Plumbing - Sharkbite, Gatorbite reliability?

[studor]

A house in my neighborhood recently required gutting and rebuilding when a soldered copper shutoff valve failed after 20 years or so (the solder cracked and pushed a bigger hole over three days while the owners were elsewhere). I think you can find all kinds of reasons not to use new materials and techniques and while I would not use "bite" fittings for a big job, when the "professional":thumbsup: does not put shutoffs on sinks they work very well.

 

[kenmac]

What do you do (liabilty wise) when a copper or CPVC joint fails?

I don't use pvc and have never had a soldered / brazed copper joint blow apart in 30 yrs of Plumbing/HVAC. I use pex , but I use the band clamps and have never had 1 come apart at the barbed fitting with the clamp. I know plumbers that have had these slip on fittings slip off and cause major damage. They don't use them anymore either. But, hey.Use what ever you want .I challenge you or anyone to go to a construction (residental / commerical) site and see if any plumbers are using these slip on fittings. But,,I have no dog in the hunt, fight, etc, Just giving my experence as a plumber and plumbers I know that have had problems with these fittings

 

[Rustyiron]

A plumber is $50/hour or more around here. If there is water in the line, a sweated joint might cost you an hour or two (water in the lines was always my problem). Do the math! The fact that my plumber uses them on his own house tells me something.

I'll have to agree, I was only thinking in "new construction" terms, and a whole house plumbing job. Every tool or choice of material has it's own application. I've been lucky, it's been years since I've had to sweat a "wet" line, my last house was cpvc, and now in a pex house. The wet sweat was in my copper house with acidic well water.

 

[clemsonfor]

I don't use pvc and have never had a soldered / brazed copper joint blow apart in 30 yrs of Plumbing/HVAC. I use pex , but I use the band clamps and have never had 1 come apart at the barbed fitting with the clamp. I know plumbers that have had these slip on fittings slip off and cause major damage. They don't use them anymore either. But, hey.Use what ever you want .I challenge you or anyone to go to a construction (residental / commerical) site and see if any plumbers are using these slip on fittings. But,,I have no dog in the hunt, fight, etc, Just giving my experence as a plumber and plumbers I know that have had problems with these fittings

I really dont think anyone is inferring plumbers will use them on a new house. Or even a homeowner for that matter, they are just to expensive. they would cost more than all other matierials if you were useing cpvc or pex. I think here the question is do homeowners use them, our soldering abilities are not going to be as good as a pro, we will have water in most of the lines we deal with complicating the issue. For you no matter what you can fix a solder joint in about the same time maybe a bit more time and for cheaper.

I on the other hand have not taught myself to solder yet, i dont doubt that i could do it just haveent learned yet. And for me it was way easier to use one Under the house. If it bursts it will do about ZERO damage other than a wet crawl and under surface of the home. But in my soldering ability i may have a Cu joint fail as well???

 

[two_bit_score]

I really dont think anyone is inferring plumbers will use them on a new house. Or even a homeowner for that matter, they are just to expensive. they would cost more than all other matierials if you were useing cpvc or pex. I think here the question is do homeowners use them, our soldering abilities are not going to be as good as a pro, we will have water in most of the lines we deal with complicating the issue. For you no matter what you can fix a solder joint in about the same time maybe a bit more time and for cheaper.

I on the other hand have not taught myself to solder yet, i dont doubt that i could do it just haveent learned yet. And for me it was way easier to use one Under the house. If it bursts it will do about ZERO damage other than a wet crawl and under surface of the home. But in my soldering ability i may have a Cu joint fail as well???

Exactly. :thumbsup:

 

[kenmac]

I really dont think anyone is inferring plumbers will use them on a new house. Or even a homeowner for that matter, they are just to expensive. they would cost more than all other matierials if you were useing cpvc or pex. I think here the question is do homeowners use them, our soldering abilities are not going to be as good as a pro, we will have water in most of the lines we deal with complicating the issue. For you no matter what you can fix a solder joint in about the same time maybe a bit more time and for cheaper.

I on the other hand have not taught myself to solder yet, i dont doubt that i could do it just haveent learned yet. And for me it was way easier to use one Under the house. If it bursts it will do about ZERO damage other than a wet crawl and under surface of the home. But in my soldering ability i may have a Cu joint fail as well???

All I'm saying is , As a plumber, I wouldn't advise anyone to use these fittings where there's a potential for water damage. Outside underground would be ideal. The soldering days are about over. I can remember the days of leading the old C I / ductile iron drain joints. Most times the pro press is used for copper water & gas. or pex with crimp style barb fittings are used. I'm just an old plumber offering the OP advise on these slip on fittings.

