Proper way to bind tractor onto trailer?

RonR · Dec 19, 2005

Farms,

Your post reminds me of my youthful days when I worked for an ag mfg company. There were about 20 of us that hauled and tested new products all over the county. We were mostly young and stupid!

One guy was hauling in Colorado, and was pulled over for speeding. Had he kept his mouth shut, he would have gotten a small fine for speeding, paid it, and been on his way. Instead, he challenged the CHP, asking how long it had been since his radar gun had been calibrated and how did he know it was used appropriately?

Well, TWO HOURS later of Officer Friendly walking around the truck, inspecting all the safety gear, and then discovering that the guy's load was TWO INCHES wider than legal--and the driver didn't have the proper permits--the rig was impounded until the fines were paid and the appropriate permits were obtained.

It's not nice to mess with the guys carrying the guns!

ron

Farmwithjunk · Dec 19, 2005

It pays to read an ENTIRE post before jumping to conclusions. The first paragraph led me to believe you thought I was saying something STUPID......

GEE, THANKS A LOT GUY!

(You've obviously been talking with my wife........)

Then I read the SECOND paragraph.

Yeah, It's best to humor them. A badge, a gun, and a citation book makes them ALWAYS RIGHT in my eyes. I don't recall ANYONE ever winning an arguement with a cop. If you do have a challenge to their authority, it's best to take that before a judge, and that's only after careful consideration.

keeney · Dec 19, 2005

I am not sure what happened to my previous posting...

I was trying to get to the bottom of why grade 70 is such a big deal compared to other grades of chain, and the conclusion I came to in terms of actual safety is that there is nothing magical about grade 70 chains. They are just made from a stronger (60% more breaking force) alloy of steel. You still need to use the correct size and number of tie-downs appropriate to the weight of the load and the WLL's involved.

The conclusiion in terms of what the numerous various jurisdictions say or think the law is is much less clear.

I totally agree that in terms of the hassle factor on the side of the road, what matters is the opinion of the enforcement officer. He decides about any possible citations that may be written. Once issued, they would be a mega-hassle to fight later in court where you could actually present such technical arguments.

For the record, I am a firm believer in overkill when it comes to securing loads. The chains and hardware I use are working load rated for 6600 lbs each and my tractor itself only weighs 2500 lbs or so.

- Rick

keeney · Dec 19, 2005

I found some more information concerning the difference between grade 70 and grade 43 chains.

The WLL on grade 70 appears to be set at 1/4th the minimum breaking force. On Grade 43, the WLL is calculated as 1/3rd the minimum breaking force. So with a grade 70, you get more reserve strength (compared to the working limit) in an overload situation (such as an unexpected dynamic shock load).

I was unaware of this subtle difference in determining WLL, so my previous statement about the strength of grade 70 was slightly inaccurate (now edited). The grade 70 chain is about 60% stronger in terms of ultimate breaking strength than the same size grade 43 even though the WLL rating is only 22% higher.

This significant difference in ultimate breaking strength does explain why the grade-70 is going to be safer in general practice: Its WLL is de-rated more relative to its actual strength leaving a larger margin for overload prior to breaking.

You can achieve this same safety margin using grade 43 simply by staying under 3/4ths of its published WLL. For example, a 3/8" grade 43 with a rated WLL of 5400 lbs can be used with a higher 4x safety margin by keeping the working load under 4050 lbs.

- Rick

RonR · Dec 19, 2005

Farm,

I would never imply or suggest that anyone on this site is stupid.

I was only referring to me, as you learned. And no, I don't know your wife either. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

G'day!
ron

Highbeam · Dec 19, 2005

Oooooh, your post was deleted. By who? and why? maybe we'll never know. Too bad as it was very comprehensive.

Looks like you've been censored. How does it feel.

I always thought that the MBS meant minimum breaking stress, and anywhere I've seen it called out also uses a disclaimer saying not to use it for sizing or design.

"You can achieve this same safety margin using grade 43 simply by staying under 3/4ths of its published WLL. For example, a 3/8" grade 43 with a rated WLL of 5400 lbs can be used with the higher 4x safety margin by keeping the working load under 4050 lbs."

Good info with actual numerical backup.

ronjhall · Dec 19, 2005

I am not sure what happened to my previous posting... 
If you did not get a notification of your post being deleted. Yours was probably deleted when someone else's post that you replied to was removed. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif You have to watch who you hangout with. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

MadDog · Dec 19, 2005

All of this very useful dialogue raises another question. What are the pros and cons of lever vs. ratchet load binders? Does it make any safety difference assuming binders are rated at least equal to the chain used (grade 70, obviously)? If not, what about convenience/ease of use?

escavader · Dec 19, 2005

WOULDNT GRADE 43 BE BETTER,BECAUSE IT WILL STRETCH AS THE TRAILER FLEXS? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif...just kidding.I knew the other nite when i saw this thread come up it was gonna start a war...this topic always does.
I have bx-23[close to 3000lbs with my loaded tires]and i wrecked a set of brand new expensive straps on her maiden voyage.ripped the stichen right apart.NEXT RUN I HAD 4 CHAINS AND BINDERS Try FURNISH EQUIPMENTCO for the binders on the internet.
ALAN

Farmwithjunk · Dec 19, 2005

( Farm,

I would never imply or suggest that anyone on this site is stupid.

I was only referring to me, as you learned. And no, I don't know your wife either. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

G'day!
ron )

I know you weren't trying to insinuate anything. I guess I aughtta be a little less sarcastic, or at the very least, anounce my sarcasm when we're dealing with such a volitile subject.

