfarm · Oct 26, 2004

I have a 2000 TC35D.. while unloading an 18 wheeler.. I ran my hood into one of the strap rachets.. it's not plastic.. it seems to be fiberglass underneath.

getut · Oct 26, 2004

Gerard, you bring up a good point... and also a common misunderstanding. I'm sure you didn't mean it the way it came out... but plastic surely does go away ***MUCH*** faster than that in certain circumstances.

Those circumstances should also sway a person on their decision of metal or plastic. The main circumstance of which I speak is UV exposure (sunlight). If someone is going to HAVE to store their tractor in the elements for any length of time, then go with metal. Even a years worth of UV exposure will greatly affect the strength and longevity of any plastic components.

The first stage is bleaching, then brittleness, then eventually is will start turning to a powder.

Getut

rockyridgefarm · Oct 26, 2004

But not all plastics are the same there! Done right, they withstand UV like crazy, while the paint can chalk off the metal and it rusts.

And color makes a difference. Set a red and a green feed bucket out side by side and the red one will be gone long before the green one shows any sign of deterioration. Sorry, CaseIH! /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

I my canoeing/kayaking days I paid a hefty premium to get a plastic one rather than metal. I could wrap a plastic canoe around a rock, and it'd straighen right out and be going downriver in a shake.

Cliff_Johns · Oct 26, 2004

( The first stage is bleaching, then brittleness, then eventually is will start turning to a powder. )

Sounds just like my old car, except the brittleness would be replaced by rust. In any case, you are refering to plastics we all know and don't love. Do you know that the newer plastics used on cars and tractors have the same problem? Do they have suffucient UV protection better integrated into the plastic? I think they are better, the question is, how much better?

Are they using as heavy a metal or as good a paint job on the tractors as they used to. I know they are not. The old lead based paint protected the metal better and held up longer to abuse, but they can't use that any more. I don't know if the metal thinkness or quality has changed or is lower in CUTs than in an old Oliver, maybe it's the same, but I doubt it.

In the end, I don't think it's a big deal. I wouldn't let plastic or metal sway your choice a whole lot. If the manufacturer is going to go cheap, they can make cheap metal with a low quality paint job or they can make cheap plastic with low quality ingredients and not enough UV protection.

You have to decide the quality level yourself without much actual manufacturing information.

Cliff

getut · Oct 26, 2004

Yes.. all plastics, and resins have the same problem. Yes they do better now than they used to but they are still affected and still go away.

Aviation is great example. No expense spared on UV protectants for resins and coverings and the plastics themselves, but they are still affected. Their useful life has ended long before any visual damage has taken place. Their strength has been greatly reduced by UV damage and regular inspection and replacement of these items is required.

Tractors are slightly different... weight is not an issue so they can use MUCH thicker plastic components which would last much longer, but the base problem is the same. Metals aren't directly affected by UV and plastics are. UV would affect the paint ON the metal and eventually cause it harm.

My original statement remains true... if outdoor storage is your only option, metal will give you better service. Other than that, I think its personal preference.

Getut