 

[Ehanson]

My problem is the o-ring seal is doing the work. Not knowing the quality of o-ring (Nitrile, Buna, Flourocarbon, Viton,)
I am not sure how long the o-ring would last? I have seen O-rings deteriorate to a cracked crumbly mess. Personally I would not use them, especially if I do the work for someone! I need to sleep at night) . I like copper and sylphous (silver solder). If you are worried about burning wood, get a silicone baking pad, or welding blanket to protect the wood.
Just my two bits!

 

[clemsonfor]

kenmac I understand your concern and advice. But in the case of a repair to a copper plumbed house I cant gut put in glue or use pex it would either be solder joint or compression fitting or sharkbite, and like I said I did not feel like learning to solder for this project.

 

[michael.white]

I've used them where working space is concerned, e.g. I can only fit one hand into the working space (unless I want to start ripping out a lot of drywall). I've also used them when fittings are right up against drywall. No problems yet, but they've only been there for about ayear.

 

[Bikewanderer]

I had some in a rental house. Changed out a water heater and jostled the pipe a little bit. they started leaking. I reseated them but eventually gve up and soldered it all back together. Another time I was working on a house with CPVC in the walls and almost nothing sticking out. It went in there and has been fine. I keep a few in the toolbox now. Been there for years. I almost never use them.

I always resolder the pipes when I need to. If you cut the pipe and install a coupler you can drop the end enough to get the water out.

 

[two_bit_score]

I had some in a rental house. Changed out a water heater and jostled the pipe a little bit. they started leaking. I reseated them but eventually gve up and soldered it all back together. Another time I was working on a house with CPVC in the walls and almost nothing sticking out. It went in there and has been fine. I keep a few in the toolbox now. Been there for years. I almost never use them.

I always resolder the pipes when I need to. If you cut the pipe and install a coupler you can drop the end enough to get the water out.

I'm wondering if the leaks you experienced were because there was some offset in the pipes being joined with the sharkbite. They do require straight connections to work properly. It the pipe does not go into either end properly I can see how they could leak.

 

[Bikewanderer]

That's possible. The prior owner had also used the fittings to support the pipe, putting a funny load on them. We're only talking about a few fee of pipe, but you could be right.

 

[300UGUY]

I used them on a rental house, and at my wife's dog grooming shop. No problems at all, and I know how to solder. Especially in confined spaces, the sharkbite fittings are worth the cost.

 

[kenmac]

If you cut the pipe and install a coupler you can drop the end enough to get the water out.

Have you ever used the bread in the pipe trick to absorb the water so, you can solder on a fitting,etc ?

 

[EddieWalker]

I don't like the bread trick. It always seems too plug up the faucets when I'm done. I've found that blowing into the pipe and letting it come out again will get rid of the water, or if that doesn't work, I put a hose into to the pipe and siphon it out.

As for gator type fittings, I will use them for quick patches or to cap a line for a short period of time, but will not use them for any other reason. While any fitting has the potential to fail, I'm not comfortable with putting my name on a job done with them. What really scares me is the fittings used on PEX to slide everything together that are made out of plastic. They might last for awhile, but like all things plastic, the more moving parts you have on it, the more likely it will fail.

Eddie

 

[kenmac]

I've not had any return calls for stopped up fixtures using bread. I always remove the screens and run water to clear out any debris on any repair job. The bread is usually dissolved by the water.I don't use the plastic pex fittings ( when using pex) I use the barbrd brass fittings and crimp rings

 

[CurlyDave]

I've not had any return calls for stopped up fixtures using bread. I always remove the screens and run water to clear out any debris on any repair job. The bread is usually dissolved by the water.I don't use the plastic pex fittings ( when using pex) I use the barbrd brass fittings and crimp rings

The early brass PEX fittings had serious corrosion problems. I think it was due to using the wrong grade or type of brass, but the fittings sometimes failed very early. There were lawsuits.

I like the plastic fittings because they will not corrode. I use an expansion tool for the PEX fittings, which I think is much more reliable than a crimp ring. Essentially, if you get the expanded PEX and PEX outer ring on the fitting, nothing can go wrong. If you use a crimp ring, the tool must be periodically calibrated, and if it is found to be out of calibration there is always a question of how many bad joints did it make?

 

[TomSeller]

Old school here. Only copper in my house. If I were a professional, I would need to consider the best option, including speed of installation.

 

[newbury]

Old school here. Only copper in my house. If I were a professional, I would need to consider the best option, including speed of installation.

Nah, old school is lead pipe.

 

[TomSeller]

Nah, old school is lead pipe.

Lol. Self limiting owner pool.