There's a few things that get most tractor fanatics cranked up. Type of chains/tie-downs used, Fluid/cast iron weights, hydrostatic vs. gear, color of paint, bush hog vs. brush hog vs. rotary cutter vs. shredder. Maybe we should consider these "The politics of tractoring".

kevincook · Dec 19, 2005

I saw a 10 wheel dump truck pulling a trailer with an excavator on it. I would estimate the excavator was somewhere between 15k and 20k pounds, probably closer to 15k. It did have a dozer blade mounted....I had never seen an excavator this large with a blade before.

He had a chain run OVER the top of the dozer blade on one end and then had a ratchet binder on each side on the back end. The binders connected from the side of the trailer to the inside edge of the track. Yes, the binder was simply hooked onto the track. There was a third chain that ran through a chain hook on the boom and down to each side of the trailer with a binder on each side.

I don't know much but this looked like an accident waiting to happen to me.

Be Safe,
Kevin

QRTRHRS · Dec 19, 2005

( All of this very useful dialogue raises another question. What are the pros and cons of lever vs. ratchet load binders? Does it make any safety difference assuming binders are rated at least equal to the chain used (grade 70, obviously)? If not, what about convenience/ease of use?

)I have used the lever style much more than the ratchets. The levers are faster to work with and will take a tremendous amount of abuse for really heavy applications. You hook one end, open it and hook the other. You can quickly see if you have the right link. They will bite you if you are not careful releasing the tension or if you slip while levering it tight.

Sometimes the lever seems to be too loose or too tight. That calls for a piece of pipe for added leverage so that it works on the tighter link. Be very careful working with a pipe on a lever style binder.

The ratchets take a few seconds of cranking to tighten or release enough to hook or unhook. Just like tightening up a bolt with a socket, you can get just the amount of tension you desire. They won't bite you either.

The levers are easier to store and take less room. A comparable ratchet costs just a bit more than a lever.

keeney · Dec 19, 2005

Technically, adding a pipe on the handle on a lever-action binder can be a no-no (for tightening). Some of the literature I found on tie-down chains indicated that it is possible to generate forces that will exceed the WLL of the chains even using just hand pressure on the binder. Exceeding the WLL of the chain is even easier to do with a pipe on the lever handle.

When securing a tractor with tires, the tires would just compress a little long before you get to such forces, but for a solid, inflexible object, it may matter.

- Rick

keeney · Dec 20, 2005

In regards to: "[MBS / MBF] ... I've seen it called out also uses a disclaimer saying not to use it for sizing or design."

That is correct, you should always use the rated WLL as the design limit for the application of the tie-down so as to leave a margin of safety and to acocmodate some deterioration with use (rusting, abrasion, friction wear, abuse, UV damage to nylon webbing, etc.).

Another interesting specificaiton on chain is the Proof load that the manufacturer claims they actually test the stuff at (or test a random sample at). This will be somewhere between the WLL and the MBF. You want your proof test load to stay in the elastic portion of the yield curve so as not to be destructively testing the product by stretching it.

- Rick

RonR · Dec 20, 2005

QRTRHRS,

I originally purchased a rachet binder after buying my BX2200, to go with the Grade 70 chains and trailer. I thought I would like it, but I did not. I consider it to be the same "safety wise" as the over center binder.

Here's what I found in using it, and it was generally in tighter quarters as my trailer is smaller:

Load Tractor
Attach chains
Insert rachet binder & tighten
Loosen rachet binder when it ran out of threads, due to slack in chain.
Tighten rachet binder

After doing this drill several times, I went back to the OLD overcenter binder I had with the previous tractor.

For me, much faster & easier. Since my tractor is small, I don't consider using a cheater pipe on the binder, but then again, I'm a big strong guy. If my wife or daughter were loading/hauling, they'd go with the rachet for sure.

My two cents.

ron

MadDog · Dec 20, 2005

Thanks, Ortrhrs, Keeney and Ronr for educating me about load binders. I'm not exactly an Arnold Schwartzenegger, but I think I could handle a lever load binder and it doesn't sound like it makes much difference when securing a tractor.

hudr · Dec 20, 2005

I grew up in the Flat bed freight business. Dad has been an Owner/operator for my whole life. I don't remember ever chaining down a load that we DIDN'T use a "cheater" on the lever binders. How ever many chains you used on a load, you bound every other one to the opposite side of the trailer. you puled it down by hand first to get the slack out, then used the cheater to get that last notch. I never heard any stories about a chain breaking. And the chain we still use around the ranch is the mostly the same chain he started out with in the late 50's trucking.
But yes, when we hauled rubber tired vehicles, we always liked to see the tires "squish" a little when we bound them. One thing a lot of people don't think to do is get the "twist" out of their chains when they tighten them. I have seen chains loosen up some as the twist comes out of them after binding. not trying to agitate, just my .02

QRTRHRS · Dec 20, 2005

You don't have to use a "cheater" bar to crank down like there is no tomorrow. As I suggested though, if you need that little bit extra, a piece of pipe sure makes it easy.

As hudr suggested, a "cheater" is pretty much a standard for heavy hauling. I only mean to let people know the options with the reminder to keep safety in mind. My bigger tractor calls for some 800 foot pounds of torque on some of the wheel bolts. Try that without some help.

I never, repeat never, touch a chain, binder or strap without decent leather gloves on by the way. I have blackened and lost some fingernails but I still have all my digits.

hudr · Dec 20, 2005

Yes, the cheater is mainly a fatigue (work smarter, not harder) thing. The extra leverage is helpful when you have several chains to bind and then are expected to drive that load somewhere far away. I didn't mean to suggest to bind it tight, then get a longer pipe to bind some more. Everything has a breaking point.
And as QRTRHRS stated: the gloves would be a given what with all the pinch, bang and mash points involved in working with lots of metal that has been put in a bind. They can cause you to brush up on your sailor speak. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Also, some rubber bungees are usefull for putting some pressure on the lever to keep them from bouncing loose.